You might have had bad teachers and bad admin, true - but more likely, the school can’t do anything.
I’m a teacher, and I cannot tell you how incredibly frustrated I am at how tied my hands are. The admin can’t do much, either.
My options: talk sternly to the student. Talk sternly to the parent/guardians. And… that’s it.
Send them to the office? Sure. The principal also has those two options, for the most part. Suspending students is something we only do in very rare circumstances, but they really, really try to avoid it, because so often, kids are acting out because of stuff at home, so suspending them only makes the behaviour worse.
We can’t do detentions after school or on weekends - we can’t force parents to bring their kids in then. Lunch hour detentions, we can’t afford dedicated staff to run them, especially since we’d also need them to chase the students down, because it’s not like they’ll go just because they were told to. We can’t fail students any more.
Our district has also even gotten rid of prizes for achievements - no more honor roll, no awards, nothing. Apparently this makes the low performers feel bad, and we couldn’t have that.
And talking to the parents? Most parents are honestly great, but also, I never talk to them, because the kids with the great parents, I never need to call home. The asshole kids? Their parents are almost always a nightmare. And it’s a waste of time to talk to them.
One kid last year, went after another kid’s field trip paperwork with a pair of scissors. Ripped into her like no one’s business. Sent an email home describing the situation. I was pretty sure, based on her history, she wasn’t really going to destroy his stuff, she was trying to get a rise out of him, so I said something like, “while I believe she was only intending to annoy him, not actually destroy property, it is critical for her to understand that this is absolutely unacceptable behaviour” or something like that.
So rather than telling her kid off, mom goes to the principal to try to get me in trouble for calling her kid annoying.
In application? Doesn’t matter what the teachers or even admin want to do. The district, province/state, and country have taken away practically every carrot and stick, when it comes to students with extreme behavior.
I can understand all of that, but when one kid doxxes another and starts making prank calls, which we provided evidence of- we had logs and voicemails- and the administration admonishes both kids, that’s on them, not on anyone else. They didn’t have to lecture my daughter about bullying the other girl when she was the one being attacked.
In that case, yeah, you’ve got an admin problem. I’m sorry - that really sucks. The entire system desperately needs an overhaul. The education system in Canada is a dumpster fire, and the US is even worse. Dealing with behavioral issues is one of many major problems…
If your daughter was doxxed, can’t you file a criminal complaint directly with the police? At least where I live, it would be grounds for a criminal investigation.
Send them to the office? Sure. The principal also has those two options, for the most part. Suspending students is something we only do in very rare circumstances, but they really, really try to avoid it, because so often, kids are acting out because of stuff at home, so suspending them only makes the behaviour worse.
As someone who was bullied all the way until the start of high school, I would probably look the other way if my hypothetical children seriously hurt someone over repeated bullying. I think any alternative is better than that for everyone involved.
I had an unusual lesson from my parents regarding bullies. They told me, that if they found out that the I didn’t even try defending myself from bullies and found out, I’d still get whooped at home. It seems kinda cruel at surface level. But when the time ultimately came, dam straight I fought back tooth and nail. And no, they were not abusive in any way. Even reflecting back as an almost 40yr old adult. They were both prison guards/swat people. So they had a very different perspective of bullying I guess.
Like, it’s been a while since I was in university, but I remember learning about an incredibly stupid funds allocation process for new schools. They decided to fund schools according to their “percent allocation.”
Basically, what percentage of a school that was actively being used for teaching was a key factor in how it got funded. The idea was to favor schools being built in more efficient ways, which sounds great on paper.
But it was the same kind of narrow minded pursuit of a type of efficiency incompatible with reality.
Gyms, theaters (for drama programs), cafeterias? None of these contribute to learning, obviously, so any schools with those get reduced funding.
What about office spaces? Unused classrooms, for schools that are built in anticipation of growing populations? Janitor closets? Staff rooms? Let’s minimize those as much as possible, too! Because that makes all the sense!
Literally, in my district, (though I don’t actually know if that is the actual reason) they closed the other middle school a few years ago, so that this one is the only middle school in town. It’s vastly over capacity. We have two portables to handle the overflow. We have teachers sharing a classroom, where they have prep blocks in a different rotation, and a few PE classes to have one class’s kids outside of the classroom.
And yet, there’s an empty school not twenty minutes from here, abandoned. Like, what the hell…
But I guess this school is definitely being fully utilized, and that means it’s more efficient, right…? Sigh.
You might have had bad teachers and bad admin, true - but more likely, the school can’t do anything.
I’m a teacher, and I cannot tell you how incredibly frustrated I am at how tied my hands are. The admin can’t do much, either.
My options: talk sternly to the student. Talk sternly to the parent/guardians. And… that’s it.
Send them to the office? Sure. The principal also has those two options, for the most part. Suspending students is something we only do in very rare circumstances, but they really, really try to avoid it, because so often, kids are acting out because of stuff at home, so suspending them only makes the behaviour worse.
We can’t do detentions after school or on weekends - we can’t force parents to bring their kids in then. Lunch hour detentions, we can’t afford dedicated staff to run them, especially since we’d also need them to chase the students down, because it’s not like they’ll go just because they were told to. We can’t fail students any more.
Our district has also even gotten rid of prizes for achievements - no more honor roll, no awards, nothing. Apparently this makes the low performers feel bad, and we couldn’t have that.
And talking to the parents? Most parents are honestly great, but also, I never talk to them, because the kids with the great parents, I never need to call home. The asshole kids? Their parents are almost always a nightmare. And it’s a waste of time to talk to them.
One kid last year, went after another kid’s field trip paperwork with a pair of scissors. Ripped into her like no one’s business. Sent an email home describing the situation. I was pretty sure, based on her history, she wasn’t really going to destroy his stuff, she was trying to get a rise out of him, so I said something like, “while I believe she was only intending to annoy him, not actually destroy property, it is critical for her to understand that this is absolutely unacceptable behaviour” or something like that.
So rather than telling her kid off, mom goes to the principal to try to get me in trouble for calling her kid annoying.
In application? Doesn’t matter what the teachers or even admin want to do. The district, province/state, and country have taken away practically every carrot and stick, when it comes to students with extreme behavior.
It’s a huge mess.
I can understand all of that, but when one kid doxxes another and starts making prank calls, which we provided evidence of- we had logs and voicemails- and the administration admonishes both kids, that’s on them, not on anyone else. They didn’t have to lecture my daughter about bullying the other girl when she was the one being attacked.
In that case, yeah, you’ve got an admin problem. I’m sorry - that really sucks. The entire system desperately needs an overhaul. The education system in Canada is a dumpster fire, and the US is even worse. Dealing with behavioral issues is one of many major problems…
Thanks. At least we have a solution, even if that solution involves me quitting my job. She’s more important than my job anyway.
If your daughter was doxxed, can’t you file a criminal complaint directly with the police? At least where I live, it would be grounds for a criminal investigation.
People have tried many times and it never works. Not in the U.S.
See here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doxing#United_States
Damn, that’s a shame. He in the EU, there’s tons of laws that can be used on cases like that, and many times, they are and work.
Hope things get better for you in the future.
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Thanks.
As someone who was bullied all the way until the start of high school, I would probably look the other way if my hypothetical children seriously hurt someone over repeated bullying. I think any alternative is better than that for everyone involved.
I had an unusual lesson from my parents regarding bullies. They told me, that if they found out that the I didn’t even try defending myself from bullies and found out, I’d still get whooped at home. It seems kinda cruel at surface level. But when the time ultimately came, dam straight I fought back tooth and nail. And no, they were not abusive in any way. Even reflecting back as an almost 40yr old adult. They were both prison guards/swat people. So they had a very different perspective of bullying I guess.
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I agree that that’s an issue, to be sure.
Like, it’s been a while since I was in university, but I remember learning about an incredibly stupid funds allocation process for new schools. They decided to fund schools according to their “percent allocation.”
Basically, what percentage of a school that was actively being used for teaching was a key factor in how it got funded. The idea was to favor schools being built in more efficient ways, which sounds great on paper.
But it was the same kind of narrow minded pursuit of a type of efficiency incompatible with reality.
Gyms, theaters (for drama programs), cafeterias? None of these contribute to learning, obviously, so any schools with those get reduced funding.
What about office spaces? Unused classrooms, for schools that are built in anticipation of growing populations? Janitor closets? Staff rooms? Let’s minimize those as much as possible, too! Because that makes all the sense!
Literally, in my district, (though I don’t actually know if that is the actual reason) they closed the other middle school a few years ago, so that this one is the only middle school in town. It’s vastly over capacity. We have two portables to handle the overflow. We have teachers sharing a classroom, where they have prep blocks in a different rotation, and a few PE classes to have one class’s kids outside of the classroom.
And yet, there’s an empty school not twenty minutes from here, abandoned. Like, what the hell…
But I guess this school is definitely being fully utilized, and that means it’s more efficient, right…? Sigh.
Likely all done by tax activist And conservative legislators in order to shrink services and government.
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