Yeah it’s terrible what decades of Apartheid and Colonial Expansion will do to a populace.
When the self appointed good guys are the ones bombing your houses and killing your family -with full approval of the state- it can make you turn to anyone who seems to be on your side.
We really should help the palestinian people so we don’t end up with situations like this in the future.
It really is a brutal failure of American foreign policy.
edit:typo and clarification
When the self appointed good guys are the ones bombing your houses and killing your family -with full approval of the state- it can make you turn to anyone who seems to be on your side.
Was Israel bombing people’s houses and killing families in 1972, when Palestinians executed the Israeli Olympics team on German TV?
Oh, wait, no, they weren’t - in 1972 Gazans could freely travel into Israel and even work there, and had a higher living standard due to Israel’s support than literally any other country in the Middle East.
It hasn’t always been bombing houses and killing families. Palestinians have always been killing Jews, though.
First, let me say I find it telling that you need to go as far back as 1972 - !51 YEARS AGO! - to find a place you feel safe arguing from.
in 1972 Gazans could freely travel into Israel
So they cannot now, by your own admission, or you would not have brought it up.
Therefore secondly, thankyou for admitting that Isreals treatment of Palestinians does rise to the level of Apartheid; of course, restricting the movement of a people based on their ethnic background is a form of racial descrimination as defined by the UN and various international human rights organisations.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/apartheid#
So we have established that you are aware of and are currently trying to excuse apartheid, we are just haggling over where and at what point you think the actions of a few people justify the racial segregation of an entire ethnic group.
In regards the 1972 Munich Massacre, committed by the Black September organisation on German soil, I fail to see the direct link between the actions of a terrorist organisation in Germany as it relates to the justification of apartheid and mass mistreatment of the populace of Palestine.
Now Indirectly, yes, the Black September Organisation (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_September_Organization) was a Palestinian Nationist Organisation (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_nationalism), i.e. a movement of people who espouse self-determination and sovereignty over the region of Palestine. They were not a state sponsored group, nor were they duly elected representatives of the Palestinian people. They were entirely autonomous and operated without the input of Palestine.
Also here’s an interesting point; Palestinian Nationalism formed in part in reaction to the 1967 Six Day War (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six-Day_War), in which hostilities came to a head over Isreali expansion into sovereign Palestinian territory. So Isreal was already practicing colonial expansion, it was already engaging in hostilities sanctioned by the state. It was already killing people for land. Yes, that’s right, they were already “bombing houses and killing families” as you put it.
The incident you mentioned is not the beginning of anything, nor the last part of something, it is one event in an enormous cascade of events that have led us here. Its only unique factor here is that you thought it was a clever way to derail the conversation and melodramatically clutch pearls.
So in conclusion, I said the Isreali State is committing atrocities, you admitted they practice apartheid and tried to justify it by citing the actions of a non-state affiliated terrorist group in 1972. A group who had support -much like the modern day terrorist groups who have the support of Palestinian people- in large part due to the illegal and unethical treatment of Palestine as a sovereign nation and Palestinians as an ethnic group.
As such my position has not changed, and you have done nothing but commit an unforced error while trying to justify apartheid. Palestinians today are desperate and have no hope they will be treated fairly by the powers that be, so they put their faith in manipulative groups who want to use their support to gain traction in their own ideological conflicts.
Yes, it’s very shitty that Isreal and her allies have created such an unacceptable state of affairs, and Palestinians have been made so desperate they are willing to support anyone who promises to treat them better than we have. Great job shitting the bed and declaring your approval of Human Rights atrocities.
I think, in future, if you want to do Isreal a favor, you can best serve their interests by not talking. Opening your mouth here has only made their actions seem even less justifiable.
edit:several typos and a few clarifications
So they cannot now, by your own admission, or you would not have brought it up.
Yes, of course they can’t. When you allow Palestinians to freely travel into Israel they use the opportunity to murder Jews.
Egypt and Jordan won’t allow them in, either. You simply can’t trust Palestinians in your society if you value law, stability, and safety. Because they don’t - there isn’t a single organizing principle that they won’t sacrifice to Jew-hatred.
Also here’s an interesting point; Palestinian Nationalism formed in part in reaction to the 1967 Six Day War (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six-Day_War), in which hostilities came to a head over Isreali expansion into sovereign Palestinian territory.
Uh-huh. That’s what happened? “Hostilities came to a head”?
Haha, no. Yeah you don’t get to just throw out a couple more vague questions and pretend you properly responded.
Stop pretending Palestinians are some kind of alien species, Stop equating Israel to all Jewish people, read what I wrote and respond, or take the L.
Do some work, or don’t and stop making meritless statements. And at the very least, justify why you want to support apartheid.
That was weak XD
Yeah you don’t get to just throw out a couple more vague questions and pretend you properly responded.
There’s nothing to respond to. You’re clearly an idiot; you identified Black September as “German.”
Stop pretending Palestinians are some kind of alien species
They’re not “aliens.” They’re people, mired hopelessly and irredeemably in the world’s oldest naked bigotry and the implacable enemies of their neighbors.
Right so you have nothing to say, because your claims are indefensible.
I’m glad I got the chance to school you so thoroughly you had no recourse but to ignore what I said, restate your points and pretend I haven’t already addressed them.
All the best, please re-examine your obvious bigotries. I won’t be dignifying your next angry, desperate, face saving reply with a response.
You had your chance.
edit: wait, did you just try to say I claimed Black September were German?! Okay, AND I QUOTE MYSELF:
committed by the Black September organisation on German soil, I fail to see the direct link between the actions of a terrorist organisation in Germany as it relates to the justification of apartheid and mass mistreatment of the populace of Palestine
They committed a terrorist act on German soil, in no way did I EVER imply they were German. Jesus Christ.
I was laughing because you had no response, now I am laughing because you do not even have the reading comprehension to UNDERSTAND WHAT I WROTE.
My God.
Right so you have nothing to say, because your claims are indefensible.
You didn’t even attempt to refute them.
All the best, please re-examine your obvious bigotries.
It’s not “bigotry” to acknowledge how Palestinians are incubated in a culture entirely composed of Jew hate. What do they build? What do they invent?
New ways to kill Jews, only.
Yes, pro-war factions and governments gain support by their people when there’s an active war, especially when the result of the government losing the war is the enemy taking over.
Article on Gazan opinions before the war (in June)
Plus “Israeli” people never needed a war to elect several blood thirsty war criminals, while Palestinians had their land stolen and suffered decades of blockades, discrimination, and murders to get here.
from the article linked in this post:
An overwhelming 75 percent support the massacre of innocent Israelis and Jews on October 7, with only 13 percent opposed.
But the source they provided doesn’t mention that.
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How can you conclude that? supporting an attack is not the same as supporting the infliction of casualties during it. In fact that’s what the supporters of the current war on Gaza are hiding behind.
Reasons cited for the October 7 attacks included: responding to oppression, particularly attacks
on Al Aqsa (35%), and addressing broader issues such as freeing Palestine, ending the occupation,
and stopping settlements (33%). Breaking the blockade of Gaza was cited as the main reason by
21% of respondents.That’s ~89%
A small percentage (6%) reported that the main reasons behind the war are related to regional
interests. This includes serving the interests of Iran (5%) and stopping the ongoing peace and
normalization process with Israel (1%).That’s the remaining ~11%.
That makes it look like the vast majority of Palestinians are supporting it for the potential of ending their suffering and oppression. Not to kill Jews.
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Anyone with a brain would also know that given enough time, with the US’ support and the world’s silence Palestine would cease to exist and the population of Gaza will get starved off.
So any change that could get some attention will have more support than usual. An attack should have been expected, even if Hamas wasn’t governing Gaza.
Once this is all settled we will see more aggression towards Palestinians with no fucks given for their lovely neighbor’s regular and war crimes.
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yet their land keeps shrinking, and their houses get stolen.
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Anyone that is currently a member of Hamas or IJ must be killed on sight.
Supporters are free to express if they like Hamas, but every member must be slaughtered immediately.
