You know what’s another really edgelord (not “edge lord”) thing?
To not answer questions put to you after you pretend to be a master debater.
Perhaps it’s because you literally can’t answer any of those questions, because they show what a bad faith actor you are.
No answers about the books, after having asked for them. Have you read the list of books you linked? Ofc you haven’t. You yourself admit you asked for books I had read, then somehow think a list of books from an Amazon search is related?
The wars for drugs weren’t wars on drugs, but for them, silly.
All in all, you need to up your game. (Thinking you “win” a debate by loudly yelling "fallacy! Hahahah, so good)
Well, if you don’t think you’re “debating”, why did you answer by quoting something I said and then just writing “fallacious”? I’ll tell you. Because first off, you don’t know philosophy and thought pointing out a fallacy means you “win” the conversation.
I haven’t refused to answer any of your questions, buddy boy, you just keep shifting your goalposts. Maybe you’ve heard of that expression when larping a philosopher?
You asked for books. That was the first question you had, after I said I can provide literature. You then arbitrarily asked for ten books, supposing I haven’t read ten books on the subject. (If narratives are included, I definitely have.) I then provided a lot of literature, emphasising the book “Good Cop, Bad War”, which highlights how the drug war has worked and what is has done, and why it is that it exists in the first place. You can read a lot of that from Noam Chomsky as well, as the “War ON drugs” (not war for drugs, like the opium wars you referred to) began in the States, and Chomsky is really good at breaking down internal US politics of the time.
But you’re not looking to discuss the subject, because you know you’re wrong, so you can’t address it, because you’re not a big enough person to actually admit when someone else makes a good point or proves you wrong. Perhaps you got too much of that in real life and now thought that you wouldn’t have to take any online. Well, you know, if you keep being wrong so stubbornly, and using “fallacies” to “debate” then, you’re gonna have to learn to accept people calling you out on it.
When people read this thread, who do you think they will think is serious about having a conversation; the guy actually recapping the essence of the conversation, and trying to continue it, or the asshat who keeps trying extremely juvenile “tactics” like yelling “fallacy”, saying “you haven’t answered my (bad faith) questions” (which I have) and absolutely refusing to address the subject.
You asked for books. That was the first question you had, after I said I can provide literature. You then arbitrarily asked for ten books, supposing I haven’t read ten books on the subject. (If narratives are included, I definitely have.) I then provided a lot of literature, emphasising the book “Good Cop, Bad War”, which highlights how the drug war has worked and what is has done, and why it is that it exists in the first place. You can read a lot of that from Noam Chomsky as well, as the “War ON drugs” (not war for drugs, like the opium wars you referred to) began in the States, and Chomsky is really good at breaking down internal US politics of the time.
You said stupid shit and now you’re too ashamed to back it up because you know you can’t, but you’re also afraid of “not getting the last word.”
You can’t address the book and literature I mentioned, despite asking for them.
You conflated wars FOR opium to The War ON Drugs. All these silly things you ignore, because you’re not a big enough person to admit to mistakes, even on a pseudonymous forum. I wish I could say I was surprised, but I’m really not. Kids like you are a dime a dozen.
You asked for books. That was the first question you had,
From the top:
Did you ever stop to think that the propaganda you speak of is directly influenced by exactly what steeznson was speaking about?
First question asked.
Why do you believe that anti-drug propaganda only began in the 20th century?
Second.
Do you have anything other than wikipedia links to back your stance up? Say, a real study done on the impacts of anti-drug propaganda through the ages which demonstrates that the 20th century was the most militant with it?
Third.
Do you know what Religion is, and its impacts on anti-drug mentalities predating the 20th century?
Fourth.
Then you said this:
If you’re honestly interested, you can find tons of literature.
and I said, without posing a question:
Name 10 books on the subject including the authors.
A strong reader would notice the lack of “?” at the end of that sentence, meaning it wasn’t a “question”.
Do you understand how punctuation works?
Did you forget that I said I would be ignoring you moving forward? Which to clarify doesn’t mean I won’t respond. It means I will ignore what you are saying and respond to whatever catches my fancy. Which is obviously making you big mad.
I find it quite funny, which is the only reason I am choosing to continue. You are a joke to me and as long as you keep delivering the punchlines, I will keep coming back with responses that fire you up.
It is funny that you think I am debating you, or that I owe you an answer to any of your questions when you refuse to answer mine.
Isn’t it just?
Because someone listing things like that, answering with oneliners, while yelling out “fallacy” to “win” a debate, isn’t “debating”? Sure, buddy, sure.
Did you ever stop to think that the propaganda you speak of is directly influenced by exactly what steeznson was speaking about?
Do you know what a rhetorical question is? Are you pretending you’re really looking for a yes or no answer to your rhetorical question? The answer to your RHETORICAL question is “yes.” Happy? (“Rhetorical” doesn’t mean “not waiting for an answer” btw, which I’m sure you think it does.)
Why do you believe that anti-drug propaganda only began in the 20th century?
Perhaps read my comments again to know why I haven’t answered a question asking me about a thing I didn’t say? If you want to be petty and childish about taking things literally and not having a reasonable discussion, then really, why would you ask something this stupid?
Do you know what Religion is, and its impacts on anti-drug mentalities predating the 20th century?
I’ve answered that several times. Even in a comment of it’s own that had nothing else in it. Why do you keep ignoring my reply?
If you’re honestly interested, you can find tons of literature.
And I stand by that and provided you that literature, which you’ve ignored now for several days, because you weren’t asking in good faith. You didn’t actually want to know any, you’re just being a childish c**t who thought asking for “ten books” would be some sort of impossible intellectual criteria you thought I couldn’t manage. Which definitely tells a lot about what you consider to be “a lot of books.” How many books you read in a year? I’m thinking you’re of the generation who doesn’t read books at all, which is why you asked, but now can’t actually discuss the literature which you asked for.
A strong reader would notice the lack of “?” at the end of that sentence, meaning it wasn’t a “question”.
It’s honestly getting to be a bit annoying how childish you’re being.
Did you forget that I said I would be ignoring you moving forward?
No, but I’ve had this same exact conversation a billion times (yes, that is metaphorical, not literal), and kids like you always get pissy, start trying to “win” by yelling out “fallacy” (not realising that even if logic was fallacious doesn’t mean the conclusion is wrong), ignoring every single idiotic mistake you make, and then going “I’m done, you’re not worth it” while constantly returning to answer and so desperately trying to “get the last word.” That’s exactly who you are. Like I said, kids like you are a dime in a dozen. You need to up your game.
You literally referenced Opium Wars, thinking they’re the same thing as the war ON drugs. They were wars FOR drugs. Not understanding the difference between “for” and “on” doesn’t suggest strong reading abilities, does it?
To not answer questions put to you after you pretend to be a master debater.
not answering questions, especially loaded or irrelevant ones, is a great debate strategy.
edit:
while i think they are picking a semantic fight about a topic on which they are not prepare to engage, your engagement has been kind of shitty toward them, too. i think you could be better and still show that they are silly and ignorant of the topic.
your engagement has been kind of shitty toward them, too
Oh I don’t deny that for a second. I’m very fed up with people who get snarky like that over the drug war. It’s because of the drug propaganda. Even people who use them themselves, have this inbuilt aversion to even thinking about drug legalisation. Genuinely, I’ve had the conversation with hundreds of people in real life, and it’s just something… insidious. So I fight it whenever I can, and there’s no irl social repercussions for being a dick on Lemmy, so if he’s being a dick and defending the prohibition of drugs — even if they actually oppose it, as they admit — I am going to respond with the same measure.
This is an exaggeration, but I genuinely believe that a complete reform of drug laws is essential to the entire planet. Basically all crime funds itself through illegal drugs, so we’d basically take out drug cartels by legalising drugs, and through that, all the other shit that’s adjacent. A metric fuckton of crime would just up and vanish, basically. As the drug trade will exist, legal or not, but if it’s legal, there’s legal ways to go about it, so deals can be made, contracts drawn up, and if people break them or don’t pay, one can use the legal system to get one’s dues. When it’s illegal, you just have to hammer a guy’s knees, because you can’t put the drug debt into an official system, but you can’t let a guy go either, nor can you go to the police and say he’s stolen from you.
And that’s just the first part.
Because have you ever been in any event that people mainly used ecstasy in? Just… no-one is angry. No violence. Complete opposite of a regular Saturday night in a Finnish bar which is full of implied threats and menacing looks.
I’m not saying everyone should do ecstasy, but I am saying that when given a choice, a lot of people I know would prefer ecstasy if it was socially acceptable (they use maybe 1-2 times a year, go to an event of some sort, so as to not be in the local clubs). And going by the literature in psychiatric and psychological treatments which use psychedelics/mdma, they could be amazingly helpful to the global community. I once actually made a video called “make Trump do LSD”. I stand by the sentiment, but the video was shit.
Anyway, even those mates who go to some ecstasy gigs a few times a year, they got really upset one time when we started talking about it. Which to me is just crazy. They know. They use the drugs. But when I asked why, it was a plethora of the same indirect, vague prohibition supporting bullshit, which comes through the shitty drug war propaganda.
I really think you should lay down for that nap, or perhaps, get your bottle. Anything to help this tantrum you are throwing.
You know what’s another really edgelord (not “edge lord”) thing?
To not answer questions put to you after you pretend to be a master debater.
Perhaps it’s because you literally can’t answer any of those questions, because they show what a bad faith actor you are.
No answers about the books, after having asked for them. Have you read the list of books you linked? Ofc you haven’t. You yourself admit you asked for books I had read, then somehow think a list of books from an Amazon search is related?
The wars for drugs weren’t wars on drugs, but for them, silly.
All in all, you need to up your game. (Thinking you “win” a debate by loudly yelling "fallacy! Hahahah, so good)
It is funny that you think I am debating you, or that I owe you an answer to any of your questions when you refuse to answer mine.
You really have to get over the book thing. I get it, you don’t read as much as you claim but that is no reason to behave this way.
Take a breather bud. This is no good for you.
Well, if you don’t think you’re “debating”, why did you answer by quoting something I said and then just writing “fallacious”? I’ll tell you. Because first off, you don’t know philosophy and thought pointing out a fallacy means you “win” the conversation.
I haven’t refused to answer any of your questions, buddy boy, you just keep shifting your goalposts. Maybe you’ve heard of that expression when larping a philosopher?
You asked for books. That was the first question you had, after I said I can provide literature. You then arbitrarily asked for ten books, supposing I haven’t read ten books on the subject. (If narratives are included, I definitely have.) I then provided a lot of literature, emphasising the book “Good Cop, Bad War”, which highlights how the drug war has worked and what is has done, and why it is that it exists in the first place. You can read a lot of that from Noam Chomsky as well, as the “War ON drugs” (not war for drugs, like the opium wars you referred to) began in the States, and Chomsky is really good at breaking down internal US politics of the time.
But you’re not looking to discuss the subject, because you know you’re wrong, so you can’t address it, because you’re not a big enough person to actually admit when someone else makes a good point or proves you wrong. Perhaps you got too much of that in real life and now thought that you wouldn’t have to take any online. Well, you know, if you keep being wrong so stubbornly, and using “fallacies” to “debate” then, you’re gonna have to learn to accept people calling you out on it.
You say all of this like it is impossible to scroll back up the thread and see exactly what happened.
Fucking again. Why do you keep doing this?
When people read this thread, who do you think they will think is serious about having a conversation; the guy actually recapping the essence of the conversation, and trying to continue it, or the asshat who keeps trying extremely juvenile “tactics” like yelling “fallacy”, saying “you haven’t answered my (bad faith) questions” (which I have) and absolutely refusing to address the subject.
You asked for books. That was the first question you had, after I said I can provide literature. You then arbitrarily asked for ten books, supposing I haven’t read ten books on the subject. (If narratives are included, I definitely have.) I then provided a lot of literature, emphasising the book “Good Cop, Bad War”, which highlights how the drug war has worked and what is has done, and why it is that it exists in the first place. You can read a lot of that from Noam Chomsky as well, as the “War ON drugs” (not war for drugs, like the opium wars you referred to) began in the States, and Chomsky is really good at breaking down internal US politics of the time.
You said stupid shit and now you’re too ashamed to back it up because you know you can’t, but you’re also afraid of “not getting the last word.”
You can’t address the book and literature I mentioned, despite asking for them.
You conflated wars FOR opium to The War ON Drugs. All these silly things you ignore, because you’re not a big enough person to admit to mistakes, even on a pseudonymous forum. I wish I could say I was surprised, but I’m really not. Kids like you are a dime a dozen.
From the top:
First question asked.
Second.
Third.
Fourth.
Then you said this:
and I said, without posing a question:
A strong reader would notice the lack of “?” at the end of that sentence, meaning it wasn’t a “question”.
Do you understand how punctuation works?
Did you forget that I said I would be ignoring you moving forward? Which to clarify doesn’t mean I won’t respond. It means I will ignore what you are saying and respond to whatever catches my fancy. Which is obviously making you big mad.
I find it quite funny, which is the only reason I am choosing to continue. You are a joke to me and as long as you keep delivering the punchlines, I will keep coming back with responses that fire you up.
Isn’t it just?
Because someone listing things like that, answering with oneliners, while yelling out “fallacy” to “win” a debate, isn’t “debating”? Sure, buddy, sure.
Do you know what a rhetorical question is? Are you pretending you’re really looking for a yes or no answer to your rhetorical question? The answer to your RHETORICAL question is “yes.” Happy? (“Rhetorical” doesn’t mean “not waiting for an answer” btw, which I’m sure you think it does.)
Perhaps read my comments again to know why I haven’t answered a question asking me about a thing I didn’t say? If you want to be petty and childish about taking things literally and not having a reasonable discussion, then really, why would you ask something this stupid?
I’ve answered that several times. Even in a comment of it’s own that had nothing else in it. Why do you keep ignoring my reply?
And I stand by that and provided you that literature, which you’ve ignored now for several days, because you weren’t asking in good faith. You didn’t actually want to know any, you’re just being a childish c**t who thought asking for “ten books” would be some sort of impossible intellectual criteria you thought I couldn’t manage. Which definitely tells a lot about what you consider to be “a lot of books.” How many books you read in a year? I’m thinking you’re of the generation who doesn’t read books at all, which is why you asked, but now can’t actually discuss the literature which you asked for.
It’s honestly getting to be a bit annoying how childish you’re being.
No, but I’ve had this same exact conversation a billion times (yes, that is metaphorical, not literal), and kids like you always get pissy, start trying to “win” by yelling out “fallacy” (not realising that even if logic was fallacious doesn’t mean the conclusion is wrong), ignoring every single idiotic mistake you make, and then going “I’m done, you’re not worth it” while constantly returning to answer and so desperately trying to “get the last word.” That’s exactly who you are. Like I said, kids like you are a dime in a dozen. You need to up your game.
You literally referenced Opium Wars, thinking they’re the same thing as the war ON drugs. They were wars FOR drugs. Not understanding the difference between “for” and “on” doesn’t suggest strong reading abilities, does it?
I think you are missing the real question here. How much wood would a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck could chuck wood?
not answering questions, especially loaded or irrelevant ones, is a great debate strategy.
edit:
while i think they are picking a semantic fight about a topic on which they are not prepare to engage, your engagement has been kind of shitty toward them, too. i think you could be better and still show that they are silly and ignorant of the topic.
Oh I don’t deny that for a second. I’m very fed up with people who get snarky like that over the drug war. It’s because of the drug propaganda. Even people who use them themselves, have this inbuilt aversion to even thinking about drug legalisation. Genuinely, I’ve had the conversation with hundreds of people in real life, and it’s just something… insidious. So I fight it whenever I can, and there’s no irl social repercussions for being a dick on Lemmy, so if he’s being a dick and defending the prohibition of drugs — even if they actually oppose it, as they admit — I am going to respond with the same measure.
This is an exaggeration, but I genuinely believe that a complete reform of drug laws is essential to the entire planet. Basically all crime funds itself through illegal drugs, so we’d basically take out drug cartels by legalising drugs, and through that, all the other shit that’s adjacent. A metric fuckton of crime would just up and vanish, basically. As the drug trade will exist, legal or not, but if it’s legal, there’s legal ways to go about it, so deals can be made, contracts drawn up, and if people break them or don’t pay, one can use the legal system to get one’s dues. When it’s illegal, you just have to hammer a guy’s knees, because you can’t put the drug debt into an official system, but you can’t let a guy go either, nor can you go to the police and say he’s stolen from you.
And that’s just the first part.
Because have you ever been in any event that people mainly used ecstasy in? Just… no-one is angry. No violence. Complete opposite of a regular Saturday night in a Finnish bar which is full of implied threats and menacing looks.
I’m not saying everyone should do ecstasy, but I am saying that when given a choice, a lot of people I know would prefer ecstasy if it was socially acceptable (they use maybe 1-2 times a year, go to an event of some sort, so as to not be in the local clubs). And going by the literature in psychiatric and psychological treatments which use psychedelics/mdma, they could be amazingly helpful to the global community. I once actually made a video called “make Trump do LSD”. I stand by the sentiment, but the video was shit.
Anyway, even those mates who go to some ecstasy gigs a few times a year, they got really upset one time when we started talking about it. Which to me is just crazy. They know. They use the drugs. But when I asked why, it was a plethora of the same indirect, vague prohibition supporting bullshit, which comes through the shitty drug war propaganda.