No, we’re having a simple disagreement over whether this was a major reason why the game failed commercially or not. You’re the one who’s making this complicated.
My argument wasn’t that messaging was the sole reason for failure, but that it was a major factor—one that contributed to the game feeling like a product with priorities misaligned from what players actually wanted. Saying there were “many reasons” doesn’t refute that.
Insisting that the game having a message is the most major reason the game failed doesn’t refute any of what I said either. We’re still having a disagreement, nothing more. You’ve not proven your claim either.
Your claim that messaging wasn’t even in the “top 100” is still unsupported. Listing industry-wide problems like oversaturation and rising prices is fine, but none of that explains why The Veilguard failed specifically. Plenty of games thrive under these conditions. The difference? They connect with their audience. DAV didn’t.
OK, so you continue to be the one who’s making the extraordinary claim here, that DAV specifically failed because the game didn’t connect with the message, and that it was specifically because it was the message.
There are still plenty of reasons why a game wouldn’t connect with the audience, as I said. You’ve not exactly proven why and how this was the definitive reason. That’s the claim that needs to be proven, yet you’ve not done that.
Whether or not you’re acknowledging it or not, you’re acting as if as you think the game having a message is the sole reason why the game failed commercially. You acknowledge that it was a “major” reason, but then, above, you’re also specifically saying that industry-wide problems aren’t affecting the game’s situation at all. Why? Why isn’t the industry downturn affecting this game specifically? Why can’t we explain this game’s failure in large part with the incompetence and greed of major publishers?
Dragon Age has established magic that lets people change their gender at will. If that exists, then the idea of medical transition (and scars from it) doesn’t naturally fit within the world.
You didn’t answer my question. I didn’t ask if it “naturally” fits the world. I asked if it was established that this is what is actually happening in the lore.
Because you’re still projecting your own assumptions on how the world should work on the work. You’re not criticising the game’s writing on its own merits. You’re complaining that the game writers didn’t write the game the way you wanted. In other words, this is still the “my historical accuracy in my fantasy game” argument.
Besides, there’s plenty of reason why, in a fantasy setting, you could have trans/nb characters who don’t get to use polymorph magic. Cost. Class gap. Haves and have-nots. The class divide is a pretty common topic that is often explored in fantasy literature and people being denied this kind of magic treatment, for whatever reason, is a valid catalyst for a story. It’d make an excellent fantasy plotline. But that’s not relevant to DA specifically.
You’re asking me to prove that the game’s messaging and story issues were a major reason for its failure, but you’re not holding yourself to the same standard. You claim that industry-wide issues like oversaturation, pricing, and publisher greed were the real reasons, yet you’ve provided no evidence that these factors impacted The Veilguard more than any other game.
The backlash against DAV wasn’t primarily about price, oversaturation, or competition. The loudest complaints were about the game’s tone, character writing, and perceived prioritization of messaging over deep storytelling. If industry trends were the dominant factor, we’d expect similar pushback against every game in this space—not just DAV.
The Dragon Age series once had strong audience trust, but that eroded over time, largely due to shifting priorities in writing and design. The skepticism around DAV didn’t just appear out of nowhere—it was a reaction to a pattern of changes fans disliked.
If DAV’s failure was mostly about the industry downturn, we’d expect all comparable RPGs to be struggling just as much. Yet, games that focus on strong player-driven storytelling (Baldur’s Gate 3, for example) have thrived. The key difference? They gave players what they wanted.
The burden of proof goes both ways. If you’re going to claim story issues and messaging weren’t significant reasons for DAV’s failure, you need to prove that too. Just pointing at industry-wide problems doesn’t explain why this game failed more than others.
No, we’re having a simple disagreement over whether this was a major reason why the game failed commercially or not. You’re the one who’s making this complicated.
Insisting that the game having a message is the most major reason the game failed doesn’t refute any of what I said either. We’re still having a disagreement, nothing more. You’ve not proven your claim either.
OK, so you continue to be the one who’s making the extraordinary claim here, that DAV specifically failed because the game didn’t connect with the message, and that it was specifically because it was the message.
There are still plenty of reasons why a game wouldn’t connect with the audience, as I said. You’ve not exactly proven why and how this was the definitive reason. That’s the claim that needs to be proven, yet you’ve not done that.
Whether or not you’re acknowledging it or not, you’re acting as if as you think the game having a message is the sole reason why the game failed commercially. You acknowledge that it was a “major” reason, but then, above, you’re also specifically saying that industry-wide problems aren’t affecting the game’s situation at all. Why? Why isn’t the industry downturn affecting this game specifically? Why can’t we explain this game’s failure in large part with the incompetence and greed of major publishers?
You didn’t answer my question. I didn’t ask if it “naturally” fits the world. I asked if it was established that this is what is actually happening in the lore.
Because you’re still projecting your own assumptions on how the world should work on the work. You’re not criticising the game’s writing on its own merits. You’re complaining that the game writers didn’t write the game the way you wanted. In other words, this is still the “my historical accuracy in my fantasy game” argument.
Besides, there’s plenty of reason why, in a fantasy setting, you could have trans/nb characters who don’t get to use polymorph magic. Cost. Class gap. Haves and have-nots. The class divide is a pretty common topic that is often explored in fantasy literature and people being denied this kind of magic treatment, for whatever reason, is a valid catalyst for a story. It’d make an excellent fantasy plotline. But that’s not relevant to DA specifically.
You’re asking me to prove that the game’s messaging and story issues were a major reason for its failure, but you’re not holding yourself to the same standard. You claim that industry-wide issues like oversaturation, pricing, and publisher greed were the real reasons, yet you’ve provided no evidence that these factors impacted The Veilguard more than any other game.
The backlash against DAV wasn’t primarily about price, oversaturation, or competition. The loudest complaints were about the game’s tone, character writing, and perceived prioritization of messaging over deep storytelling. If industry trends were the dominant factor, we’d expect similar pushback against every game in this space—not just DAV.
The Dragon Age series once had strong audience trust, but that eroded over time, largely due to shifting priorities in writing and design. The skepticism around DAV didn’t just appear out of nowhere—it was a reaction to a pattern of changes fans disliked.
If DAV’s failure was mostly about the industry downturn, we’d expect all comparable RPGs to be struggling just as much. Yet, games that focus on strong player-driven storytelling (Baldur’s Gate 3, for example) have thrived. The key difference? They gave players what they wanted.
The burden of proof goes both ways. If you’re going to claim story issues and messaging weren’t significant reasons for DAV’s failure, you need to prove that too. Just pointing at industry-wide problems doesn’t explain why this game failed more than others.
https://www.polygon.com/analysis/520290/dragon-age-the-veilguard-sales-ea-bioware-layoffs
https://thatparkplace.com/dragon-age-the-veilguard-sales-lower-than-reported/
https://gameworldobserver.com/2025/01/23/dragon-age-launch-sales-veilguard-vs-previous-games