As a fellow omnivore trying to eat more vegan/vegetarian recipes, I think rainbow plant life on YouTube has the best recipes that I’ve tried. If you’ve read Salt Fat Acid Heat, most/all of her recipes are based on that technique/ideology. Her red lentil curry is really good and I make a double batch about once every other month to keep in the freezer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BHRyfEbhFFU
I live with people that don’t like coconut milk so I just use a mixture of heavy cream and milk. I also sub half of the red lentils for brown lentils for extra fiber.
Thank you very much for the hint, I checked out the red lentil curry video and it does look quite delicious. Chicken curry is actually my favorite food and I tried green, brown and red lentil curry before, but didn’t quite like them, even though I’m half asian, lol. I’ll try her recipe, though.
Tofu is pretty versatile as a meat replacement or even just a general texture thing. I like to fry small tofu cubes and use them in place of the cheese in palak paneer, or instead of chicken in something like General Tso’s. It takes a bit more work since you have to press the tofu and find a good way to cook it so it doesn’t turn out soggy (and it’s usually more expensive), but I’m a meat eater and it’s satisfying to me.
Beyond/Impossible Meat is also pretty good imo. I actually tend to like it better than real beef, but that’s definitely not a majority opinion. If you like the taste, you can crumble the patties for ground beef texture or break them into chunks for more of a meatball vibe. I’ve even done a sort of faux bulgogi with chunks and gochujang sauce that works surprisingly well.
One more thing I think can help is to not try to replicate meat for everything. There are ways to make vegetarian/vegan food that let it stand on its own and still be satisfying (beans and chickpeas can help a ton), without it feeling like it’s trying too hard to be meat. Things like cauliflower stir fried or batter fried and coated in some sort of sauce can be good just as cauliflower in sauce.
Finally, mushrooms, if you like them. Soaking dried mushrooms will get you stock that can replace chicken or beef stock for most things, and frying even the cheap baby bella mushrooms that come pre washed and sliced can give you a meaty texture in something that needs it.
We eat tofu every now and then and like it a lot and I did already try out some meat “substitutes” and some of them are actually pretty good, but not cost-effective. I’m not saying I have to look at every cent I spend, but things have gotten harder in recent years, not gonna lie.
I don’t need or want to replicate meat everywhere. I’m totally fine with non-meat dishes, but my complaint is that many of them don’t taste as good as people (especially vegans) claim, even in restaurants. It’s been quite disappointing multiple times to try that “really, really delicious curry”, that in the end didn’t really taste that great and it’s been a recurring thing for me / us when trying to eat more plant-based foods. This is also true with cauliflower, for instance. I like it in “traditional” meals as side-dish, but no, to me, batter frying cauliflower doesn’t make it good.
Mushrooms are a staple in our cooking, because I really like my umami flavor (I also use MSG a lot), but unfortunately, my daughter doesn’t like any type of mushroom. I guess, it’s the texture. Tried several different things and she always puts them away.
Anyway, thank you for your comment. Beyond meat has been on our “try out list” for quite some time.
Honestly I think the important thing is to just try alternatives. You don’t have to end up liking them or completely replacing meat if it’s not practical, just try to find ways to add more vegetables.
That’s what I’m doing. I like to eat “traditional” salads and stuff like that, but I grew up with them being side dishes most of the time and I think, it’s hard to break habits.
From a moral standpoint, I’d like to go vegetarian or even vegan at some point, but this requires me to find things that I’ll actually like to eat on a regular basis. Often times, when I search for vegan recipes, something often throws me off. Be it the flavor, the texture, the strength of the flavor or lack thereof, etc. Maybe it’s just that I’m not used to it or that animal fats are carrying so much flavor that I’m now kinda addicted to it? I know, it sounds really stupid, but when I go to the grocery store, I often gravitate towards animal products automatically.
My first goal will be to reduce meat intake to one, maybe two times a week.
Try out Indian cuisine, we got a ton of great vegetarian food here but depending on where you are, getting all the good spices needed could be quite difficult and pricey.
Soy Curls is honestly my favorite ‘meat replacement’ (though, I’m not too hot on ‘replacing meat’). They work for doing things like mongolian beef, or just lightly frying after marinading for ‘chicken strips’ to top salads or sandwiches. https://thevietvegan.com/vegan-mongolian-beef/
Soups are of course, pretty easy. I like Lentil Chilli, heavy on the seasonings and beans aside from lentils. Minestrone or lemon orzo are both also great. Thai curry or pho are both more work imo, but amazing (though, both broth bases can often have chicken or shrimp in them).
Burgers, and while impossible meat et. al. are fine I guess, they’re a bit pricey. I honestly prefer a good chipotle black bean burger over them 9/10 times. They’re pretty cheap to buy, but also not very hard to make, with most of the ingredients being cheap.
I personally like seitan, but I know quite a few other vegetarians don’t, so it might be divisive. BUT, in terms of cheap protein, its damn near rock bottom in price. It is some work to make stuff out of it from scratch, but ‘indian mock duck’ is usually seitan, and can be bought from indian stores if you just want to try it. But seitan works to replace burgers, chicken tenders, steaks, sausage, etc. Tons of recipes out there.
You need to try a lot “plant-based meat” products. Many of them are meh and taste like meat flavored cardboard, but I’ve personally found some that taste waaaay better than meat.
I would advice, apart from tying out new recipes, try to look at how you cook rice, make a green salad and tomato based sauce again. Often there are a few basic things one can improve that elevate all other dishes as well. This doesn’t have to be expensive, you save a lot of money by not buying the meat, after all.
(A few of these things you will probably know, but perhaps you learn something new.)
For rice try the following:
most children prefer basmati rice and rice with tumeric
cumin also tastes good in rice but not all kids like it
most types of rice have to be rinsed a few times, a good job for kids lol
when you let the rice soak in water (~30 min) after rinsing it, you get more predictable results
when you want to fry the rice, use rice you cooked the day before
try different rice varieties from different brands because they all tend to need a different amount of water for best results
when your family really becomes rice fans invest in a good rice cooker because it saves time and older kids can make their own
after cooking, let it steam for a few minutes on the turned-off stove
For a good tomato sauce try the following:
diced or crushed tomatoes in cans often have low quality, when using cans use whole peeled tomatoes and cut them when still in the can
do not crush garlic, instead chop it very fine
use a really good oil, it has to taste so good, you would eat it with bread with nothing else
oil is a whole beast, try different types and be careful which of those can be heated to which temperature
some finely chopped celery often tastes good in tomato sauce
heat very slowly and don’t make it boil, don’t cook too long
add sugar to taste, baking soda if it is too acidic
add herbs only when the sauce is finished, perhaps add oil again
some people think tomato sauce tastes better the next day
Some tips to make your salad better:
the oil hint from above
for vinegar all the hints for oils apply
mix something crunchy into your salad, many kids love sunflower seeds or peanuts, which are less expensive than walnuts and similar
when you want roasted sunflower seeds, buy them raw and roast them shortly without oil in the pan until you can smell them
wheat grains roasted taste great, they smell amazing as well
top your salad with something hot, for example caramelized pear slices or seasoned tofu cubes, marinated fried champignons, etc.
get a salad spinner if you don’t have one already
some children like vegetables raw they do not eat cooked, for example fine broccoli florets and zucchini slices
good mustard or lemon juice on the side
General tips for vegan and vegetarian recipes:
a good rule when it has to go fast is: combine grain + green + bean
experiment a lot with combinations of textures
grating vegetables adds lots of moisture, can be good or bad…
roast whole spices without oil until their smells hit you before you cut them and put them into your dishes
make your own vegetable broth by freezing clean vegetable scraps (skins and ends) and simmer them when you have a bag full
maple syrup + non-dairy milk mixed make a crust on baked goods
infuse oil yourself with herbs, chilli, garlic
learn to sauté a base of spices, garlic and onions before adding your ingredient
learn how to make natto, get used to the taste and then addicted to it
now that you are a pro with herbs, make your own fresh tea and experience a new world of taste
Ingredients which you perhaps never used before but are very useful:
Honestly. I’m looking for vegan and vegetarian recipes and while it usually tastes “fine”, it’s mostly just “meh”.
If it’s about eating ethically, I highly suggest trying to eat locally instead. It’s much better for the environment, and you can usually get a better nutritional balance.
I mean, if eating “meh” makes you feel good, go for it. Just please make sure to study all the supplements you need and keep researching because there are regularly discoveries that might change the supplement intake you require.
Transport is a teensy tiny part of the climate/environmental impact for food. In 99.9% of cases, a plant-based food will beat out any meat from next door.
That being said, local in the sense things that actually grow locally and are in season is still a good idea, though more from a community building perspective.
For context, ALL manure CO2 emissions is only 2.6 gigatons (full disclosure. I lost and re-found this link, and see another source estimates manure closer to 7B. I’m sure you know my thoughts on that. Food Transport is still of dominant significance and fertilizer impact cannot be that effectively reduced). And in many cases, that manure is less harmful to the environment, yes EVEN CO2 impact, than the other fertilizer options that replace it when used in crop farms.
There’s a strong argument for “less meat” being good for the environment, but I am convinced (in part from hands-on experience) that the only arguments for “no meat” being any good are entirely fabricated.
I don’t agree with Hannah, in this case. Specifically, I challenge anyone who leaves cow methane on a chart or in an argument without covering the CO2 production by non-manure fertilizer or the fact that only depopulation will stop cows from pooping. And unfortunately, a plethora of studies are showing that synethetic fertilizer production creates massive amounts of methane gas as well. I’m fairly convinced she is (perhaps inadvertantly) including that under “cow farm” when it should be under “plant farm”.
She also just handwaves saying transport costs are low despite studies she opted not to cite or rebut that place them at 20%. But here’s the funny part. That was the first link. The second agrees with the 20% figure for logistics (though she uses the term “Supply Chain” and separates physical transport from processing, packaging, and retail storage (all of which are cut out or down from local). Digging into supply chain figures in the left article’s graph, she just disagrees with herself (and, to be honest, other experts).
In fact, the numbers on her second article suggest bias to me in her first article. She blames land use for 1/3 of beef GHG production. But in the second article, only 2/3 of Land Use GHG goes to animal, with the other 1/3 going to “land use for human food”. I’m sure you can see the next line. If Land Use is such a large part of meat GHG production and crops are so good at everything else, then Land Use should be dominant and in-your-face on the crop chart in the first article. Instead, apparently she’s undecided about that?
Look. I can see why you might decide that eating less meat might be the wrong choice for you. But when there are studies that say eating local is important and studies saying eating less meat is important, one article is not going to get me to change my entire life, and risk the environment, just to feel good about myself.
or the fact that only depopulation will stop cows from pooping.
Yes. We kill 80 billions mammals and trillion fish each year and billions are lost to diseases, fire and low profitability. If the whole word would decide to not abuse animals farmers would gas or burn the animals. Once, and not the perpetual killing all meat eaters have no problem with, but the fantasy scenario where we stop killing is a problem?
So you’re an anti-natalist? I try to avoid arguing with anti-natalist vegans because as morally disgusted as I am of their position, there is no way to convince them to change it.
No, I am not. But people who care about animals claiming veganism would kill animals are concern trolls. Support the perpetual killing and raping - or - care about animals.
And unfortunately, a plethora of studies are showing that synethetic fertilizer production creates massive amounts of methane gas as we
Obviously, not only from the the Haber-Bosch process which is the most energy intensive single process worldwide, it is used for Ammoniak, nitrogen.
The mining of phosphor leaves huge wastelands and will be rare in about 100 hundred years if we continue.
But manure is not created from thin air. You need to feed animals a lot feed until you get something to eat back. It wastes 20 times more crop compared to plant based diet. Manure will not save us, it destroys nature, water and air.
The IPCC 2022 states even giving up every form of fossile fuel animal industry would push us over 3° increase.
I do not eat any animal products, but the main reason for it that I do not want to kill others if I can avoid it. I don’t want you to import any fancy exotic food for a plant based diet. I don’t, I get my potatoes from my neighbor and mostly buy local foods anyway. Don’t act like you can’t eat local plants and are therefore forced to eat others.
But manure is not created from thin air. You need to feed animals a lot feed until you get something to eat back. It wastes 20 times more crop compared to plant based diet. Manure will not save us, it destroys nature, water and air.
What exactly do you think we should plan to do with all the grass and waste product currently being used in feeding animals? There’s a complex web of dependency between plant and animal farming that I have seen firsthand, and all I ever hear is that cutting half that web off entirely will magically “Just word” and be better than what we have no. Most importantly, I’m convinced I eat carbon neutral even with eat, or at least as close to that as reasonably possible. And I’ve never seen a plan to scale to a world where meat eating is ended, and the massive inefficiencies that would introduce.
The IPCC 2022 states even giving up every form of fossile fuel animal industry would push us over 3° increase.
This is not preciately how I took it. Instead, I took it as more “we need to do everything we can, and the whole world going vegan is more likely than the other major sources”. Ultimately, we would already be in a good place if 7 businesses became carbon neutral. IPCC 2022 cited a LOWER number than most do for methane, only 14% of world methane, only 1/3 of human caused methane. The one or two “experts” I found who specifically pushed for sudden international veganism have also failed to account for the above issues I mentioned. I argue it’s easier to find technologies that can mitigate and reverse emissions than it is to find technologies to let the world cut out meat entirely.
I do not eat any animal products, but the main reason for it that I do not want to kill others if I can avoid it.
Which is absolutely your right. I have become convinced that my mixed diet leads to ultimately less death than a plant-based diet would (trolley problem), but it is not the foundation of my mixed-diet choice. I’m not an anti-natalist, and I’m perfectly fine with the quality of life a typical farm cow lives when compared to a cow in the wild when the alternative is to not be born at all. I know plenty of people who suffer in their lives more than a farm animal will, and yet never once think those people should never have been born.
don’t want you to import any fancy exotic food for a plant based diet. I don’t, I get my potatoes from my neighbor and mostly buy local foods anyway. Don’t act like you can’t eat local plants and are therefore forced to eat others.
Huh? I DO eat local plants. I have a farm down the road and buy almost all the produce we don’t grow there. When we do have to buy from retail establishments, we buy 99% of our produce locally. Yes, about once a year I buy a dragonfruit because it’s a guilty pleasure. So sue me.
But I also get eggs from my neighbor, and occasionally chicken. We have a deer overpopulation problem in my area. When I can, I pick up locally hunted deer from the butcher. My wife has PTSD and it triggers her regarding hunting, so I don’t hunt my own despite the fact she and I are morally on the same page as that. I support that because I consider it ethically better than being vegan because I believe pulling the lever on the trolley is always the right choice, and because I am convinced “what we have is ethical because it is better than the real world alternatives”. There is no trolley track without any bodies on it, in this world.
What exactly do you think we should plan to do with all the grass and waste product currently being used in feeding animals?
Currently 75% of the product grown is for animal food. Grass fed is less than 10% even in the USA, and all give extra feed. Grass produces way more methane in ruminants compared to starch based feed like soy for which the rain forest is burned down.
and the massive inefficiencies that would introduce.
You know you need massive amounts of feed to others before you can kill them for your pleasure? We could feed 10 billion people with the product we grow right now. Instead we feed it other animals.
I argue it’s easier to find technologies that can mitigate and reverse emissions than it is to find technologies to let the world cut out meat entirely.
Which is absolutely your right. I have become convinced that my mixed diet leads to ultimately less death than a plant-based diet would
Explain that. A plant based diet uses less resources in every way. You don’t think there are no animals killed for animal feed which is just a bad conversion of food, do you?
We all have a impact on the environment and on others, but acting worse than we have to because of a nirvana fallacy is not acceptable. While our impact on the future is hard to measure it is today when we decide to support killing and abuse or not.
Sorry, I’m trying. Honestly. I’m looking for vegan and vegetarian recipes and while it usually tastes “fine”, it’s mostly just “meh”.
I don’t get the hype for things like lentils or quinoa either. Both are “meh” at best.
So far, I’m unable to find meat-free recipes that truly satisfy me.
And no, I’m not a bad cook.
Tell me your reasonably priced vegan and vegetarian recipes that little children will eat, too. Serious request.
As a fellow omnivore trying to eat more vegan/vegetarian recipes, I think rainbow plant life on YouTube has the best recipes that I’ve tried. If you’ve read Salt Fat Acid Heat, most/all of her recipes are based on that technique/ideology. Her red lentil curry is really good and I make a double batch about once every other month to keep in the freezer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BHRyfEbhFFU
I live with people that don’t like coconut milk so I just use a mixture of heavy cream and milk. I also sub half of the red lentils for brown lentils for extra fiber.
Thank you very much for the hint, I checked out the red lentil curry video and it does look quite delicious. Chicken curry is actually my favorite food and I tried green, brown and red lentil curry before, but didn’t quite like them, even though I’m half asian, lol. I’ll try her recipe, though.
I personally love coconut milk.
Here is an alternative Piped link(s): https://piped.video/watch?v=BHRyfEbhFFU
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source, check me out at GitHub.
Tofu is pretty versatile as a meat replacement or even just a general texture thing. I like to fry small tofu cubes and use them in place of the cheese in palak paneer, or instead of chicken in something like General Tso’s. It takes a bit more work since you have to press the tofu and find a good way to cook it so it doesn’t turn out soggy (and it’s usually more expensive), but I’m a meat eater and it’s satisfying to me.
Beyond/Impossible Meat is also pretty good imo. I actually tend to like it better than real beef, but that’s definitely not a majority opinion. If you like the taste, you can crumble the patties for ground beef texture or break them into chunks for more of a meatball vibe. I’ve even done a sort of faux bulgogi with chunks and gochujang sauce that works surprisingly well.
One more thing I think can help is to not try to replicate meat for everything. There are ways to make vegetarian/vegan food that let it stand on its own and still be satisfying (beans and chickpeas can help a ton), without it feeling like it’s trying too hard to be meat. Things like cauliflower stir fried or batter fried and coated in some sort of sauce can be good just as cauliflower in sauce.
Finally, mushrooms, if you like them. Soaking dried mushrooms will get you stock that can replace chicken or beef stock for most things, and frying even the cheap baby bella mushrooms that come pre washed and sliced can give you a meaty texture in something that needs it.
We eat tofu every now and then and like it a lot and I did already try out some meat “substitutes” and some of them are actually pretty good, but not cost-effective. I’m not saying I have to look at every cent I spend, but things have gotten harder in recent years, not gonna lie.
I don’t need or want to replicate meat everywhere. I’m totally fine with non-meat dishes, but my complaint is that many of them don’t taste as good as people (especially vegans) claim, even in restaurants. It’s been quite disappointing multiple times to try that “really, really delicious curry”, that in the end didn’t really taste that great and it’s been a recurring thing for me / us when trying to eat more plant-based foods. This is also true with cauliflower, for instance. I like it in “traditional” meals as side-dish, but no, to me, batter frying cauliflower doesn’t make it good.
Mushrooms are a staple in our cooking, because I really like my umami flavor (I also use MSG a lot), but unfortunately, my daughter doesn’t like any type of mushroom. I guess, it’s the texture. Tried several different things and she always puts them away.
Anyway, thank you for your comment. Beyond meat has been on our “try out list” for quite some time.
Honestly I think the important thing is to just try alternatives. You don’t have to end up liking them or completely replacing meat if it’s not practical, just try to find ways to add more vegetables.
That’s what I’m doing. I like to eat “traditional” salads and stuff like that, but I grew up with them being side dishes most of the time and I think, it’s hard to break habits.
From a moral standpoint, I’d like to go vegetarian or even vegan at some point, but this requires me to find things that I’ll actually like to eat on a regular basis. Often times, when I search for vegan recipes, something often throws me off. Be it the flavor, the texture, the strength of the flavor or lack thereof, etc. Maybe it’s just that I’m not used to it or that animal fats are carrying so much flavor that I’m now kinda addicted to it? I know, it sounds really stupid, but when I go to the grocery store, I often gravitate towards animal products automatically.
My first goal will be to reduce meat intake to one, maybe two times a week.
Try out Indian cuisine, we got a ton of great vegetarian food here but depending on where you are, getting all the good spices needed could be quite difficult and pricey.
Sticky tofu is hands down my favorite. Something like this: https://veganonboard.com/sticky-lemon-tofu/
Soy Curls is honestly my favorite ‘meat replacement’ (though, I’m not too hot on ‘replacing meat’). They work for doing things like mongolian beef, or just lightly frying after marinading for ‘chicken strips’ to top salads or sandwiches. https://thevietvegan.com/vegan-mongolian-beef/
Soups are of course, pretty easy. I like Lentil Chilli, heavy on the seasonings and beans aside from lentils. Minestrone or lemon orzo are both also great. Thai curry or pho are both more work imo, but amazing (though, both broth bases can often have chicken or shrimp in them).
Burgers, and while impossible meat et. al. are fine I guess, they’re a bit pricey. I honestly prefer a good chipotle black bean burger over them 9/10 times. They’re pretty cheap to buy, but also not very hard to make, with most of the ingredients being cheap.
I personally like seitan, but I know quite a few other vegetarians don’t, so it might be divisive. BUT, in terms of cheap protein, its damn near rock bottom in price. It is some work to make stuff out of it from scratch, but ‘indian mock duck’ is usually seitan, and can be bought from indian stores if you just want to try it. But seitan works to replace burgers, chicken tenders, steaks, sausage, etc. Tons of recipes out there.
Thank you very much for all your suggestions. In fact, I even plan to do my first seitan batch today. I’ll follow this video and see how it goes.
I’ll save all your guys suggestions and try them out, thanks again!
You need to try a lot “plant-based meat” products. Many of them are meh and taste like meat flavored cardboard, but I’ve personally found some that taste waaaay better than meat.
Sloppy joe made with lentils is an easy dinner for a night and kids love a sloppy joe
Seems to be pretty american. I’m from Germany and never had that.
Ok, this is going to be long!
I would advice, apart from tying out new recipes, try to look at how you cook rice, make a green salad and tomato based sauce again. Often there are a few basic things one can improve that elevate all other dishes as well. This doesn’t have to be expensive, you save a lot of money by not buying the meat, after all.
(A few of these things you will probably know, but perhaps you learn something new.)
For rice try the following:
For a good tomato sauce try the following:
Some tips to make your salad better:
General tips for vegan and vegetarian recipes:
Ingredients which you perhaps never used before but are very useful:
If it’s about eating ethically, I highly suggest trying to eat locally instead. It’s much better for the environment, and you can usually get a better nutritional balance.
I mean, if eating “meh” makes you feel good, go for it. Just please make sure to study all the supplements you need and keep researching because there are regularly discoveries that might change the supplement intake you require.
Transport is a teensy tiny part of the climate/environmental impact for food. In 99.9% of cases, a plant-based food will beat out any meat from next door.
That being said, local in the sense things that actually grow locally and are in season is still a good idea, though more from a community building perspective.
Food Transport is estimated to be as high as 3 gigatons tons of CO2 emissions per year, a full 20% of all food-related CO2 emissions. From my point of view (not considering all animal-related CO2 emissions as a single line-item), that makes transport the single largest cause of CO2 related impact in the entirety of agriculture/horticulture.
For context, ALL manure CO2 emissions is only 2.6 gigatons (full disclosure. I lost and re-found this link, and see another source estimates manure closer to 7B. I’m sure you know my thoughts on that. Food Transport is still of dominant significance and fertilizer impact cannot be that effectively reduced). And in many cases, that manure is less harmful to the environment, yes EVEN CO2 impact, than the other fertilizer options that replace it when used in crop farms.
There’s a strong argument for “less meat” being good for the environment, but I am convinced (in part from hands-on experience) that the only arguments for “no meat” being any good are entirely fabricated.
https://ourworldindata.org/food-choice-vs-eating-local
https://ourworldindata.org/food-ghg-emissions
I don’t agree with Hannah, in this case. Specifically, I challenge anyone who leaves cow methane on a chart or in an argument without covering the CO2 production by non-manure fertilizer or the fact that only depopulation will stop cows from pooping. And unfortunately, a plethora of studies are showing that synethetic fertilizer production creates massive amounts of methane gas as well. I’m fairly convinced she is (perhaps inadvertantly) including that under “cow farm” when it should be under “plant farm”.
She also just handwaves saying transport costs are low despite studies she opted not to cite or rebut that place them at 20%. But here’s the funny part. That was the first link. The second agrees with the 20% figure for logistics (though she uses the term “Supply Chain” and separates physical transport from processing, packaging, and retail storage (all of which are cut out or down from local). Digging into supply chain figures in the left article’s graph, she just disagrees with herself (and, to be honest, other experts).
In fact, the numbers on her second article suggest bias to me in her first article. She blames land use for 1/3 of beef GHG production. But in the second article, only 2/3 of Land Use GHG goes to animal, with the other 1/3 going to “land use for human food”. I’m sure you can see the next line. If Land Use is such a large part of meat GHG production and crops are so good at everything else, then Land Use should be dominant and in-your-face on the crop chart in the first article. Instead, apparently she’s undecided about that?
Look. I can see why you might decide that eating less meat might be the wrong choice for you. But when there are studies that say eating local is important and studies saying eating less meat is important, one article is not going to get me to change my entire life, and risk the environment, just to feel good about myself.
Yes. We kill 80 billions mammals and trillion fish each year and billions are lost to diseases, fire and low profitability. If the whole word would decide to not abuse animals farmers would gas or burn the animals. Once, and not the perpetual killing all meat eaters have no problem with, but the fantasy scenario where we stop killing is a problem?
So you’re an anti-natalist? I try to avoid arguing with anti-natalist vegans because as morally disgusted as I am of their position, there is no way to convince them to change it.
No, I am not. But people who care about animals claiming veganism would kill animals are concern trolls. Support the perpetual killing and raping - or - care about animals.
Obviously, not only from the the Haber-Bosch process which is the most energy intensive single process worldwide, it is used for Ammoniak, nitrogen.
The mining of phosphor leaves huge wastelands and will be rare in about 100 hundred years if we continue.
But manure is not created from thin air. You need to feed animals a lot feed until you get something to eat back. It wastes 20 times more crop compared to plant based diet. Manure will not save us, it destroys nature, water and air.
The IPCC 2022 states even giving up every form of fossile fuel animal industry would push us over 3° increase.
I do not eat any animal products, but the main reason for it that I do not want to kill others if I can avoid it. I don’t want you to import any fancy exotic food for a plant based diet. I don’t, I get my potatoes from my neighbor and mostly buy local foods anyway. Don’t act like you can’t eat local plants and are therefore forced to eat others.
What exactly do you think we should plan to do with all the grass and waste product currently being used in feeding animals? There’s a complex web of dependency between plant and animal farming that I have seen firsthand, and all I ever hear is that cutting half that web off entirely will magically “Just word” and be better than what we have no. Most importantly, I’m convinced I eat carbon neutral even with eat, or at least as close to that as reasonably possible. And I’ve never seen a plan to scale to a world where meat eating is ended, and the massive inefficiencies that would introduce.
This is not preciately how I took it. Instead, I took it as more “we need to do everything we can, and the whole world going vegan is more likely than the other major sources”. Ultimately, we would already be in a good place if 7 businesses became carbon neutral. IPCC 2022 cited a LOWER number than most do for methane, only 14% of world methane, only 1/3 of human caused methane. The one or two “experts” I found who specifically pushed for sudden international veganism have also failed to account for the above issues I mentioned. I argue it’s easier to find technologies that can mitigate and reverse emissions than it is to find technologies to let the world cut out meat entirely.
Which is absolutely your right. I have become convinced that my mixed diet leads to ultimately less death than a plant-based diet would (trolley problem), but it is not the foundation of my mixed-diet choice. I’m not an anti-natalist, and I’m perfectly fine with the quality of life a typical farm cow lives when compared to a cow in the wild when the alternative is to not be born at all. I know plenty of people who suffer in their lives more than a farm animal will, and yet never once think those people should never have been born.
Huh? I DO eat local plants. I have a farm down the road and buy almost all the produce we don’t grow there. When we do have to buy from retail establishments, we buy 99% of our produce locally. Yes, about once a year I buy a dragonfruit because it’s a guilty pleasure. So sue me.
But I also get eggs from my neighbor, and occasionally chicken. We have a deer overpopulation problem in my area. When I can, I pick up locally hunted deer from the butcher. My wife has PTSD and it triggers her regarding hunting, so I don’t hunt my own despite the fact she and I are morally on the same page as that. I support that because I consider it ethically better than being vegan because I believe pulling the lever on the trolley is always the right choice, and because I am convinced “what we have is ethical because it is better than the real world alternatives”. There is no trolley track without any bodies on it, in this world.
https://www.thedailybeast.com/kids-found-working-graveyard-shifts-on-meat-plant-kill-floors-for-packers-sanitation-services-feds-say
https://www.wdam.com/2023/07/17/16-year-old-dies-accident-mar-jac-poultry-plant/
https://www.bbc.com/news/stories-50986683
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28506017/
https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2016/08/11/489468205/working-the-chain-slaughterhouse-workers-face-lifelong-injuries
You don’t have to see non human animals as living beeings, even it you think they are just things, you could care about the humans involved.
My neighbor had pigs until the gases fucked up his lungs now he has to roll with O2
Currently 75% of the product grown is for animal food. Grass fed is less than 10% even in the USA, and all give extra feed. Grass produces way more methane in ruminants compared to starch based feed like soy for which the rain forest is burned down.
You know you need massive amounts of feed to others before you can kill them for your pleasure? We could feed 10 billion people with the product we grow right now. Instead we feed it other animals.
Others know it is not possible and act according: https://www.euronews.com/green/2022/01/31/china-includes-cultivated-meat-in-its-plan-for-the-future-of-food
https://www.iatp.org/ipcc-report-reveals-urgency-methane-reduction-need-reduce-industrial-agriculture
Explain that. A plant based diet uses less resources in every way. You don’t think there are no animals killed for animal feed which is just a bad conversion of food, do you?
We all have a impact on the environment and on others, but acting worse than we have to because of a nirvana fallacy is not acceptable. While our impact on the future is hard to measure it is today when we decide to support killing and abuse or not.
Sorry, trying? Don’t let someone else tell you what to eat. You should not feel bad for eating meat as it is livestock raised to be consumed.
Hmm. I make the decision myself, nobody is forcing me. I have moral concerns, I care about the environment and I also have health concerns, too.
I’m not sure if I’ll ever be vegetarian or vegan (I’d like to). For now, my goal is to reduce meat intake to one or maybe two times a week.