in some respects, fascism is inevitable as there is no solution to preventing fascism from becoming a thing other than hoping that nobody does a fascism.
In some respects, it’s not worth fighting for because fighting against it only justifies the deluded methods of the fascists at play.
It’s only good/useful in the perspective of the fascist.
Criticizing a non fascist for letting fascism exist is a rather weird response to take when fascism is the literal threat at hand here.
These people love to find new creative ways to say “all we can do is let the fascists fascist, 🤷♂️” then turn around and call people accelerationists for mentioning they listened to a podcast about ww2 that called Hitler a bad guy.
You’re being labeled a fascist sympathizer because you STARTED with calling somebody a tankie for pointing out democrats are complicit in our march toward fascism, then just started slinging every ““centrist”” trope around “I’m not a Republican I just think the real fascists are the people who won’t let fascists overhaul the entire government to their whims, laws morals and standards be damned.”
I’m also not engaging further with you, I just want you to know nobody is buying your bullshit.
You’re being labeled a fascist sympathizer because you STARTED with calling somebody a tankie for pointing out democrats are complicit in our march toward fascism
yeah, that makes sense, but to be clear, someone literally started this thread by bitching about democrats not doing anything. Which has been a quite substantial tankie talking point for the last few years.
then just started slinging every ““centrist”” trope around
you mean the factual problems around dealing with fascism?
“I’m not a Republican I just think the real fascists are the people who won’t let fascists overhaul the entire government to their whims, laws morals and standards be damned.”
where’s my cynical opposition to anti-fascism? I’m politically opposed to the concept of parties fundamentally, antifa doesn’t really fit any of these categories, it’s just a sort of, nebulous concept. It’s interesting, i’m just not sure how much power it has politically. Other than being a thing for republicans to complain about constantly for no reason other than being bad faith.
It’s defeatist in nature, but how are you supposed to deal with fascism? There is no good way to deal with fascism other than using brute force and military. Which literally only bolsters their political agenda. The other option is to stop it before it’s born, but good luck with that one lol.
There are also a lot of problems with shutting down certain speech as well, especially in a place like america where free speech is a thing that we have. It may be ruled constitutional to be fascist. Likewise, voting for fascism may be constitutional as well, so it may be completely legal for fascism to be in power in the US. The only opposition here is literally the public, and we all know how well that goes with fascism historically.
i want to hear your tankie ass explain how fascism is “removed” from society.
antifa
Hm, funny, I don’t seem to remember mentioning antifa…
There is no good way to deal with fascism other than using brute force and military.
Fascism doesn’t become an unstoppable force overnight without first having been enabled and appeased in at least the decades leading up. I’m sorry that you don’t have the understanding, motivation, or imagination to ask for any intervention before this point, from people who have real power to intervene.
You still haven’t answered my question.
I’m not the person you asked, nor do I have the answers to the universe, and I suspect that they do not either. Sure would be nice if our elected officials would do literally anything in the face of clear power grabs, though, and stand up for what their voters actually want instead of counting on the other team being worse. If I’m a tankie just for asking that of our representatives, then so be it.
“Hm, funny, I don’t seem to remember mentioning antifa…”
fascinating, technically not quite the same, but antifa isn’t exactly structured enough to make it much different anyway.
I don’t recall saying anything negative about antifa specifically either.
Fascism doesn’t become an unstoppable force overnight without first having been enabled and appeased in at least the decades leading up. I’m sorry that you don’t have the understanding, motivation, or imagination to ask for any intervention before this point, from people who have real power to intervene.
yeah, that’s kind of the problem no? This is why i’m asking how we deal with it, you still havent proposed a reasonable answer to this problem. This is literally the boiling frog problem.
There are a couple of options, you could make fascist far right politics fundamentally illegal like in germany. Oh wait, the far right still exists over there. And like i said, in a place like america, you’re probably going to run into problems with free speech.
fascism isn’t exactly externally enabled, aside from any outside “stopping force” which is also arguably, fascist in some capacity. The vast majority of the enabling comes from within the party, and it builds slowly over time, eventually reaching a point where people realize. “hey we’re in a pot of boiling water and i think we’re about to die” or “hey uh, we’re murdering jews now? That’s uh, not cool”
like what are you expecting us to do? Act like the mother of a bad child at the sign of any inkling of fascism and go “hey guys, i see that you’re doing a fascism here, maybe uh, you shouldn’t be doing this?”
I’m not the person you asked, nor do I have the answers to the universe, and I suspect that they do not either.
that’s fine, neither do i, and this would be the reason i asked them. But i find it counter productive to complain about shit tangential to really big problems, without being able to propose a solution. There’s a discussion to be had here about the lack of concern over the rise of fascism, but i don’t think blaming the democrats for the entirety of it is the answer to that question.
Sure would be nice if our elected officials would do literally anything in the face of clear power grabs
that would certainly be nice, and let me remind you, we tried to impeach trump twice the people who got in the way were republicans, both times. The second one was literally because “you can’t impeach a non sitting president” which is stupid.
EVERY case of his currently in the courts is being constantly delayed by his lawyers, the supreme court, the judges even. LITERALLY EVERYTHING conservatives can put in the way of it, is being put in the way of it right now.
i mean an ENTIRE state, tried to remove him from their ballot.
we’re TRYING to do things, but the primary stopping force, is actually republicans.
If I’m a tankie just for asking that of our representatives, then so be it.
i don’t think that makes you a tankie alone, considering that even the republicans are our representatives, but blaming the democrats, when they seemingly keep trying to stop a second trump term from being a possibility, continually get shut down by republicans through the process, it seems either extremely ignorant to me, or conveniently ignorant to the point where you can advance a tankie line of reasoning complaining about democrats and calling them just as bad if not worse than republicans, even though that’s patently false. (this part specifically being tankie)
Your assumption is that fascism is… inevitable? non-existent? not worth fighting? …good or useful, even?
Just trying to pin your motivation in calling someone a tankie just for pointing out passive enablement of fascism…
in some respects, fascism is inevitable as there is no solution to preventing fascism from becoming a thing other than hoping that nobody does a fascism.
In some respects, it’s not worth fighting for because fighting against it only justifies the deluded methods of the fascists at play.
It’s only good/useful in the perspective of the fascist.
Criticizing a non fascist for letting fascism exist is a rather weird response to take when fascism is the literal threat at hand here.
Your full-on defeatism when it comes to fascists but rabid and cynical opposition to simple expressions of anti-fascism is pretty telling in itself.
Yeah, I’m not engaging this any further. Ick.
These people love to find new creative ways to say “all we can do is let the fascists fascist, 🤷♂️” then turn around and call people accelerationists for mentioning they listened to a podcast about ww2 that called Hitler a bad guy.
not unlike how i’m being labelled a fascist sympathizer in this case either. Gotta love politics.
You’re being labeled a fascist sympathizer because you STARTED with calling somebody a tankie for pointing out democrats are complicit in our march toward fascism, then just started slinging every ““centrist”” trope around “I’m not a Republican I just think the real fascists are the people who won’t let fascists overhaul the entire government to their whims, laws morals and standards be damned.”
I’m also not engaging further with you, I just want you to know nobody is buying your bullshit.
yeah, that makes sense, but to be clear, someone literally started this thread by bitching about democrats not doing anything. Which has been a quite substantial tankie talking point for the last few years.
you mean the factual problems around dealing with fascism?
i don’t recall saying this.
where’s my cynical opposition to anti-fascism? I’m politically opposed to the concept of parties fundamentally, antifa doesn’t really fit any of these categories, it’s just a sort of, nebulous concept. It’s interesting, i’m just not sure how much power it has politically. Other than being a thing for republicans to complain about constantly for no reason other than being bad faith.
It’s defeatist in nature, but how are you supposed to deal with fascism? There is no good way to deal with fascism other than using brute force and military. Which literally only bolsters their political agenda. The other option is to stop it before it’s born, but good luck with that one lol.
There are also a lot of problems with shutting down certain speech as well, especially in a place like america where free speech is a thing that we have. It may be ruled constitutional to be fascist. Likewise, voting for fascism may be constitutional as well, so it may be completely legal for fascism to be in power in the US. The only opposition here is literally the public, and we all know how well that goes with fascism historically.
You still haven’t answered my question.
Hm, funny, I don’t seem to remember mentioning antifa…
Fascism doesn’t become an unstoppable force overnight without first having been enabled and appeased in at least the decades leading up. I’m sorry that you don’t have the understanding, motivation, or imagination to ask for any intervention before this point, from people who have real power to intervene.
I’m not the person you asked, nor do I have the answers to the universe, and I suspect that they do not either. Sure would be nice if our elected officials would do literally anything in the face of clear power grabs, though, and stand up for what their voters actually want instead of counting on the other team being worse. If I’m a tankie just for asking that of our representatives, then so be it.
“Hm, funny, I don’t seem to remember mentioning antifa…”
fascinating, technically not quite the same, but antifa isn’t exactly structured enough to make it much different anyway.
I don’t recall saying anything negative about antifa specifically either.
yeah, that’s kind of the problem no? This is why i’m asking how we deal with it, you still havent proposed a reasonable answer to this problem. This is literally the boiling frog problem.
There are a couple of options, you could make fascist far right politics fundamentally illegal like in germany. Oh wait, the far right still exists over there. And like i said, in a place like america, you’re probably going to run into problems with free speech.
fascism isn’t exactly externally enabled, aside from any outside “stopping force” which is also arguably, fascist in some capacity. The vast majority of the enabling comes from within the party, and it builds slowly over time, eventually reaching a point where people realize. “hey we’re in a pot of boiling water and i think we’re about to die” or “hey uh, we’re murdering jews now? That’s uh, not cool”
like what are you expecting us to do? Act like the mother of a bad child at the sign of any inkling of fascism and go “hey guys, i see that you’re doing a fascism here, maybe uh, you shouldn’t be doing this?”
that’s fine, neither do i, and this would be the reason i asked them. But i find it counter productive to complain about shit tangential to really big problems, without being able to propose a solution. There’s a discussion to be had here about the lack of concern over the rise of fascism, but i don’t think blaming the democrats for the entirety of it is the answer to that question.
that would certainly be nice, and let me remind you, we tried to impeach trump twice the people who got in the way were republicans, both times. The second one was literally because “you can’t impeach a non sitting president” which is stupid.
EVERY case of his currently in the courts is being constantly delayed by his lawyers, the supreme court, the judges even. LITERALLY EVERYTHING conservatives can put in the way of it, is being put in the way of it right now.
i mean an ENTIRE state, tried to remove him from their ballot.
we’re TRYING to do things, but the primary stopping force, is actually republicans.
i don’t think that makes you a tankie alone, considering that even the republicans are our representatives, but blaming the democrats, when they seemingly keep trying to stop a second trump term from being a possibility, continually get shut down by republicans through the process, it seems either extremely ignorant to me, or conveniently ignorant to the point where you can advance a tankie line of reasoning complaining about democrats and calling them just as bad if not worse than republicans, even though that’s patently false. (this part specifically being tankie)