I think fighting in fight scenes can and often does cause serious injury resulting in hospitalizations, so I’m not sure why you think that’s an especially good argument. It doesn’t have to even be a fight scene. I just read yesterday that Nancy Travis cut her the tip of her finger off with a knife during So I Married an Axe Murderer because she was laughing at what Mike Myers was doing- intentionally making her character laugh in the scene. They could have used a dull knife, but they didn’t.
A better example would be Stallone ending up in the ICU for a week because he wanted the fight at the end of Rocky IV to be realistic, so he told Dolph Lundgren to forget the choreography and Lundgren punched too hard. May I remind you it was Stallone who was directing that movie and still wanted to actually be punched in a boxing ring so he could be in the acting headspace.
There are also character actors like Daniel Day-Lewis who live their characters 24/7 starting long before filming begins and not stopping until it ends. All of his blades in Gangs of New York were razor sharp unless it was known for certain that they would be connecting with someone- but you can’t be certain of that.
That’s just how movies and actors are.
Could they have used a realistic prop gun? That I don’t know about. I would say it would depend on just how realistic we are talking when shot close-up with a high-definition digital camera and blown up to fit an IMAX screen. I’m guessing there gets to be a point where just buying the gun makes more sense than trying to buy a lookalike that looks good enough.
Yes it is, which is why there is a weapon master to (usually) ensure people aren’t put at risk.
Brandon Lee was killed by a gun with dummy bullets. Before that, no one had even thought that sort of thing would happen. Before Rust, no one thought this would happen because no one had been killed by an arms master being this negligent before.
I think things will be different in the future, but expecting an actor to understand the nuances of firearms, let alone be able to do that when they’re trying to prepare for something, should not have been something people should have expected.
And really, your bringing up choreography shows why. Actors are trusting the people who give them the swords that the swords won’t actually cause serious damage. No one is expecting the actors to test that out on watermelons before shooting.
Also, note I have said nothing about criminal liability.
A little curious as to how you make 2-3 pounds of sword-shaped steel “safe”.
It doesn’t matter if it’s not sharp. It’s still going to brain a person if they get hit the wrong way, and any one older than a 10 yo would recognize that the moment they picked it up.
So if your hypothetical weapons master were to say “no no really, it’s safe, just hit them upside the head,” as a rational adult you kinda have to stop and think about it.
And again? My suspicious nature says they hired her specifically because she was inexperienced, and wouldn’t know to push for those more strident safety protocols. Which cost time and energy and get in the way of “artistic” shit.
Knowing that, and knowing that there were prior incidents of accidental discharges… you’d have to be an idiot for taking these people’s word that it was safe.
(Wasn’t Hutchins organizing the Union to strike because of those safety problems? I also dont think it was an accident, but I don’t have more than my gut feeling on that.)
Maybe so, but remember, Baldwin was the one who hired her and fired the gun. So he clearly trusted her to know what she was doing. Was that stupid and negligent on his part because of who he hired? Definitely since it was her second job and there were already complaints about her previous job. Was it stupid and negligent on his part because he trusted the idea that the weapons master made the weapon safe? If so, virtually every Hollywood actor given a gun capable of firing real bullets is just as stupid and negligent.
I really don’t think we should start charging actors for crimes when all they were done was handed the gun and told what to do with it, not expecting to cause anyone any harm.
Charge Baldwin with negligence for being a producer, sure. That’s an entirely different issue.
I think fighting in fight scenes can and often does cause serious injury resulting in hospitalizations, so I’m not sure why you think that’s an especially good argument. It doesn’t have to even be a fight scene. I just read yesterday that Nancy Travis cut her the tip of her finger off with a knife during So I Married an Axe Murderer because she was laughing at what Mike Myers was doing- intentionally making her character laugh in the scene. They could have used a dull knife, but they didn’t.
A better example would be Stallone ending up in the ICU for a week because he wanted the fight at the end of Rocky IV to be realistic, so he told Dolph Lundgren to forget the choreography and Lundgren punched too hard. May I remind you it was Stallone who was directing that movie and still wanted to actually be punched in a boxing ring so he could be in the acting headspace.
There are also character actors like Daniel Day-Lewis who live their characters 24/7 starting long before filming begins and not stopping until it ends. All of his blades in Gangs of New York were razor sharp unless it was known for certain that they would be connecting with someone- but you can’t be certain of that.
That’s just how movies and actors are.
Could they have used a realistic prop gun? That I don’t know about. I would say it would depend on just how realistic we are talking when shot close-up with a high-definition digital camera and blown up to fit an IMAX screen. I’m guessing there gets to be a point where just buying the gun makes more sense than trying to buy a lookalike that looks good enough.
Method acting has its draw backs and one of them is safety.
“That’s just how actors are” is a shitty, pathetic excuse for putting other people at risk.
Particularly when that risk is from a weapon fundamentally designed to kill people, and it certainly doesn’t absolve anyone of criminal liability.
Yes it is, which is why there is a weapon master to (usually) ensure people aren’t put at risk.
Brandon Lee was killed by a gun with dummy bullets. Before that, no one had even thought that sort of thing would happen. Before Rust, no one thought this would happen because no one had been killed by an arms master being this negligent before.
I think things will be different in the future, but expecting an actor to understand the nuances of firearms, let alone be able to do that when they’re trying to prepare for something, should not have been something people should have expected.
And really, your bringing up choreography shows why. Actors are trusting the people who give them the swords that the swords won’t actually cause serious damage. No one is expecting the actors to test that out on watermelons before shooting.
Also, note I have said nothing about criminal liability.
A little curious as to how you make 2-3 pounds of sword-shaped steel “safe”.
It doesn’t matter if it’s not sharp. It’s still going to brain a person if they get hit the wrong way, and any one older than a 10 yo would recognize that the moment they picked it up.
So if your hypothetical weapons master were to say “no no really, it’s safe, just hit them upside the head,” as a rational adult you kinda have to stop and think about it.
And again? My suspicious nature says they hired her specifically because she was inexperienced, and wouldn’t know to push for those more strident safety protocols. Which cost time and energy and get in the way of “artistic” shit.
Knowing that, and knowing that there were prior incidents of accidental discharges… you’d have to be an idiot for taking these people’s word that it was safe.
(Wasn’t Hutchins organizing the Union to strike because of those safety problems? I also dont think it was an accident, but I don’t have more than my gut feeling on that.)
Maybe so, but remember, Baldwin was the one who hired her and fired the gun. So he clearly trusted her to know what she was doing. Was that stupid and negligent on his part because of who he hired? Definitely since it was her second job and there were already complaints about her previous job. Was it stupid and negligent on his part because he trusted the idea that the weapons master made the weapon safe? If so, virtually every Hollywood actor given a gun capable of firing real bullets is just as stupid and negligent.
I really don’t think we should start charging actors for crimes when all they were done was handed the gun and told what to do with it, not expecting to cause anyone any harm.
Charge Baldwin with negligence for being a producer, sure. That’s an entirely different issue.