This debate is so exhausting. Do you understand that people can criticise a specific policy without advocating voting for the other side or not voting at all because of it? Like, do you get that this is NOT an election issue but a policy issue? It is just something that I care about.
There never has been a perfect candidate in the history of human kind.
This isn’t me bitching about universal healthcare or something. This is actually someone arming a genocide. Not “perfect” - yeah no fucking shit we don’t expect that but is the bar really THAT low?
Do you understand that people can criticise a specific policy without advocating voting for the other side or not voting at all because of it?
This might be true to you but not to the readers of your or our posts. These are all public. Any independent reader or any Republican that is swaying to Harris can change their mind on anything, including your post. Your voice has weight.
Like, do you get that this is NOT an election issue but a policy issue? It is just something that I care about.
Then maybe we should just talk about the current sitting president who will be in that position in the next 5 months rather than a VP whose only power is tie breakers in the senate.
This isn’t me bitching about universal healthcare or something. This is actually someone arming a genocide.
I am talking about the same thing. A genocide happened in America by Trump. That is something that can be directly controlled by the next president. Israel has enough money to continue their genocide without the $4 billion that the US gives them. They are killing humanitarians and their own people in Gaza. They only care about end results. Do you really believe Israel will listen to anyone else?
Nobody is forcing you to make it such hard work to have this debate either. So many people just pivot right to the election and then the whole conversation gets derailed. It’s like you need to add voting intention disclaimers if you want to say something as basic as “if you give Israel 2,000 lb dumb bombs you will be helping them kill innocent children. That’s a bad thing.”
Any independent reader or any Republican that is swaying to Harris can change their mind on anything, including your post.
I think our posts aren’t really very impactful. But I see your point. The problem is they would have to be misreading my posts, and I think I’ve been pretty consistent. Vote blue, but push them to be better on this. I have hopes about Walz’s take but I almost don’t want to check if they’re misplaced.
Then maybe we should just talk about the current sitting president who will be in that position in the next 5 months rather than a VP whose only power is tie breakers in the senate.
Yeah I mean why not both? It’s not like the issue will be solved in 5 months so her position also matters. And the idea that this is her only power is a bit misleading, surely? Does she not talk to Biden? Does he not listen to her? Lol
Yeah I mean why not both? It’s not like the issue will be solved in 5 months so her position also matters. And the idea that this is her only power is a bit misleading, surely? Does she not talk to Biden? Does he not listen to her? Lol
According to the news before the nomination, no.
What do you mean?
Article 2 of the Convention defines genocide as:
… any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnic, racial or religious group, as such:
committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnic, racial or religious group, as such:
What Trump did is awful, of course, but was it really committed with this intent in mind?
Like I get what you’re saying, separating families at the border is harmful, cruel and driven by racism. But I’m not sure it counts as genocide. This from the CNN article:
The Physicians for Human Rights likened it to “torture,” and the American Academy of Pediatrics told CNN the Trump administration’s practice of separating families at the border was “child abuse.”
Seems totally fair to me. It is torture. It is abuse. It is callous and disgusting. But I feel like it would be a stretch to call it genocide, particularly with what Israel is doing in mind.
Look at the same list for Israel:
(a) Killing members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.
Since it’s hard to keep up at this point they may have even done the last.
What I’m saying is that for all us that want to stop or at least minimize such horrendous acts, I think there should be a clear priority here. And honestly saying separating families at the border is genocide is really cheapening what genocide means.
But yeah pragmatically speaking there is only one harm it seems possible to stop with the election. UNLESS Harris changes her position, which is a thing she can do. Then we could stop both and to me that is what we should fight for in any way we can.
People don’t like genocide? Pretty straightforward. Some things cannot be excused by “the other side is worse.”
So what are the options? Don’t vote and let the president that created a genocide in the borders of the US win?
There never has been a perfect candidate in the history of human kind.
I like Harris. She’s just shit on this.
This debate is so exhausting. Do you understand that people can criticise a specific policy without advocating voting for the other side or not voting at all because of it? Like, do you get that this is NOT an election issue but a policy issue? It is just something that I care about.
This isn’t me bitching about universal healthcare or something. This is actually someone arming a genocide. Not “perfect” - yeah no fucking shit we don’t expect that but is the bar really THAT low?
Then stop. No one is forcing you to debate.
This might be true to you but not to the readers of your or our posts. These are all public. Any independent reader or any Republican that is swaying to Harris can change their mind on anything, including your post. Your voice has weight.
Then maybe we should just talk about the current sitting president who will be in that position in the next 5 months rather than a VP whose only power is tie breakers in the senate.
I am talking about the same thing. A genocide happened in America by Trump. That is something that can be directly controlled by the next president. Israel has enough money to continue their genocide without the $4 billion that the US gives them. They are killing humanitarians and their own people in Gaza. They only care about end results. Do you really believe Israel will listen to anyone else?
Nobody is forcing you to make it such hard work to have this debate either. So many people just pivot right to the election and then the whole conversation gets derailed. It’s like you need to add voting intention disclaimers if you want to say something as basic as “if you give Israel 2,000 lb dumb bombs you will be helping them kill innocent children. That’s a bad thing.”
I think our posts aren’t really very impactful. But I see your point. The problem is they would have to be misreading my posts, and I think I’ve been pretty consistent. Vote blue, but push them to be better on this. I have hopes about Walz’s take but I almost don’t want to check if they’re misplaced.
Yeah I mean why not both? It’s not like the issue will be solved in 5 months so her position also matters. And the idea that this is her only power is a bit misleading, surely? Does she not talk to Biden? Does he not listen to her? Lol
What do you mean?
According to the news before the nomination, no.
Article 2 of the Convention defines genocide as:
… any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnic, racial or religious group, as such:
(a) Killing members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;. © Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.. — Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide, Article 2.
BBC: ‘Like a kidnapping’: Migrant family separated under Trump reunited after four years
CNN: Families forcibly separated at the border by the Trump administration seeking settlements in ongoing negotiations
What Trump did is awful, of course, but was it really committed with this intent in mind?
Like I get what you’re saying, separating families at the border is harmful, cruel and driven by racism. But I’m not sure it counts as genocide. This from the CNN article:
Seems totally fair to me. It is torture. It is abuse. It is callous and disgusting. But I feel like it would be a stretch to call it genocide, particularly with what Israel is doing in mind.
Look at the same list for Israel:
Since it’s hard to keep up at this point they may have even done the last.
What I’m saying is that for all us that want to stop or at least minimize such horrendous acts, I think there should be a clear priority here. And honestly saying separating families at the border is genocide is really cheapening what genocide means.
But yeah pragmatically speaking there is only one harm it seems possible to stop with the election. UNLESS Harris changes her position, which is a thing she can do. Then we could stop both and to me that is what we should fight for in any way we can.