The popular weedkiller has also been found in 80% of Americans’ urine, according to a 2022 study by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.
There is not going to be any rational discussion in this thread.
The article is far too shit. There is nothing there. No evidence. No nothing. It’s just anger bait.
I can add a lot of (correct) information here, but I will just piss people off.
Let’s be better.
I thought salon was better than this, but I guess we can’t escape enshitification.
If it helps, I can rationally discuss glyphosate. Plant geneticist here.
You called it. It’s just went downhill as I scrolled.
It’s just so hard to resist. Everything is wrong. It’s like it’s designed to make everyone angry.
Well… That drives engagement.
I don’t know why you thought salon would be better. I was literally about to say they’re the liberal equivalant of Fox but I just looked it up and even Fox is actually ranked higher on factual reporting than Salon. A closer comparison would be that they’re the liberal equivalent of Breitbart.
Detectable is not the same thing as being found at a level known to be harmful. The concentration of things matters.
“it’s totally fine that you were all exposed to cyanide, it’s nowhere near toxic levels! You’re overreacting.” - Some guy working for the people who exposed everyone to syanideI urge all the people somehow disagreeing with the spirit of this statement to go ahead and drink some cyanide.
You realize tons of regularly consumed foods have cyanide in them, right?
Do you have any idea how many people have detectable levels of DHMO in their systems?
What the hell is a DHMO?
Dihydrogen monoxide
It’s a horrible deadly substance and kills around 320k people globally from over exposure. And it can be found in almost every food in America. It’s a travesty that we haven’t banned it yet.
With it ban O2 I heard that shit comes from plants and the toxic ones. Why poison the air we breath?
Not much, you?
There is not a single substance in existence that cannot kill you at high enough doses. There is a small amount of methanol in fruit juice. Cyanide in the pits and seeds of many fruits, red kidney beans contain lectin and must be cooked to reduce the concentration of that substance until they no longer cause sickness. Vitamin A in small doses is necessary for health but high doses can straight up kill you. Table salt (Sodium content) is also necessary but high doses can raise the risk of high blood pressure, heart attack and stroke. Fluoride strengthens enamel in small doses but causes a debilitating bone disease that results in bone deformities at high doses. “The dose makes the poison” is a common saying because it is true. I know people want to be able to categorize substances into toxins and not toxins but thats not how the real world works. The real world is complicated.
You’re producing and exhaling cyanide right now, you buffoon.
Your body literally produces cyanide all the time, it’s just really good at metabolizing it quickly before it builds up to a harmful concentration… so yeah, great example.
I hope you know just standing in sunlight exposes you to radiation
Sunlight is in fact a very, very common cause of cancer.
Never mind that enough foods with “safe” levels of glyphosate contamination combine to form carcinogenic Voltron.
that’s… not how this works.
(thankfully)
It was vectron, and you all only started talking about it when I was out sick last Thursday afternoon.
I am really curious who those hard defenders of Glyphosate are - are you guys Farmers?
No, I’m a chemist. Does that count?
Wouldn’t you need to be a biologist of some sort to have any ability to weigh in on the effects on human health?
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Can we stop spreading this bullshit anti-glyphosate propaganda? educate yourselves
You wanna know what else has been linked to cancer, and with actual good evidence for it? Hot water. source
Go touch grass and worry about the things you should really worry about, like the fact your food system is set up for collapse with 2 decades and you’d better hope big Ag comes up with something brilliant cuz otherwise you’re in the shit unless you’re at least partially self-sufficient.
Liar.
Their own documents proved that RoundUp causes cancers. Review them for yourself.
What you think they paid out $10,000,000,000.00 in settlements because of something you have figured out, but they can’t prove at trial?
No, it’s that their shit causes cancer and they knew it and sold it anyway without a warning.
https://www.wisnerbaum.com/documents/monsanto-documents-chart-101217.pdf
The lawsuits are not about glyphosate, they are about RoundUp™.
I’m not a liar, you just have a very simplistic view of things.
They knew glyphosate (aka RoundUp) causes cancer and did not disclose it. This likely led to some severe exposure cases and thus they had to pay out (although I strongly believe prison sentences should also have been part of it). This is just as terrible as if I sad sold you lye and never told you it is corrosive, thus endangering you.
None of this means you cannot use lye for making pretzels/ uncloging your sink. For those uses it is safe. Same for Glyphosate.
I’d clarify I’m not Bayer fanboy - genetic modification for the sale of a herbicide is a poor use of modern genetic technology. But I cannot deny the measurable climate benefits of using it (in terms of CO2 emissions and soil degradation) source
That’s two different things. The second point is very interesting.
First, Monsanto’s own documents say there is no safe level of glyphosate. The mechanism of action is antibiotic and genotoxicity. It was patented as an antibiotic. Small amounts kill gut bacteria, for example. You’re oversimplifying and underestimating the safety of any amount of glyphosate and NNG, a contaminate inherent to all glyphosate.
Second, no doubt the overall benefit to agribusiness is massive, but to humanity as a whole, who can say? What might have been developed if not this? Even with this, people are still starving to death and the planet is overheating. I agree everything requires a balance of risks and benefits. The allies would have lost WWII without asbestos. The manipulations of science and failures to follow the science because of “company product objectives” is inexcusable. No corporations should have such influence over science and medicine.
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other things in the probably carcinogenic category: coffee & working the night shift.
the difference is, those things are on the list with good reason.
I mean, Round-up is absolutely dangerous and unhealthy. It’s a fucking terrible idea to get a cubic meter tank and mix glyphosate by submerging your arms up to the shoulder to stir the product till it’s diluted. You really shouldn’t start your day with a tall glass of it, nor should you rub it in your eyes.
It’s very hard to say if it actually causes cancer, since the type it reportedly causes it causes by about a million things, among them, almost every pesticide and herbicide from the generations before round-up (and potentially after, but we don’t know yet). Since it commonly manifests in older people, it’s very hard to tell if a random farmer got it from round-up, another pesticide, or just bad luck.
What we DO know is that plants grown with round-up have no effect on consumers, and when used properly, has less severe effects than alternatives.
But if you’re in the habit of mixing roundup with your bare hands, and spraying it in shorts and flip flops, you should probably stop doing that.
F’real. I’d like to know what alternate timeline has more deaths: the one where, going forward, we continue our modern farming practices as-is; the other, we ban them and revert to only organic farming.
I’d bet cancer deaths per calorie of food produced would be roughly the same…organic farming being both less efficient and not a guarantee in itself that pesticides/herbicides are safer for humans. And l, being less efficient, I’d wager we’d hit famine simply by not having enough good farming land to meet dietary needs.
And who is getting cancer? Mostly farmers that are too lazy/proud to don PPE, and migrant workers who aren’t provided it. In either case it takes a lot of intentional, repeated, unprotected direct exposure. Joe Public isn’t gonna get cancer spraying his poison ivy or even his tomato’s.
While i think that link is more correct, it is hard to take it serious when they call it a pesticide.
Pesticide is a pretty standard generic word (at least in British English) covering insecticides, herbicides, fungicides.
In murican, at least in my area, pesticide is used exclusively to refer to something that kills animals like an insectiside or vermin poison. We would just use herbicide when talking about a weed killer.
It is a pesticide?
No, it is a herbicide. Those are very different things and no farmer would ever mess this up.
Herbicide is a subset of pesticides where the pests are herbs. You’re thinking of insecticide where the pest is an insect. Pesticide is the broad term that encompasses both insecticides and herbicides.
Herbicides, fungicides, and insecticides are all pesticides used in agriculture.
A. I’m not a farmer, I’m a scientist. B. All herbicides are pesticides… look it up. It’s like how all horses are mammals but not all mammals are horses
Why don’t you drink a nice Pint of Roundup on this guy?
Right after you drink a pint of long-trusted household products, like lye or ammonia
Bring me pure glyphosate and I will mix it and drink it. But round-up has a whole lot of surfactants will which will fuck up your esophagus, lungs and stomach. So will dishwashing liquid though, and I bet you use that all the time on things you eat from.
Did you focus group that hot water line?
Wait, is this your focus group? If so, it sucks.
Do you wanna present an actual argument or just whine because reality doesn’t suit you?
No I want to ridicule you for saying ridiculous shit. You are ridiculous.
Edit: keep the downvotes rolling clown 🤡🤡🤡
Ok so no real argument, just whining. Lucky you, having been told to believe all the right stuff while others were told wrong.
Can we stop spreading this bullshit anti-tobacco propaganda? educate yourselves
You wanna know what else has been linked to cancer, and with actual good evidence for it? Hot water🙄
🤡🤡🤡🤡
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if you don’t like a post, that’s what the downvote is for. this ain’t some paid moderator board. volunteering?
Noooo, it is totally safe - Monsanto/Bayer said so in the studies they paid for! It’s so safe that the EU wants to allow it for at least another ten years.
Actually their own studies proved RoundUp causes cancers that’s why they paid out $10,000,000,000.00 in lawsuits brought by cancer patients and their families. The proof used against them in court is their own records.
They refused to repeat them and organize campaigns to discredit and defund anyone doing work in the field that is not sanctioned and controlled by Monsanto. They have ghost written and funded a lot of research saying glyphosate is safe. They can’t say RoundUp is safe because they know it’s not.
They paid most settlements because they were negligent in their use instructions. That lead to people dunking into barrels to mix roundup, and spraying it while getting soaked through their shirts and shorts.
While I absolutely agree that companies need to create proper instructions, the fact that swimming in a chemical is dangerous doesn’t mean it’s dangerous for consumers to eat vegetables that it was used on.
Well it wasn’t that they were swimming in it obviously, but they were aerosolizing massive amounts and blasting it into the air from giant sprayers.
The two worst ways to get glyphosate into your blood is from absorption by the skin and by the lungs. That’s what happened and still happens. Significant bioaccumulation causes non Hodgkin’s Lymphoma.
That doesn’t mean exposure to any amount is safe.
I’m not a scientist but the mechanism as I understand it, via NNG response and genotoxicity, can cause individual cells to die or mutate, and is theorized even to cause behavioral changes. That’s why RoundUp’s own documents say there is no safe level.
For example, glyphosate was originally patented as an antibiotic. It certainly kills off gut bacteria, the effects of which is not well understood. Again though, the lawsuits are about the specific formula RoundUp™ including it’s specific blend of surfactants and adjuvants, which apparently make it much easier for human blood and other cells to absorb.
That’s one half of the case. The other half is that to the extent there is research suggesting small amounts of glyphosate and Roundup are safe, that research is tainted by a deliberate and massive effort by Monsanto to manipulate the science. And I’ve shared links to the primary source documents, with descriptions, from the litigation.
The incestuous relationship between chemical companies and chemical regulators is well know. This case goes beyond that. Monsanto spent hundreds of millions of dollars over decades on infiltrating, disrupting, defunding, and discrediting anyone working on this science from a disinterested public health standpoint, as well as on filling the science industry “chatter” with disinformation, ghostwritten research, fraudulent research, and outright lies.
This is chemical companies getting smarter and learning from their mistakes with asbestos, and not in a good way (from a public health standpoint). People wonder what will be the “next asbestos.” Bet that whatever it is we are already exposed to it daily and the science is being deliberately manipulated.
