The Biden administration and the Israeli government diverge sharply over how Gaza should be governed when the war ends.

The Biden administration and the Israeli government diverge sharply over how Gaza should be governed when the war ends.

Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu of Israel on Thursday appeared to rule out a postwar peace process that would lead to the establishment of a sovereign Palestinian state, rebuffing calls from the United States and others to start working toward that goal.

“In any arrangement in the foreseeable future — with an arrangement or without one — Israel must have security control over all the territory west of the Jordan,” Mr. Netanyahu said at a news conference, referring to an area including occupied territory that Palestinians hope will one day become their independent state. “This clashes with the idea of sovereignty. What can you do?”

The Biden administration and the Israeli government have diverged sharply over how Gaza will be governed when the fighting ends. President Biden and his top diplomat, Antony J. Blinken, have urged Israeli officials to move toward the eventual establishment of a Palestinian state. Mr. Biden has suggested that a “revitalized” Palestinian Authority, which is based in the West Bank, run a post-Hamas Gaza as an interim step toward that goal.

But Israeli officials have repeatedly dismissed such calls, saying they are focused on the war in Gaza. On Thursday, Mr. Netanyahu told reporters he had rebuffed the latest exhortations.

Non-paywall link

  • queermunist she/her
    -2•10 months ago

    Biden also does whatever Bibi asks, he just is more vocally whiny about it. There’s functionally zero difference.

    Trump is definitely worse domestically, but I just don’t buy that he’d be worse on this issue specifically.

    • @IchNichtenLichtenEnglish
      7•10 months ago

      Biden also does whatever Bibi asks, he just is more vocally whiny about it. There’s functionally zero difference.

      I disagree. Trump is essentially amoral, there’s no request he wouldn’t consider. I don’t think Biden is doing nearly enough to stand up to Netanyahu but to say they are the same isn’t accurate.

      • queermunist she/her
        3•10 months ago

        Has there been a request that Biden won’t consider? I don’t mean when Biden vocally disagrees with something, I mean has he ever refused what Israel asks for materially?

        • @IchNichtenLichtenEnglish
          3•10 months ago

          Publicly? Not that I’m aware of. Behind the scenes, who knows?

          If you’re looking for a stark difference between the two on foreign policy, Trump would happily hand over Ukraine to his best buddy. Israel/Palestine is a different beast but to say the two Presidents are the same isn’t accurate.

          • queermunist she/her
            -6•10 months ago

            Publicly? Not that I’m aware of. Behind the scenes, who knows?

            You have to realize, then, that it could be even worse behind the scenes. Biden needs to appease his angry base publicly, but privately? lol

            Trump would happily hand over Ukraine to his best buddy.

            Whereas Biden deliberately sabotaged peace talks to keep the war going. Let’s not pretend either side is “better” on that issue either.

            • @IchNichtenLichtenEnglish
              4•10 months ago

              I’m not sure you understand how diplomacy works. You don’t have difficult discussions in front of TV cameras.

              It’s not like I’m even a fan of Biden but your absolutist, “they are the same” stance needed a reality check.

              Whereas Biden deliberately sabotaged peace talks to keep the war going.

              Do you have a source on this?

              • @[email protected]
                7•10 months ago

                Whereas Biden deliberately sabotaged peace talks to keep the war going.

                Do you have a source on this?

                They probably mean ‘peace talks’ of the sort where Ukraine is expected to roll over and let Russia take them, and then there’ll be ‘peace’

                • @IchNichtenLichtenEnglish
                  6•10 months ago

                  Or peace being contingent on Putin getting to keep some of the territory he stole. Either way, it would be news to me.

              • queermunist she/her
                -3•10 months ago

                It’s not like I’m even a fan of Biden but your absolutist, “they are the same” stance needed a reality check.

                Your only source for “they are not the same” is secret talks that you’re imagining in your own head. Fanfiction.

                Do you have a source on this?

                https://morningstaronline.co.uk/article/f/us-repeatedly-blocked-ukraine-peace-deals-it-rethinking-its-strategy-yet

                What is becoming all too apparent is that this conflict didn’t have to still be going on right now; it didn’t have to stretch into the bloody war of attrition that it has turned into. The killing could have ended long ago.

                Though Arakhamia’s anti-semitism has him looking in the wrong direction for explanations as to why Ukraine is losing, he does offer insights that are useful for understanding why the battles in the east are still raging.

                It is clear that the US and its allies were out to sabotage possibilities for peace immediately after the Russian invasion. Were it not for their interference, the current war could have ended in early March 2022 — about a week after it started. Thanks to Arakhamia, we now have confirmation of this fact.

                He was at the talks in Belarus and said the Russians would halt the invasion and leave Ukraine if there was agreement on Ukrainian military neutrality and its leaders gave up on Nato membership.

                Rather than report this to the public, however, the media in Europe and the US focused on sensational statements that were not actually part of those negotiations. They insisted that the Russians made official demands in the talks to “de-nazify” a country that the Allies said had no Nazis. Further, Russia supposedly demanded direct control of not only the eastern Russian-speaking regions of Ukraine but also other vast stretches of the country.

                Madeleine Albright, the now-deceased and famous US diplomat, once said that during negotiations, one must distinguish between what participants really want and what is just political theatre. In Belarus in March 2022, the US chose to focus on political theatre, diverting attention from the two key Russian demands.

                Arakhamia said that internationally mediated negotiations in Istanbul, shortly after the March 2022 talks in Belarus, actually produced an agreement between Ukraine and Russia to bring the fighting to an end — based on those same points.

                “[The Russians] were ready to end the war if we accepted neutrality like Finland once did. And we were ready to make a commitment that we would not join Nato. When we returned from Istanbul, [then-British Prime Minister] Boris Johnson came to Kiev and said: ‘Do not sign anything with them at all; just go to war,’” Arakhamia said.

                • @IchNichtenLichtenEnglish
                  2•10 months ago

                  Your only source for “they are not the same” is secret talks that you’re imagining in your own head. Fanfiction.

                  No, that they are not the same is blatantly obvious to everybody apart from you. Why is that?

                  Further, Russia supposedly demanded direct control of not only the eastern Russian-speaking regions of Ukraine but also other vast stretches of the country.

                  You’re trying to blame Biden for this? Come on.

                  • queermunist she/her
                    -6•10 months ago

                    No, that they are not the same is blatantly obvious to everybody apart from you. Why is that?

                    When the president is talking you should always assume he is lying, either by omission or exaggeration or falsification. I only believe things that have proof, I never trust any president at his word because I’m old enough to know better. I came into political consciousness under Bush, then came into adulthood under Obama, and they were both absolute monsters on the international stage. Trump wasn’t actually worse.

                    America is an evil empire. Grow up.

                    You’re trying to blame Biden for this? Come on.

                    A good negotiator will always ask for the best possible deal so that, by the time it is whittled down by compromise, it’s at least acceptable to both sides. That’s how all negotiations have always worked. Instead, Biden just made that conversation stop because he didn’t want the war to end without a total and perfect Ukraine victory where zero territory is lost and Russia is militarily and geopolitically crippled.

                    And so the war goes on.