(Disclaimer: So first I wanted to emphasize and acknowledge that this can be a sensitive and emotional topic. This question is solely because I’m curious and am trying to understand it from an educational/sociological perspective. I know that a lot of people online can have a short temper but this is not a bait, I just genuinely wanna understand. I hope I will find a few more intellectual people here who won’t get offended and can give a more empirical answer. And please apologize if my English is not perfect, English is not my native language and I’m just 21.)

So as a German I’m very close and familiar with the horrible actions that humanity committed in the past. I’d say compared to America who enslaved people based on their skin color Germany was way worse by mass executing and enslaving people based on their ethnicity/religion.

But there is one big difference that I don’t understand: Here in Germany we are extensively educated about what happened in the 3rd Reich. It’s a big part about our education to learn and understand what horrible things happened and why they happened to make sure this never happens again. This kinda lead to the point where many Germans are deeply ashamed just for being a German (even though they’re quite far detached from what happened) and this is also a reason why you won’t find many German flags hanging here.

So I’m not much aware about Americas education on their slavery but I experienced extensive racism and misunderstanding from Americans about race to the point where many (of course not all but many) Americans make a big deal out of race as if it defines their core personality and seem to overly obsess to the point where it seems people get different opportunities and are still to this day getting treated unfairly based on their skin. Even though every educated person knows that skin color is not changing someone’s personality since we’re biologically all the same race called homo sapiens sapiens and what people call “race” is not scientifically accurate but rather a social construct. This seems to go further where people still use racial slurs that have been used for slaves (like the so called n-word) and people overly focusing on skin color like saying they don’t wanna be friends with white/black people or don’t wanna date them. And it almost seems like it’s getting worse in a way and was somewhat better maybe around the 80’s.

As a German this feels very weird and wrong to many of us (I talked to many Germans about this who feel similar including Germans who lived in America for a while). Because the equivalence would be if we still continued to make a big thing out of whether someone is a Jude or not which we don’t. Whether someone is a Jew or how black or white someone is, really isn’t a thing at all here. Of course I’m totally aware that there are still many racist people and even neo Nazis in Germany (but also in the US and every part of the world) but the general way of thinking about “race” in everyday life seems to be very different.

Because to me this stereotype that people solely have low cognitive abilities based on their skin color is very outdated. We all have different skin, there are no lines, humans are colorful and not “black or white”. I wonder if there have been strong efforts of American politics and society to get rid of these stereotypes and gain equality for everyone. Because I wonder what the reasons are why this seems like not being the case (at least to the extent it should be) and it seems unnecessarily divisive. Since to me educating about these stereotypes and not putting people into boxes is the key for getting rid of it when there is a mass willingness of people wanting to see each as people and not just as a color and finally put this behind. Might there maybe be industrial or political interests in keeping this divisiveness?

Like I said I’m very open minded and am trying to understand. Please have understandment for my perspective and try to be thoughtful in your answer.

In the end of the day I would just wish for whole humanity that we could put those toxic and destructive actions to the past and start embrace loving everyone for who they are as an individual.

    • magnetosphere
      link
      fedilink
      1322 hours ago

      Totally unhelpful. You’re talking to an individual who is trying to understand human behavior, not someone who’s personally responsible for their country’s actions.

      • qevlarr
        link
        English
        5
        edit-2
        21 hours ago

        What better example than from a culture with which they’re intimately familiar? Attitudes like this can be hard to change, even after generations of intense education campaigns. As a German should recognize this from their own experience

        The German way they have “dealt with” their fascist legacy isn’t perfect either. They should also unlearn some of that. The tone of the original question is “we beat racism, why can’t you”, making “no you haven’t” absolutely relevant to understanding the problem

        • @[email protected]
          link
          fedilink
          English
          021 hours ago

          The German way they have “dealt with” their fascist legacy isn’t perfect either.

          It is far from perfect. The biggest problem is, that at some point the civilians had lost interest in continuing the denazification(idk if that’s the right word/translation). This led to pardoning war criminals and stopping the prosecution of criminals. Later I can make a more detailed explanation about this since I wrote an assignment (partially) about this, but have to search for it and translate it first.

      • sunzu2
        link
        fedilink
        -720 hours ago

        Here in Germany we are extensively educated about what happened in the 3rd Reich.

        Yes🤡

    • @Senshi
      link
      English
      -1022 hours ago

      Nice of you to provide such a prime example of lack of education. Equating current events in Palestine and Israel with the actual Holocaust is absurd. I’m pretty certain Israel has not industrialized genocide at the level Nazi Germany did, and I’d be very surprised if Israel was exclusively killing Jews. Because those are two fundamental elements of the term Holocaust.

      Stop diffusing the meaning of words with very specific meaning like Holocaust.

      Also, great job of providing nothing to the actual topic at hand and derailing it with whataboutisms.

        • @Senshi
          link
          English
          1
          edit-2
          10 hours ago

          I’m aware, and I don’t think I claimed that? The by far largest number of victims were Jews, though.

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        English
        821 hours ago

        The word holocaust has a meaning before The Holocaust. Calling other things a holocaust is not diffusing anything, it’s just using the meaning of the word. Whether the Palestinian genocide can be called a holocaust is arguable, but you’re allowed to call other things holocausts.

        • @Senshi
          link
          English
          110 hours ago

          When anyone talks about Holocaust these days, it’s reasonable to assume they talk about the one vs the Jews by Nazi Germany. It has gained a special meaning unlike the more generic word genocide, which is perfectly fine for other use cases. The Holocaust was a genocide, not every genocide is a Holocaust.

          If you want to go semantic/etymological, calling the current Palestine genocide a Holocaust still makes no sense, as the old Greek holocaust literally means “full incineration”, burning sth so nothing is left. Which makes sense in association with Nazi crematoriums, and its historic use for large fire catastrophes such as whole cities burning down.

          It also made - semantically - sense for Neonazis in Germany who called the fire-bombings of German cities by the Allied in WW2 holocausts as well. This also tries to form a link and somehow equate two entirely different things. Both atrocities by modern standards, sure, but at vastly different levels.

          (Mis-)appropriating terms to undermine and diffuse their meaning is a simple and effective populist tactic, which is why it’s popular with extremists.

          Call a genocide a genocide, call the Holocaust the Holocaust.

          The world is full of nuance, not just radicals and extremes.

          • @[email protected]
            link
            fedilink
            English
            17 hours ago

            Yes, that’s why I saw it’s arguable if the Palestinians are suffering a holocaust, because it should mean death by fire, but the Jews also died by various means.

        • sunzu2
          link
          fedilink
          220 hours ago

          Whether the Palestinian genocide can be called a holocaust is arguable

          So far since all of that evidence is sitting under the rubble that nobody will ever has access to.

          Remember that we only know what Germany did in detial because Germans got beat into submission by several other countries and they could not cover it up properly.

          • @[email protected]
            link
            fedilink
            English
            419 hours ago

            I meant more in the semantical sense. There’s no denying the level of destruction and killing.