I mean I get where you’re coming from but you can’t honestly expect the people of Lebanon to be sympathetic to the Israeli’s given the events of the past 2 weeks.
Hezbollah have had this coming, they fired rockets at Israel on October 8th. So not because of what Israel was doing to the Palestinians, but in support of what Hamas did on October 7th.
I can’t bring myself to mourn for people like Nasrallah. That said things are undeniably going to get a lot worse for everybody before they get better.
I don’t see any indication of a reasonable end goal from Israel. They’ve remained uncommitted on an exit strategy from Gaza and opening a front in Lebanon rather then helping the security situation is as likely to get them bogged down in a quagmire. From what I can gather anyway they’re just going balls the wall trying to eliminate as many of Iran’s proxies as they can before they bow to international pressure like they historically have whenever things “escalate” too much
Wars have to end. If you go into them without an exit strategy they will backfire. Right now Israel’s government seems more concerned with keeping Bibi out of jail then it does with crafting any sort of humane way out of this mess.
The moment the first news dropped on October 7 it was clear Israel was to retaliate with a bloodbath and they started bombing Gaza the same evening. If Hezbollahs goal at the time was to make use of the situation, they would have went for an all out attack while IDF was in disarray.
The goal was to increase the pressure on Israel for reaching a cease-fire agreement through keeping their northern settlers out of their settlements, rendering the region economically inactive and the settlers angry at their government.
It seems like no one anticipated this to go into a yearlong war. Initially Hamas seemed to have aimed to reach a ceasefire quickly through a hostage exchange deal, but Israel put genocide over having their hostages return alive.
There’s been no evidence of genocide. I have plenty of criticisms of the Israeli government, and if you were arguing it’s indiscriminate you’d have a point. But genocide? No. We don’t call Hiroshima a genocide and that was far worse than what’s happening in Gaza. We don’t call Dresden a genocide. We don’t call shock and awe in Iraq a genocide.
The rate of bombing in Gaza has drastically slowed compared to the opening stages of the war. Israel can be accused of being too blase about civilian death, but there is no evidence of systematic attempts to eradicate the Arab population entirely. I have yet to see any credible evidence of anything but Israel having a disturbing willingness to kill 10 to get 1, if you get me. That’s horrific enough, you don’t need to exaggerate it by calling it genocide. There’s plenty of legitimate enough concerns about Israel’s bombing campaign without resorting to sensationalism.
Huge, huge, difference between not caring if you hit the next building by accident in an otherwise precise airstrike, and rounding up and killing them all. You should account for the inherent destructiveness of modern urban warfare also. Go on google earth and look at what the Russians did to cities in East Ukraine. Just because something is horrible, tragic, awful, doesn’t make it a genocide. It is impossible to fight a war against an entity like Hamas and not have innocent people hit in the crossfire. Israel is in an unwinnable position in that sense. It either lets hamas terrorize it’s population, or it fires back and risks killing innocent people.
It’s a complex situation is what I’m getting it. Let’s not pretend it’s anything else to suit some juvenile good/bad narrative
If your response to a disagreement about olive groves in the west Bank is to rape and murder 1200 innocent people I’m gonna go out on a limb and say you probably shouldn’t get the olives
You literally just reduced people’s entire lives and livelihoods to “olive groves” to justify everything they’ve been going through for decades. No matter which way you put it, that was an incredibly shitty thing to say. Not to mention just plain wrong and evil.
Would you say the same about the 70+ years of prosecution and crimes inflicted on the Israelis on the Palestinian population? That’s there’s no justifying it?
I don’t think standing up for human rights violations is a dumb thing to do. And Israel started this war. They didn’t have to slaughter innocent civilians indiscriminately, but Israel did. They didn’t have to assassinate key figures, perform acts of terror like blowing up pagers, or attack civilian areas in Lebanon. But Israel did do all that. They started this war, and they’re just crying victim because people are actually calling them out on their bs and fighting back.
Groups like Hezbollah don’t believe in human rights. They do not care if innocent people die. Their problem with Israel is not that it’s oppressive, they love oppressive regimes (Iran, Russia). Hezbollah engages in assassinations in Lebanon and abroad frequently. I can go on but my point is you don’t know who these people are or what they believe.
Groups like Hamas and Hezbollah believe in a borderless global theocracy. They believe in a world of public executions and state sponsored brutality against anybody who argues. They are authoritarians, human rights are western philosophical nonsense to them. Unislamic alien beliefs. They simply do not believe in equality or the sanctity of life.
Their problem with Israel is solely that Israel is Jewish.
If Hezbollah doesn’t care about civilian casualties, then why do they almost exclusively target military bases? Israel has no moral authority on this topic either. There have been civilian casualties virtually every day for the past year as they try to wipe out the Palestinian population. Israel also makes up approximately 80% of the attacks that have been between Hezbollah and Israel.
The BBC has some video. Looks like some missiles are being intercepted, some hitting.
https://www.bbc.com/news/live/cg4qx62kkxxt
BBC: “celebratory gunfire” in Beiruit.
What a fucked up part of the world.
Edit: the celebratory part isn’t fucked up. The doing it by shooting guns in the air is.
I mean I get where you’re coming from but you can’t honestly expect the people of Lebanon to be sympathetic to the Israeli’s given the events of the past 2 weeks.
It’s not the celebration. It’s the celebratory gunfire.
By all means, celebrate. Maybe don’t do it in a way that can hurt other people.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celebratory_gunfire#Injuries
Parts of the US are no better.
https://apnews.com/article/grandson-shot-wedding-nebraska-texas-d615b0e20718c07fb9820d2dc1d05d12
If you want me to claim that the U.S. is not also a fucked-up part of the world, you have come to the wrong person.
Oh. Yeah, I agree with you. My bad, misinterpreted your comment.
Sorry. Edited to clarify.
Hezbollah have had this coming, they fired rockets at Israel on October 8th. So not because of what Israel was doing to the Palestinians, but in support of what Hamas did on October 7th.
I can’t bring myself to mourn for people like Nasrallah. That said things are undeniably going to get a lot worse for everybody before they get better.
I don’t see any indication of a reasonable end goal from Israel. They’ve remained uncommitted on an exit strategy from Gaza and opening a front in Lebanon rather then helping the security situation is as likely to get them bogged down in a quagmire. From what I can gather anyway they’re just going balls the wall trying to eliminate as many of Iran’s proxies as they can before they bow to international pressure like they historically have whenever things “escalate” too much
Wars have to end. If you go into them without an exit strategy they will backfire. Right now Israel’s government seems more concerned with keeping Bibi out of jail then it does with crafting any sort of humane way out of this mess.
As long as Israel is occupying land, they are in constant state of war
The moment the first news dropped on October 7 it was clear Israel was to retaliate with a bloodbath and they started bombing Gaza the same evening. If Hezbollahs goal at the time was to make use of the situation, they would have went for an all out attack while IDF was in disarray.
The goal was to increase the pressure on Israel for reaching a cease-fire agreement through keeping their northern settlers out of their settlements, rendering the region economically inactive and the settlers angry at their government.
It seems like no one anticipated this to go into a yearlong war. Initially Hamas seemed to have aimed to reach a ceasefire quickly through a hostage exchange deal, but Israel put genocide over having their hostages return alive.
There’s been no evidence of genocide. I have plenty of criticisms of the Israeli government, and if you were arguing it’s indiscriminate you’d have a point. But genocide? No. We don’t call Hiroshima a genocide and that was far worse than what’s happening in Gaza. We don’t call Dresden a genocide. We don’t call shock and awe in Iraq a genocide.
Words have meaning.
Rights expert finds ‘reasonable grounds’ genocide is being committed in Gaza: https://news.un.org/en/story/2024/03/1147976
Human Rights Watch founder accuses Israel of genocide: https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p0j1rk0c
A top U.N. court says Gaza genocide is ‘plausible’ but does not order cease-fire: https://www.npr.org/2024/01/26/1227078791/icj-israel-genocide-gaza-palestinians-south-africa
The rate of bombing in Gaza has drastically slowed compared to the opening stages of the war. Israel can be accused of being too blase about civilian death, but there is no evidence of systematic attempts to eradicate the Arab population entirely. I have yet to see any credible evidence of anything but Israel having a disturbing willingness to kill 10 to get 1, if you get me. That’s horrific enough, you don’t need to exaggerate it by calling it genocide. There’s plenty of legitimate enough concerns about Israel’s bombing campaign without resorting to sensationalism.
Huge, huge, difference between not caring if you hit the next building by accident in an otherwise precise airstrike, and rounding up and killing them all. You should account for the inherent destructiveness of modern urban warfare also. Go on google earth and look at what the Russians did to cities in East Ukraine. Just because something is horrible, tragic, awful, doesn’t make it a genocide. It is impossible to fight a war against an entity like Hamas and not have innocent people hit in the crossfire. Israel is in an unwinnable position in that sense. It either lets hamas terrorize it’s population, or it fires back and risks killing innocent people.
It’s a complex situation is what I’m getting it. Let’s not pretend it’s anything else to suit some juvenile good/bad narrative
Juvenile? I gave you expert opinions.
“Something something, make excuses for terrorists.”
You understand October 7 was hamas response to Israeli settlers continually invading and stealing Gaza land, right?
This did not “begin” October 7th.
Israeli settler terrorists are just as bad as hezbollah.
If your response to a disagreement about olive groves in the west Bank is to rape and murder 1200 innocent people I’m gonna go out on a limb and say you probably shouldn’t get the olives
You literally just reduced people’s entire lives and livelihoods to “olive groves” to justify everything they’ve been going through for decades. No matter which way you put it, that was an incredibly shitty thing to say. Not to mention just plain wrong and evil.
Literally nothing that has happened in the west Bank justifies what happened on 10/7. That was just sheer face to face animalism from hamas
Cool, still a really shitty thing for you to say.
Would you say the same about the 70+ years of prosecution and crimes inflicted on the Israelis on the Palestinian population? That’s there’s no justifying it?
Hezbollah has stated that they fired those rockets in solidarity with the Palestinian people.
Source
Cool. That’s an incredibly dumb reason to start a war with a country like Israel. There’s a reason Egypt and Jordan don’t do that anymore.
I don’t think standing up for human rights violations is a dumb thing to do. And Israel started this war. They didn’t have to slaughter innocent civilians indiscriminately, but Israel did. They didn’t have to assassinate key figures, perform acts of terror like blowing up pagers, or attack civilian areas in Lebanon. But Israel did do all that. They started this war, and they’re just crying victim because people are actually calling them out on their bs and fighting back.
Groups like Hezbollah don’t believe in human rights. They do not care if innocent people die. Their problem with Israel is not that it’s oppressive, they love oppressive regimes (Iran, Russia). Hezbollah engages in assassinations in Lebanon and abroad frequently. I can go on but my point is you don’t know who these people are or what they believe.
Groups like Hamas and Hezbollah believe in a borderless global theocracy. They believe in a world of public executions and state sponsored brutality against anybody who argues. They are authoritarians, human rights are western philosophical nonsense to them. Unislamic alien beliefs. They simply do not believe in equality or the sanctity of life.
Their problem with Israel is solely that Israel is Jewish.
If Hezbollah doesn’t care about civilian casualties, then why do they almost exclusively target military bases? Israel has no moral authority on this topic either. There have been civilian casualties virtually every day for the past year as they try to wipe out the Palestinian population. Israel also makes up approximately 80% of the attacks that have been between Hezbollah and Israel.
They believe in nothing of the sort. Nasrallah has come out and publicly supported a single state solution so that Muslims, Christians, and Jews can live together democratically.. The same link also explains how he actually publicly advocated for and helped build a synagogue in Beirut. Hezbollah is not anti-semitic, just anti-zionist.