• OBJECTION!
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    -53 months ago

    My point that any peace agreement will contain the possibility of future conflict, so pointing that out is not a valid criticism of a specific hypothetical peace agreement.

    Yes, if Ukraine agrees to some territorial concessions, it won’t guarantee peace for a thousand years. If they reclaimed all their territory, it wouldn’t do that either. But it would stop the killing and could provide the framework for a lasting peace. That’s a better deal for the average Ukrainian that being drafted and thrown into a warzone to reclaim some rubble.

    • Flying SquidM
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      113 months ago

      Russia giving back all the territory they took would also be a framework for lasting peace. You, once again, are saying Russia should get everything and Ukraine nothing.

      • OBJECTION!
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        -23 months ago

        Russia giving back all the territory they took would also be a framework for lasting peace.

        Yes, it would be. Assuming the civil war was also resolved. The problem is that getting there requires throwing a ton of more lives into the meat grinder, which is worse for the Ukrainian people than accepting territorial concessions.

        • Flying SquidM
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          53 months ago

          A withdrawal as part of a negotiated treaty would kill more Ukrainian people? How?

          • OBJECTION!
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            -33 months ago

            What’s your plan for getting Putin to agree to such a proposal?

            • Flying SquidM
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              63 months ago

              Russia returns to the borders that were negotiated with Ukraine after they gained independence, borders they agreed not to cross if Ukraine gave up its nuclear weapons, and in return the world will lift sanctions against Russia. Everyone gains.

              • OBJECTION!
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                -43 months ago

                Russia isn’t going to accept those terms, it’s unrealistic.

                • Flying SquidM
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                  93 months ago

                  It’s unrealistic to expect Putin to accept any terms beyond “Ukraine is Russia’s,” but you were talking about negotiations as if he were willing to negotiate.

                  • OBJECTION!
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                    3 months ago

                    Neither part of that is remotely true. Putin has not claimed all of Ukraine, and he has offered to negotiate. For example.

                    It’s Ukraine and the US that have refused to negotiate.