I’m transmasc by the way. I know it happens to other femboys and it sucks for them too but for me it feels super invalidating and makes me feel dysphoric to be told I should be a girl 😭
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If they’re telling you you’d be pretty as a girl rather than mistaking you for one, doesn’t that imply you’re passing as a guy? Seems to me you could choose to interpret it as validating, in a backhanded way.
(Then again, I’m just a cis guy passing by from “all,” so what do I know?)
They’re invalidating me saying they think I am a girl, they see me as a girl. Maybe it’s nice that I pass as male on some level with them, but they still see me as a girl in some capacity, and that’s a lose in my book, since they still treat me like one, call me one, and use she/her pronouns even when I cry and tell them to stop. Also telling me that I can’t be a boy because “boys don’t like to wear dresses and skirts”.
Bro, fuck those bigots. I’m sorry, I know it’s easier to nominally have friends even if you hate them in high school, but those people are dumb, close minded, and making you feel bad.
I like to dance contra, which has a long tradition of men wearing skirts. You aren’t locked out of whimsy because you’re a man, neither are you immune to spinniness.
Agreed, though for some of them it’s a challenge since they’re not just friends but also colleagues and I can’t as easily cut them out of my life. I’m stuck dealing with them, for a while anyway. Thank you for the nice words of affirmation.
Worst thing I didn’t realize from being young is: keeping people around who are going to eventually leave no matter what cuz they didn’t actually respect me isn’t worth it.
Show them enough respect to get what you need out of them but don’t be friendly with them because they don’t actually care about you and none of it’s real. They’re being social friendly just enough but it’s not real and they don’t really care about you.
Don’t get emotionally invested and don’t let people close to you who don’t know you and who you know cause you pain, otherwise you’re just causing self harm to not be alone and the scars will ruin close social relationships. Colleagues should ne at arm’s length you, can tell them that they’re being inappropriate, you can just walk away you, can ignore them, be cold to them give them social situations to make them feel uncomfortable like they do you and cut them out.
I promise you in 2 years agter graduation none of them will probably be around. None of them will probably helped you with a job (networking it almost exclusively better with older people in the industry NOT your own rivals for jobs).
And you’re going to have spent time juggling relationships that were a waste of your time and that they never cared. Carry around scars for your future partners and friends, ways you wont trust because of a casual acquaintance. It’s as bad as having a cheating partner for causing you to mistrust and feel unsable to force yourself to be friendly with people who don’t care about you.
None of what they say matters to them or they even process it in social situations. They dont put themselves into your shoes.
I’m it feels like everything to you and so it feels like it’ll be everything to them, but no they won’t remember you for anythings but a stereotypes they formed in their head 2 months after you haven’t been around. Then a year later they may have the vaguest recollection.
Only you will remember this in 10 years. Act with respect for yourself, not them and not what you’ve been told they’ll be good for.
Because you won’t lie at night wishing you had given more of yourselves to others. You wont wish you made yourself more vulnerable, more easy to hurt by letting cold and thoughtless people into a close place where they can hurt you. You’ll wish you had walked away rather than cause wounds you’ll never be able to heal.
Scotland calls bullshit
you do you, ignore idiots!
Damn, I’m sorry that happens to you.
Maybe there’s a silver lining? I’m just a clueless cis guy but for someone to talk to you from that (unkind) angle wouldn’t it mean they’re assuming you’re male, and therefore passing?
Yeah that kind of thing also reinforces gender binary.
Encouraging gender identity as a choice diminishes the struggle of trans people today. I’m not against it in principle, but the current political climate doesn’t have room for this stuff. Give society 20 years to figure out how to be equitable berore peddling this narrative.
I don’t like this argument.
You’re advising
"not pursuing or discussing what the truth might be, because of political opponents".
Political opponents who want you un-existing either way, and will use any excuse and lie available to barely mask that hate of theirs.
Neither those people’s “understanding”, nor their amount of available means to mask their hate, really affects trans people’s freedom.
The "average Joe" can't be "won over" either, because they don't care. Until something happens, to make them care. Like an a acquaintance or loved one being involved.
But in the off-chance that they can, (without being personally affected), they will be won over by recognising a truth of the world.
Victory by “reasonable vibes”, is achieved by reaffirming what’s already in someone else’s head. It’s only a victory if you’re trying to not change something.
So seek the truth. Don’t appeal to the good nature of the oppressor.
(tap)
for more, at least in Jerboa.
I don’t like it either but it’s a pragmatic argument. I think you’re a bit out of touch with how society can move forward if we introduce polarizing ideas. We haven’t wrangled how trans women fit into sports. You really think the “let’s make it a choice” argument is going to help with that?
Plenty of average joes are fine with gay people now, not racist, not misogynistic. We will get there as a society if we try to find common ground. Like I said, it may take another 20 years to sort out how to be equitable to a very marginalized group of people (maybe longer). This trans is a choice rhetoric will prolong that because it diminished any common ground that we are starting to form.
Is that the take away from the comic? I see it as more someone trying to explore through clothing and someone saying theyw would be supportive?
Are we so defensive we can’t even have that anymore? Are we unable to discuss gender presentation and identity detached from transition? What about nonbinary identities? Some people explore that and transition, some don’t.
Are we really supposed to be regressive and call it self protection? Are we at the “respectable transgender” era along with “I’m gay but I don’t know about this trans stuff” already?
He is someone who already transitioned (transmasc) and still enjoys wearing feminine clothing, what the girl did here can feel very very invalidating and dysphoria inducing because despite passing she still sees them as a girl. For me situations like that make me feel hella dysphoric.
I’m in femboy communities and I know many of them also dislike when this happens to them as well, but it doesn’t compare to the gender dysphoria I get from people still thinking I’m a girl.
I agree that we really do need to discuss gender identity and presentation separate from transition, I also think we need to discuss presentation separate from gender identity, after all if boys are allowed to wear skirts, why do people naturally assume we must be girls if/when we do?
I didn’t realize there was deep lore in an egg_irl post, i took it as the comic it was.
Without that background information, (that is not included unless i stalk the OP, which doesn’t feel like it would endear anyone to my participation) it feels close to a comic could reinforce the “you can’t win trying to be supportive to queer people these days” energy since there’s nothing clear about there being a boundary made by the other person in the comic? Maybe there’s something i missed on the lemmy ui, I’m willing to admit!
As an older queer i am not quite sure when we decided clothing meant anything (again) since growing up it was something we already tried to work on in the queer community, just look into lesbian spaces and their attempts to uncouple femininity from being required to dress up. Have binary identities and enforcing trans people to present a particular way backfired into hyper gendered expressions being required?
Another question is how can the community help individuals vulnerable to invalidation of parts of their identity? I know everyone needs support as a whole and in general in their lives. The ability to stand strong in yourself in the storm can’t be manufactured without a foundation, and how do we help newbies find that with the atmospheres as tense as they are, even in queer spaces?
It’s okay, I forgot to mark it as Transmasc and Transphobia. Without that there’s no way anyone else could’ve known.
I never intended to have that message, was just trying to share a situation which was uncomfortable and invalidating for me due to someone else assuming my gender (thinking I am AMAB transfem when I’m AFAB and transmasc).
I don’t know if as you said binary identities and expectations of trans people have backfired as you said, I do know that people who follow gender stereotypes have had a tendency sort of force them onto others. It happens a lot to femboys and people say they are an egg or transfem. Which isn’t great on its own but in my case I’m a femboy and transmasc so it’s worse.
It’s hard but I think that having such rigid expectations of presentation isn’t helping. Like, so what if I was AMAB and looked and dressed the way I am, so what. Why would that make me a girl or egg? That doesn’t seem helpful, and at least for an AMAB femboy it wouldn’t be exactly harmful, it’s not always obvious that they are. I’ve met many enbies who had similar experiences with invalidation from gender stereotypes and it sucks.
…
I HAVE TO! I have to steal her top!!! Where can I get it!?
I don’t know but it is nice. I kinda want one like that too.
Roll for persuasion/seduction /s
Huh? I really don’t get what you’re saying
I Saw The TV Glow
Wow, that’s not okay. I’m so sorry that happened to you. I’ve had similar experiences myself with egging but it probably wasn’t anywhere near as bad as what you went through. I hope you’re doing better and are with better people who respect you for who you are.
![egg😣irl [Transmasc] [CW: Transphobia]](https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/pictrs/image/bf39ba1f-b01c-43fd-b899-79756511c574.webp){kind=link}