I had to google whether this is some idiom unknown to me, or if you’re mocking me, or what it really is. I’m no philosopher, but at one point it’s not the same ship for me.
Oh, not mocking you. It’s just a semi famous Greek thing about when changing the parts of a thing changes the thing. It’s hard to draw clear lines about it.
Especially in the case where you take the parts off the original ship one at a time and replace them, while reassembling them somewhere else. Now you have two ships and it’s unclear which is the “original”
It applies somewhat well to a band changing members, but I guess if your band is only like 3 people it’s less fuzzy. A symphony of 100 people that changes one member every year, though, would be harder to call.
Yeah. I was thinking like the usual 4 piece rock band. You switch one member and it’s ok. Let’s say next year one member dies, so he’s replaced. Still ok. But when there’s ultimately nobody from the original lineup, it’s just not the same band for me. On paper it is, but for me it’s just milking the name…
when there’s ultimately nobody from the original lineup, it’s just not the same band for me
I agree in general, but I think longevity comes into it too.
If the band lost a couple of members early on, but replaced them, then had decades of success and eventually replaced the remaining originals, you still have the early replacements there, who were involved for most of their career.
It would seem harsh to say it’s not the same band just because none of the original members are there.
Good question, but the comment I was replying to only mentioned a single band member change.
Philosophically it’s hard to say at what point it stops being the same band. It’s the Ship of Theseus, or as it’s often known here in the UK, Trigger’s Broom, after a scene in the sitcom Only Fools and Horses.
When someone dies or leaves the band, you have a new band and should give it a new name.
“A three-legged dog is still a dog. It just has to learn to run differently.” - Michael Stipe
But when every leg is replaced? When head is replaced too? When torso is broken and remodeled? Is it still that dog or something different?
I’m ok with band switching members, but there should be a limit…
Meanwhile, the ship of Theseus…
I had to google whether this is some idiom unknown to me, or if you’re mocking me, or what it really is. I’m no philosopher, but at one point it’s not the same ship for me.
Oh, not mocking you. It’s just a semi famous Greek thing about when changing the parts of a thing changes the thing. It’s hard to draw clear lines about it.
Especially in the case where you take the parts off the original ship one at a time and replace them, while reassembling them somewhere else. Now you have two ships and it’s unclear which is the “original”
It applies somewhat well to a band changing members, but I guess if your band is only like 3 people it’s less fuzzy. A symphony of 100 people that changes one member every year, though, would be harder to call.
For anyone else who doesn’t know: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_Theseus
Yeah. I was thinking like the usual 4 piece rock band. You switch one member and it’s ok. Let’s say next year one member dies, so he’s replaced. Still ok. But when there’s ultimately nobody from the original lineup, it’s just not the same band for me. On paper it is, but for me it’s just milking the name…
I agree in general, but I think longevity comes into it too.
If the band lost a couple of members early on, but replaced them, then had decades of success and eventually replaced the remaining originals, you still have the early replacements there, who were involved for most of their career.
It would seem harsh to say it’s not the same band just because none of the original members are there.
Good question, but the comment I was replying to only mentioned a single band member change.
Philosophically it’s hard to say at what point it stops being the same band. It’s the Ship of Theseus, or as it’s often known here in the UK, Trigger’s Broom, after a scene in the sitcom Only Fools and Horses.