We don’t have a democracy, we have the illusion of a democracy.
Well, that’s patently not true. We vote, the winner takes office. What’s so hard about understanding that? You see that that happens, right?
Studies from Princeton and Cambridge show politicians listen to the rich, not us.
Oh no a Study from Princeton! Dearie me, well I guess that’s the end of that debate then innit.
Does public opinion affect the political process? Gilens & Page found that the number of Americans for or against any idea has no impact on the likelihood that Congress will make it law.
Did they. Well that’s fascinating. So by their logic no one of any political leaning has any influence. Which means laws are prepared, lobbied, and passed by . . . well, aliens, I guess. Or computers maybe. Still I have the nagging feeling that maybe that’s a huge crock of shit. But then again they are from Princeton, and that’s a good brand, I’ve heard of that. So maybe they’re “right”.
Vote based on their hand picked candidates. Your choices are manufactured for their benefit. We saw how quickly the oligarchy shifted policy when the candidate they didn’t want won the WH with Carter. We saw how they responded when their power was under threat with Bernie. We see how they subvert the process by keeping 3rd party options off the ballots. When 1 billionaire has more political influence than millions of voters your vote means nothing.
They will occasionally throw a few stale bread crumbs out to quiet the masses, but that’s all they are, stale bread crumbs.
You can get involved and change things. That’s the point.
Saying “nuh uh” and “it’s rigged” shows how little involvement you have. It’s self-defeating. Change has a pathway, it’s built-in. We can use it. We just have to, y’know, use it. The bare minimum of which is to vote.
Change and change has never come about via electoral politics, it has come about via mutual aid and class solidarity.
The only thing built into politics is defending the current systems of oppression, participating in and defending those systems prevents change and progress.
None of this conversation is about anything other than the US. Not a single one of our rights have been a result of electoral politics. Every right has been fought for tooth and nail, often times with the deaths of many people
I think the idea here is that even if one votes, it does not significantly change the outcome for the better.
For example, voting for Harris would mean capitalism/oligarchy would still reign and there therefore we arrive at the same outcome as Trump. Why vote then?
You’re certainly not wrong that participation would behoove us all in a democratic republic - however, you are not understanding there is a lack of real choice anymore, and that means participation is near moot.
I strongly disagree, and to prove my point, for the next four years trump will create chaos and dysfunction the likes of which your genetic progeny will feel.
It did not have to go that way, but because people didn’t vote against him, it will. And that’s infuriating and disgusting.
Okay, keep voting the lesser of two evils. The thing here is that there needs to be a massive change and it doesn’t happen by propping up a broken system with shortsighted hopes. Personally, I hope the next four years do enrage people to the point that we actually get up and react.
It’s voters with the delusion they have an impact on policy that is written by capitalists that are to blame for our current state of Fascism.
Unless you are among the donor class you have zero impact in government.
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That’s literally not true.
No one should have to pull out the facts to prove it, either - what happened to make you give up on Democracy?
We don’t have a democracy, we have the illusion of a democracy.
Studies from Princeton and Cambridge show politicians listen to the rich, not us.
Well, that’s patently not true. We vote, the winner takes office. What’s so hard about understanding that? You see that that happens, right?
Oh no a Study from Princeton! Dearie me, well I guess that’s the end of that debate then innit.
Did they. Well that’s fascinating. So by their logic no one of any political leaning has any influence. Which means laws are prepared, lobbied, and passed by . . . well, aliens, I guess. Or computers maybe. Still I have the nagging feeling that maybe that’s a huge crock of shit. But then again they are from Princeton, and that’s a good brand, I’ve heard of that. So maybe they’re “right”.
Vote based on their hand picked candidates. Your choices are manufactured for their benefit. We saw how quickly the oligarchy shifted policy when the candidate they didn’t want won the WH with Carter. We saw how they responded when their power was under threat with Bernie. We see how they subvert the process by keeping 3rd party options off the ballots. When 1 billionaire has more political influence than millions of voters your vote means nothing.
They will occasionally throw a few stale bread crumbs out to quiet the masses, but that’s all they are, stale bread crumbs.
You can get involved and change things. That’s the point.
Saying “nuh uh” and “it’s rigged” shows how little involvement you have. It’s self-defeating. Change has a pathway, it’s built-in. We can use it. We just have to, y’know, use it. The bare minimum of which is to vote.
Change and change has never come about via electoral politics, it has come about via mutual aid and class solidarity.
The only thing built into politics is defending the current systems of oppression, participating in and defending those systems prevents change and progress.
Man I don’t know if you’re talking about United States politics, but it has definitely seen change come about via electoral politics. Many times.
As for russia or whatever - yeah that may be, I dunno.
None of this conversation is about anything other than the US. Not a single one of our rights have been a result of electoral politics. Every right has been fought for tooth and nail, often times with the deaths of many people
I think the idea here is that even if one votes, it does not significantly change the outcome for the better.
For example, voting for Harris would mean capitalism/oligarchy would still reign and there therefore we arrive at the same outcome as Trump. Why vote then?
You’re certainly not wrong that participation would behoove us all in a democratic republic - however, you are not understanding there is a lack of real choice anymore, and that means participation is near moot.
I strongly disagree, and to prove my point, for the next four years trump will create chaos and dysfunction the likes of which your genetic progeny will feel.
It did not have to go that way, but because people didn’t vote against him, it will. And that’s infuriating and disgusting.
Okay, keep voting the lesser of two evils. The thing here is that there needs to be a massive change and it doesn’t happen by propping up a broken system with shortsighted hopes. Personally, I hope the next four years do enrage people to the point that we actually get up and react.
Four years is a very long time. On a planet with maybe not that many left to go. It’s an enormous waste, and incredibly short-sighted.
Accelerationism depends on people suffering, which, again - wasn’t necessary.