In the USA most of us have never mastered anything but English. You may be taught other languages in school but if you are never immersed in them for any period of time you never feel comfortable reading, writing, or speaking a foreign language. My unscientific observation is that most Germans are fluent in both German and English. In Germany is English taught in all schools? How do people become fluent in both German and English? If you are truly bi lingual, what language do you “think” in?

  • @[email protected]
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    33 days ago

    English is a mandatory second language in virtually all levels of education in germany. This hasn’t always been the case, so the ability is more widespread amongst younger generations.

    It is also worth noting that due to the way we learn english (primarily by reading/writing and possibly listening) those disciplines tend to be much better developed than actually speaking the language, simply because we rarely get to in everyday situations (and if we do it is almost always with another European national who has learned the language the same way we did, and struggles the same way).

    On the other hand, this often leads to Europeans correcting english speakers on their grammar, because native english speakers learn the language primarily by hearing and speaking it, and there/their/they’re and such sound way too similar.

  • @moshankey
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    53 days ago

    My German teacher in high school (80’s) told me he knew he was fluent, or something, when he started dreaming in German. Also taught Russian. In the 80’s. Stories were very interesting.

  • @vzq
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    3 days ago

    First of all, not everyone thinks in language. A lot of people think in abstract concepts they only materialize into language when they need to output them. For them, the question is moot.

    Second, it’s highly context dependent. In situations where you speak language A, you’ll tend toward language A, and vice versa for language B.

    That said, I can assure you that 99% of Germans are NOT bilingual with English, despite being fluent. Think of it as C1 in the Oxford scale, with very few on C2.

    • @dustyData
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      23 days ago

      C1 is fluent, but it doesn’t matter. Fluency is a myth. Language is a tool, if you have a need for the language and you accomplished it using the language, then you’re bilingual. It doesn’t matter if in the process you made 3 grammatical errors and conjugated 2 verbs wrong, and skipped a pronoun. If you achieved your goal then you’re fluent and bilingual, anything else are style points assigned arbitrarily.

      Language is a two or more person activity, the other person can always bridge the gap as a listener or speaker, and that is actually a good thing. Those who ditch the fluency myth and dare to use the language in spite of errors learn faster.

      Also, it is the Common European Framework of Reference, Oxford does not own it, they just make one of the many tests that exist for somewhat qualifying a person’s proficiency at using a language, and it is broken down into 4 activities and 3 competencies, and many more dimensions. A person can absolutely ignore the written component of a language while speaking naturally with others, or vice versa, understand and write grammatically perfect while being less able to listen or speak. Language competencies are complex and dynamic, changing over time. Fluency is not a concept in the CEFR, but it is used as an adjective to describe some competencies as early as the B1 level, it never uses nor does it try to qualify multilingualism either. If you use another language, you’re multilingual, period. Linguists actually think most of the world’s population is at least bilingual.

      • @vzq
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        -13 days ago

        C1 is fluent,

        That’s literally what I said.

        but it doesn’t matter.

        Sure.

        • @dustyData
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          23 days ago

          If you read past the first line, you’d notice that is not the main point of my comment. The point is that fluency doesn’t define bilingualism. You don’t need to be C2 to be considered bilingual.

          • @vzq
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            03 days ago

            Which, again, I never said.

            Who are you arguing against here?

            • @dustyData
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              23 days ago

              I’m not arguing against anyone, just made a point. Don’t get mad about it. I’m not attacking you.

              • @vzq
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                3 days ago

                Don’t get mad about it, but you’re an insufferable person to have a conversation with and I’m going to block you now.

                • @dustyData
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                  3 days ago

                  I understand, I can see how an insecure individual would perceive my replies as such. Thank you for pointing out your feelings and bringing this learning opportunity to my attention. I apologize for unintentionally making you uncomfortable.

  • @[email protected]
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    3 days ago

    Most (educated, young) Germans speak some English, relatively fluent if they use English frequently at the workplace or in their free time (e.g. movies). We are not bilingual. English is a language taught in school (for most) and learned after childhood.

    Actual bilingual people, such as a person from the UK growing up in Germany, can have two mother tongues. Someone who actually lived in an English speaking country for more than 1 year may be bilingual, but the average German is not.

    To answer your questions: Most schools teach English as the first foreign language and any school teaches at least one foreign language. So, yes, every German should at least speak one other language and very often it’s English. None of our neighbouring countries speak English, so French is also popular, but declining. Spanish is popular, but nowhere near as widespread as English or French.

    And on your second question: I think in language and most of the time I think in German, but when I’m in an English-speaking country or working with English texts I tend to think in English.

    • @dustyData
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      23 days ago

      That’s not the correct definition of bilingualism. You’re describing simultaneous bilingualism, which is just a way to describe learning two languages at once in childhood. This is not a requirement for bilingualism.