Some of those arguments are legit but like half is complaining about wayland being fundamentally different to xorg and obviously you cannot use straight xorg apps on it.
“Linux is inferior because it breaks all my powershell scripts and all my windows only apps. Don’t use linux.”
I mean, to play devil’s advocate here - if functionality that you need is all of a sudden swept out from under you then it doesn’t matter from an end user perspective if it’s not the intended design for Wayland - to the user, Wayland is broken in that regard.
A better equivalent would be if an application you used every day for the last 10 years all of a sudden has an update that kills features you used because that’s no longer part of the dev(s) vision. Or headphone jacks on phones. Or whatever that weird thing with Teslas where they disabled a sensor in an OTA update and replaced it with some other solution(?).
Or to modify the example you put, if Windows killed the cmd shell and only left powershell in a Windows Update.
I have an application that I need to use at work which will never fit Wayland’s design, short of me either finding a new job, keeping a Windows install around, or using a really old version of Linux around in a VM when X11 has completely disappeared from all distros (which won’t really work) - there will be nothing that I can do about it on the Wayland side because it’s highly unlikely the devs will update it to be compatible (since it’s a shock that they actually even had Linux support in the first place).
As it is, I currently just pop into an X11 session whenever I’m on working hours, it will suck that I can’t do that with Fedora come next release when they completely drop X from the repos.
I suppose it explains why people have a bad attitude about Wayland when tools providing useful functionality are described as trojans.
X11 can (…mostly…) have great security by just providing a suitable X Security module to it. It just seems it wasn’t considered that big of an issue that anyone bothered. Nokia Maemo/Meego used to rock such a module.
It records the screen without any restrictions and without having to ask for any permissions.
Which is exactly the requirements you need to remote desktop access via tools like meshcentral, anydesk… I don’t understand this mentality of “X11 was broken!!!”. Yeah well Wayland is broken since it stops legitimate uses as well.
Not sure what vlc would help with. So I have to use a very specific DE in order to get the functionality? Does this really sound like the linux way to you? Getting forced to use particular stuff to get something to work?
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Some of those arguments are legit but like half is complaining about wayland being fundamentally different to xorg and obviously you cannot use straight xorg apps on it.
“Linux is inferior because it breaks all my powershell scripts and all my windows only apps. Don’t use linux.”
I mean, to play devil’s advocate here - if functionality that you need is all of a sudden swept out from under you then it doesn’t matter from an end user perspective if it’s not the intended design for Wayland - to the user, Wayland is broken in that regard.
A better equivalent would be if an application you used every day for the last 10 years all of a sudden has an update that kills features you used because that’s no longer part of the dev(s) vision. Or headphone jacks on phones. Or whatever that weird thing with Teslas where they disabled a sensor in an OTA update and replaced it with some other solution(?).
Or to modify the example you put, if Windows killed the cmd shell and only left powershell in a Windows Update.
I have an application that I need to use at work which will never fit Wayland’s design, short of me either finding a new job, keeping a Windows install around, or using a really old version of Linux around in a VM when X11 has completely disappeared from all distros (which won’t really work) - there will be nothing that I can do about it on the Wayland side because it’s highly unlikely the devs will update it to be compatible (since it’s a shock that they actually even had Linux support in the first place).
As it is, I currently just pop into an X11 session whenever I’m on working hours, it will suck that I can’t do that with Fedora come next release when they completely drop X from the repos.
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I suppose it explains why people have a bad attitude about Wayland when tools providing useful functionality are described as trojans.
X11 can (…mostly…) have great security by just providing a suitable X Security module to it. It just seems it wasn’t considered that big of an issue that anyone bothered. Nokia Maemo/Meego used to rock such a module.
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By that logic, is the compositor working any different than a trojan? Is there really a difference?
The Wayland compositor is always capturing all your keyboard and mouse as well. No permissions asked. Pretty sus.
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Which is exactly the requirements you need to remote desktop access via tools like meshcentral, anydesk… I don’t understand this mentality of “X11 was broken!!!”. Yeah well Wayland is broken since it stops legitimate uses as well.
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Care to share some then? Specifically ones that allow remote control without local access to grant permission.
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Not sure what vlc would help with. So I have to use a very specific DE in order to get the functionality? Does this really sound like the linux way to you? Getting forced to use particular stuff to get something to work?