President Joe Biden’s administration is urging Ukraine to quickly increase the size of its military by drafting more troops and revamping its mobilization laws to allow for the conscription of troops as young as 18.
Russian civilians are being conscripted. As are prisoners. As are North Koreans. As are Houthis. What would your solution be, just let those armies take over Ukraine?
The Russians are at their doorstep with guns. You can’t just sit there saying “I don’t have a fight with you” and expect them to peacefully leave. They’ve already shot your neighbours. The choice is not yours. You either fight or you die.
How do you not understand that Russia has invaded their country and is murdering them and stealing their land?
If someone broke into your house and was about to shoot you and your teenage daughter and wife were in the other room would you be like “yeah I don’t believe in violence”? What good would that do?
Yes the state you were born in is your family and you must defend them like your daughter.
The political body that happened to be in control by force of the territory where your parents fucked owns your soul and can send you to your death when you have barely finished puberty and aren’t even done developing your brain.
The arbitrary social construct of “the state” is a higher form of power that not only can (in the ability sense) but morally must order children to die to defend itself.
Anyone trying to take their family and leave the warzone is a criminal and must be killed. That land must be defended, those politicians have graciously let you live for too long.
You go fight and die in Ukraine, if enough of you did they wouldn’t be sending their kids. You go and do it, I’ll pay for your plane ticket.
The choice isn’t yours when there’s a draft. If it’s so noble to die defending your state (not people, state) then it should be no problem getting enough volunteers.
Forcing people to fight for their government is wrong. Maybe some are ok with surrender over risking their life, maybe some are staunch pacifists, maybe some feel their lives won’t change very much under new leadership and would prefer to live.
Sending teens into a bloodbath by force isn’t good no matter how you try to spin it. Yes the alternative might be losing, but that is their choice.
You should go fight, they’re accepting foreign volunteers. You go do what you’re asking these children to do. It’s the right thing, isn’t it?
Same bullshit Kremlin copy pasta. Russia is the only country to blame for their imperialistic war, where they are murdering Ukrainians and stealing their land.
They didn’t say Russia wasn’t to blame, or that what Russia is doing is justified. They said - and I happen to agree - that conscription is always wrong. No one should, under any circumstance, be compelled by force to fight and die for their state or for any other reason. The choice to risk one’s own life for a cause - even a cause of defense - is your choice alone.
Should young Ukrainians volunteer to defend their independence? Probably, but that’s up to them, or at least it should be.
there’s no room for this kind of nuance in this community, it’s a bunch of what I can only describe as rabid liberals.
oh I must be a Trump supporting Russia man for saying that.
It’s funny how they’re all choosing to ignore that they can go fight in Ukraine right now. I wonder why they aren’t?
It’s ok to order 18 year olds to do it for them though because “that’s what’s right.”
Yeah, easy for them to say.
I wonder where they’ll draw the line. By the same arguments we should be drafting women and children old enough to hold a gun.
They should all fight and die for their country shouldn’t they? Everyone owes their life to the arbitrary governing body of the region they were born in. They own you and should be able to send you to your death. How liberal.
You think it’s not absolutely obvious to all of us that no one should be conscripted to fight if they don’t want to? Genocidal Russia decided that wasn’t an option. Save your grief for them.
You haven’t answered why you aren’t going to go fight
Maybe we’ll meet on the battlefield ;)
Hey by the way did you hear Hamas forces people to stay in unsafe parts of Gaza as human shields. It’s so evil when the government forces civilians into danger when they could be escaping.
I’m not talking about Hamas. I’m talking about you parroting Russian propaganda and how you think it’s cute to trivialize Russia’s imperialistic war in Ukraine. Where Vladimir Putin and the Russians that support him decide it’s okay to murder civilians to steal their land. That’s who you are aligning yourself with.
EDIT:
I’m not going to bother. You believe that all it takes is for everyone in the world to reject war, with no viable plan instead of hand waiving “education will fix things”. Wishful thinking at best, forced indoctrination at worst.
No shit there would be no war if everyone was against war.
Tell you what, you manifest your dream with the Russians first to get the invading forces to be against war and I’ll take you seriously. Until then, the real world will go on, with or without you.
No it’s not easier than everyone making the right decision for anything else, but it is the right decision.
I’m going to propose something.
The most idealistic, “right” decision, done in the wrong context, is the wrong decision.
For example, let’s say all of Ukraine rejects war. They no longer resist Russia.
Did we save the world? No. That is appeasement, and that didn’t work out to well with Hitler.
Again. Prove the worth and viability of your ideas by encouraging the ones throwing the punches to reign it in first, before applying such lofty and naive ideals to those trying to defend themselves.
How do you propose we achieve that solution, then? We do not live in a post-scarcity world, so there will always be someone who wants what their neighbor has.
Everyone hear that? There is no such thing as a rare Earth metal. They just made that stuff up. You can find rhodium anywhere. Just pick up a rock- rhodium.
Russian civilians are being conscripted. As are prisoners. As are North Koreans. As are Houthis. What would your solution be, just let those armies take over Ukraine?
The solution is for everyone to reject war.
Making excuses to kill like in Ukraine is not any more just than any other excuse to kill.
If we want the US to stay in control of the world then it’s necessary to fight Russia, but it’s not necessary for amy of them to die
The Russians are at their doorstep with guns. You can’t just sit there saying “I don’t have a fight with you” and expect them to peacefully leave. They’ve already shot your neighbours. The choice is not yours. You either fight or you die.
Ok lol you go enlist then if you’re so comitted.
In fact if you support a draft we should force you to enlist against your will
Same old bullshit copy pasta from the Kremlin.
How do you not understand that Russia has invaded their country and is murdering them and stealing their land?
If someone broke into your house and was about to shoot you and your teenage daughter and wife were in the other room would you be like “yeah I don’t believe in violence”? What good would that do?
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Yes the state you were born in is your family and you must defend them like your daughter.
The political body that happened to be in control by force of the territory where your parents fucked owns your soul and can send you to your death when you have barely finished puberty and aren’t even done developing your brain.
The arbitrary social construct of “the state” is a higher form of power that not only can (in the ability sense) but morally must order children to die to defend itself.
Anyone trying to take their family and leave the warzone is a criminal and must be killed. That land must be defended, those politicians have graciously let you live for too long.
You go fight and die in Ukraine, if enough of you did they wouldn’t be sending their kids. You go and do it, I’ll pay for your plane ticket.
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Yet you completely gloss over, and apparently approve of, Russian war crimes.
I’m pretty sure they wouldn’t want someone in my state of health, but I’ll take the free plane ticket just in case. Shall I send you my details?
The choice isn’t yours when there’s a draft. If it’s so noble to die defending your state (not people, state) then it should be no problem getting enough volunteers.
Forcing people to fight for their government is wrong. Maybe some are ok with surrender over risking their life, maybe some are staunch pacifists, maybe some feel their lives won’t change very much under new leadership and would prefer to live.
Sending teens into a bloodbath by force isn’t good no matter how you try to spin it. Yes the alternative might be losing, but that is their choice.
You should go fight, they’re accepting foreign volunteers. You go do what you’re asking these children to do. It’s the right thing, isn’t it?
Same bullshit Kremlin copy pasta. Russia is the only country to blame for their imperialistic war, where they are murdering Ukrainians and stealing their land.
Do you support Russia?
They didn’t say Russia wasn’t to blame, or that what Russia is doing is justified. They said - and I happen to agree - that conscription is always wrong. No one should, under any circumstance, be compelled by force to fight and die for their state or for any other reason. The choice to risk one’s own life for a cause - even a cause of defense - is your choice alone.
Should young Ukrainians volunteer to defend their independence? Probably, but that’s up to them, or at least it should be.
there’s no room for this kind of nuance in this community, it’s a bunch of what I can only describe as rabid liberals.
oh I must be a Trump supporting Russia man for saying that.
It’s funny how they’re all choosing to ignore that they can go fight in Ukraine right now. I wonder why they aren’t?
It’s ok to order 18 year olds to do it for them though because “that’s what’s right.”
Yeah, easy for them to say.
I wonder where they’ll draw the line. By the same arguments we should be drafting women and children old enough to hold a gun.
They should all fight and die for their country shouldn’t they? Everyone owes their life to the arbitrary governing body of the region they were born in. They own you and should be able to send you to your death. How liberal.
You think it’s not absolutely obvious to all of us that no one should be conscripted to fight if they don’t want to? Genocidal Russia decided that wasn’t an option. Save your grief for them.
Yes everyone you don’t like is a Russian agent.
You haven’t answered why you aren’t going to go fight
Maybe we’ll meet on the battlefield ;)
Hey by the way did you hear Hamas forces people to stay in unsafe parts of Gaza as human shields. It’s so evil when the government forces civilians into danger when they could be escaping.
I’m not talking about Hamas. I’m talking about you parroting Russian propaganda and how you think it’s cute to trivialize Russia’s imperialistic war in Ukraine. Where Vladimir Putin and the Russians that support him decide it’s okay to murder civilians to steal their land. That’s who you are aligning yourself with.
Then go fight. Where’s your answer to that?
Go die instead of some kid. Anti-imperialists used to have balls. Go fight.
I’m fighting propaganda like what you spread.
Do you feel good supporting Russia?
Aw shucks, is that all it takes? How’d we overlook that?? We’ll get cracking on that right away.
In the meanwhile it makes sense for a country being invaded to do whatever it can for self preservation, especially in a defensive manner.
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EDIT: I’m not going to bother. You believe that all it takes is for everyone in the world to reject war, with no viable plan instead of hand waiving “education will fix things”. Wishful thinking at best, forced indoctrination at worst.
No shit there would be no war if everyone was against war.
Tell you what, you manifest your dream with the Russians first to get the invading forces to be against war and I’ll take you seriously. Until then, the real world will go on, with or without you.
Yes the solution is to reject war.
No it’s not easier than everyone making the right decision for anything else, but it is the right decision.
You shouldn’t make excuses for people to kill each other, it’s the reason it keeps happening in a post scarcity world
I’m going to propose something.
The most idealistic, “right” decision, done in the wrong context, is the wrong decision.
For example, let’s say all of Ukraine rejects war. They no longer resist Russia.
Did we save the world? No. That is appeasement, and that didn’t work out to well with Hitler.
Again. Prove the worth and viability of your ideas by encouraging the ones throwing the punches to reign it in first, before applying such lofty and naive ideals to those trying to defend themselves.
Yeah everyone knows you can just appeal to warmongering fascists.
/S
Sounds less easy then everyone rejecting war.
But you can’t have “everyone” reject war without including warmongering fascists in the category of “everyone”.
Seeing as you acknowledge how difficult that is, are we on the same page about how unrealistic your original solution is?
How exactly do you propose we get everyone to reject war?
Because Ukrainians in general didn’t want the war to begin with.
education is what makes people not fall for dumb war propaganda
“Dumb war propaganda”
You do realize Russia made the decision to invade the land of Ukrainian people, right?
What do you think happens if Ukraine doesn’t fight back?
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Congratulations, you won the Miss Universe title with winning phrase “I want the peace in the world”.
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How do you propose we achieve that solution, then? We do not live in a post-scarcity world, so there will always be someone who wants what their neighbor has.
We do live in a post scarcity world. All scarcity is artificial.
Welcome to reality.
That being said education is what makes people not fall for dumb war propaganda
Everyone hear that? There is no such thing as a rare Earth metal. They just made that stuff up. You can find rhodium anywhere. Just pick up a rock- rhodium.
They don’t want you to know this but the ducks at the park are free, you can just take them. I have like 20 ducks in my basement.
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