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Give me one real world example of where it isn’t used to oppress the working class
China, 1959-1961. Checkmate liberal
almost two whole years! that’s almost 328 years more than capitalism!!
let’s see what happens now.
China, 1961-2023. Checkmate Communist
It’s always weird to me that people associate Dictatorial Command Economies with Communism. On one hand they like to label themselves as communist but on the other hand y’all really gotta learn to read between the lines. It’s like saying socialism has failed buecase the Nazi’s had socialism in their name.
This is just the No True Scotsman argument. Every communist nation has always insisted that the dictatorship is a necessary transitional state so that true communism could be achieved, and been run by parties espousing the need to achieve that communism. Those dictatorships have never truly moved towards that.
Either communism is impossible or communism is dictatorship. You can pick either one, but there’s not another option.
Negative, the Nazis came for trade unionists first. Quite the opposite of what a socialist party would do.
While the bolshevists coopted the unions and turned them into agents of the Party, corrupting them from representative bodies into people spying on the working class for disloyalty
Buddy, I’m an Anarchist, I don’t praise the Bolshevists. I have my critiques of them too but I’m not gonna sit here and say the Nazis were Socialists because they have “socialist” in their name. “Baby oil” doesn’t actually have babies in it.
Then I can’t argue against you, because it’s impossible to argue against hypothetical utopianism.
I couldn’t disagree more. How about we stop trying to run dictatorships all together? No one says we need to flip a light switch and suddenly make the world communist. But there are plenty of communist ideals we can try on under democratic systems. Really easy ones that come to mind are forcing companies to give all employees ownership and/or profit sharing. The world isn’t black and white and history isn’t an example of every possible path forward
Mandating profit sharing doesn’t mean communism
Are you deliberately being dense? I’m talking about keeping within the spirit of the thing as a goal to strive toward
Okay? So what does that actually mean?
Oh, you’re a communist? Name every communism.
If you want a list of currently ongoing socialist and anarchist communities with de facto territorial sovereignty, the list goes
Rojava
The Zapatistas
If you want a list of all past socialist territories, the list is too long but the highlights are South Yemen and Anarchosyndicalist Catalonia
3 examoles i could give for socialism two of them where crushed by the Soviet Union. Revolutionary Spain and the free territory of Ukraine. One which works since 10 years (while trying not to get crushed by Turkey and IS) and there are some more such free territories which therefore also democratized thier economics. Also fuck tankies btw
Left is the intended outcome, right is what actually happened.
So,what is socialism then?
Communism is to a co-op what socialism is to a guild of freelancers.
Socialism has the government control the main industrial output but you’re free to do and own your own stuff outside of that. Ideally the government controlled sector’s profits would be used to benefit the people again (free healthcare, etc)
Oddly the CCP (Chinese Communist Party) is the best modern example of socialism.
Cool, I’ll take socialism over comunism
The transition between capitalism and communism.?
Where’s the part about calling for blanket genocide of people based on locality at birth?
Liberals: What if we tried the communism, but without the dictatorship phase?
Marxist-Leninist: Look, we both known I’m just here for the fan service.
Haha did I say liberals? I meant Jacobin. And the literal fucking Internationale. Y’all don’t even realize how out of touch you are.
Out of all the times communism has been attempted, please point me to an example of a stable communist nation which promotes freedom for the working class.
Communism aims to establish a classless (no rich or poor), stateless (no military, police or any other tool of class oppression), and moneyless (no currency of any type). No country has ever achieved that. Therefore, communism has never been attempted, let alone implemented.
Yes, yes, there are no true Scotsmen
Pardon me?
