Fair enough, but Mint gives you the more up to date base of Ubuntu and some QoL tools that Debian doesn’t have. If you prefer Debian, then use it. I just feel Mint is better for beginners or people who want an easier time with less tinkering.
Which is an excellent option if you’re okay with Debian. It’s a good OS but lacks some of the homegrown tools from the main Mint version. So, for beginners or those less inclined to tinkering I’d still recommend the main edition. Otherwise yes, Debian Edition is another great option.
That’s awesome. While I don’t share your love for Debian, I’m glad it exists. Without it, we wouldn’t have Ubuntu or Mint or a ton of other choices.
It’s also amazing that it works, as-is, for some people. More options just means more possibilities for people to find something that works for them and that’s what’s important.
I have to use some programming tools and languages to code; installing them side by side and updating was a major hassle. Now I just have some aliases in command prompt.
Docket desktop was a major religious experience for me; much easier than before
When I tried Arch in '23, it worked well. Then I got busy and lazy and didn’t use it for 2-3 months. When I came back and did yay -sYu as I had learned, dozens of KDE and core packages were throwing errors and wouldn’t update. Unfortunate.
yay -Syu, and around that time KDE had switched from plasma 5 to plasma 6, which involved moving a lot of packages into the extra repository, so you had to sit there and confirm each package move (unless you used --noconfirm).
I see, I guess it was assumed that the user gets, that they have to install it again afterwards (the correct version) if they still need the software 🤔
No kidding. Why else would it be the result of an attempted update. But thanks for the continued condescension.
Can we perhaps stop pretending that it’s the most normal thing on earth to run an update and get back “hm yeah so there’s an issue, to fix it you’re gonna have to uninstall your entire GUI and half of your core operating system”, and it’s simply user error to be irritated by that in any way.
That’s the real “difference” in the Linux camps right?
Ubuntu N00bs - “what’s a terminal?” vs. Arch, Gentoo, Nix, etc users who despite whatever camp you’re in you know you can tell them “you need to enable the systemd service” or "add option blah to /etc/program.conf and they know what they means without further explanation.
If we want “the year of Linux” to truly come then we have to cater to these people, like it or not elitism and gatekeeping is way to obscurity, I’ve been daily driving Linux on every device i have for 9 years already and i keep repeating, masses will come when it’ll actually be usable to them, steamos is example
You say maintenance is 0 then list 2 things I don’t have to do on Mint
Remembering to bother with a CLI and configs is the hard part, on Mint I get a nice GUI with reminders that I have updates to things. You know, like it’s some time past the year 2000?
One can argue that “install Arch properly” includes setting up a GUI button (like welcome window in endeavourOS) that triggers Pacman -Syu (or just yay) in the background outputting only warnings 🤔
Running pacman every two weeks seems like a bad idea if you have a lot of packages… The dependencies can get dicey if you have to update too many at once.
Well I meant two weeks is the longest period i can leave the system without updating and have no problems. And i have yet to break it with 300 pkgs updating at once.
I had about 600 yesterday after turning on an old laptop that hasn’t been on in months… I just broke it down into two chunks, making sure to install the libraries and shit first to try to reduce possible dependency issues. Worked fine.
Really, the worst time for me was when I had ~500 but did not realize that I did not have enough free space… I think I ended up just Time Shifting back after that one stopped me from booting.
The problem is that other 10% where I have to spend my time trawling the arch wiki to fix my OS instead of like… doing cool things on my computer. If that’s what you enjoy that’s great, but your hobby is not my hobby. I’ve used arch on several of my devices, it can be great! But there’s this idea that arch is the perfect solution to pretty much everyone’s desktop problems and it’s crazymaking to see repeated over and over on here.
On EndavourOS here, I spent hours upon install tinkering and setting everything like I wanted and forgot most of what I did ever since.
I’m so lazy I use a one word alias to update all my stuff in one go. I rarely have to bother myself reading and checking if everything’s fine (I still do it from time to time just to be safe but I do it less and less because it’s almost useless)… I even update a bit late sometimes and quite randomly in general.
It’s been almost 4 years like this now, nothing ever broke, had an issue with an Aur only once…never even had to tinker with anything.
I remember having harder times with Ubuntu or Manjaro like a decade ago…even had freaking issues with Mint, it’s crazy.
Yeah, I started on Ubuntu, got acclimated to Linux using it, went to mint, didn’t give me what I wanted and just dove into arch, been running the same install for 8 years now and honestly don’t want any more from my os… I also love my steam deck… It runs arch BTW 😉
I don’t use Arch because I don’t trust the AUR. I run ubuntu based distros on my desktop and servers for better compatibility with software and then use Fedora based software on my laptop and media center.
I’m too lazy to maintain an Arch install, so it’s Mint for me. Long live Mint unironically.
Mint is one of the best versions of Ubuntu you could possibly use. They give you Ubuntu without all the forced snaps and other crap.
At that point just use Debian?
Fair enough, but Mint gives you the more up to date base of Ubuntu and some QoL tools that Debian doesn’t have. If you prefer Debian, then use it. I just feel Mint is better for beginners or people who want an easier time with less tinkering.
This sounds like a great place to mention Linux Mint Debian Edition!
Which is an excellent option if you’re okay with Debian. It’s a good OS but lacks some of the homegrown tools from the main Mint version. So, for beginners or those less inclined to tinkering I’d still recommend the main edition. Otherwise yes, Debian Edition is another great option.
Debian was good enough for my grandfather and it’s good enough for me. Seriously, running cinnamon desktop in Debian is my best option.
I don’t need fancy, just no breaking
Plot twist: am grandfather myself
That’s awesome. While I don’t share your love for Debian, I’m glad it exists. Without it, we wouldn’t have Ubuntu or Mint or a ton of other choices.
It’s also amazing that it works, as-is, for some people. More options just means more possibilities for people to find something that works for them and that’s what’s important.
Ever since docker became available, along with flatpak; the Linux running these became less of an issue for me
Also a valid point. I still want to try Docker at some point, but I haven’t really needed it yet.
I have to use some programming tools and languages to code; installing them side by side and updating was a major hassle. Now I just have some aliases in command prompt.
Docket desktop was a major religious experience for me; much easier than before
You can do that with Mint too - LMDE
Running
yayevery other day is all the maintenance I do on my arch installation.Exactly. My wife is a teacher and she runs Arch daily, knowing only how to run yay.
❤️whish more people would understand that a good set up Arch does not need maintenance, just updates prior you turn your pc off.
You could even automate that, like OpenSource TW is by default.
When I tried Arch in '23, it worked well. Then I got busy and lazy and didn’t use it for 2-3 months. When I came back and did yay -sYu as I had learned, dozens of KDE and core packages were throwing errors and wouldn’t update. Unfortunate.
yay -Syu, and around that time KDE had switched from plasma 5 to plasma 6, which involved moving a lot of packages into the
extrarepository, so you had to sit there and confirm each package move (unless you used --noconfirm).You gotta read what yay is telling you…
🫣error come with a text for a reason!
I did. It told me I needed to uninstall them. 🤐
😆
I see, I guess it was assumed that the user gets, that they have to install it again afterwards (the correct version) if they still need the software 🤔
No kidding. Why else would it be the result of an attempted update. But thanks for the continued condescension.
Can we perhaps stop pretending that it’s the most normal thing on earth to run an update and get back “hm yeah so there’s an issue, to fix it you’re gonna have to uninstall your entire GUI and half of your core operating system”, and it’s simply user error to be irritated by that in any way.
I do it whenever I feel like. Don’t even feel the need to be regular.
With Win10, the notifications used to increase my tension
Mint > literally all OS, Mobile or PC.
😂nope
What do you mean by maintaining?
He probably means tinkering
And if so, I can’t for the life of me Invision how it’s harder on Arch than on the Ubuntu or its derivatives.
Some people just have allergy on terminal
They should use YaST
Agree
That’s the real “difference” in the Linux camps right?
Ubuntu N00bs - “what’s a terminal?” vs. Arch, Gentoo, Nix, etc users who despite whatever camp you’re in you know you can tell them “you need to enable the systemd service” or "add
option blahto/etc/program.confand they know what they means without further explanation.If we want “the year of Linux” to truly come then we have to cater to these people, like it or not elitism and gatekeeping is way to obscurity, I’ve been daily driving Linux on every device i have for 9 years already and i keep repeating, masses will come when it’ll actually be usable to them, steamos is example
Arch maintenance: 0. Install it once. (The proper way)
pacman -SyuI don’t get what is with this so hard? Yes, configs can be undecipherable but 90% time the merge involves just deleting the .pacnew versions.
You say maintenance is 0 then list 2 things I don’t have to do on Mint
Remembering to bother with a CLI and configs is the hard part, on Mint I get a nice GUI with reminders that I have updates to things. You know, like it’s some time past the year 2000?
I think they were trying to make a 0-indexed list and fucked up the markdown, so install is just step 0.
You don’t have to update mint 😮? Well, you don’t have to update Arch, neither
I don’t have to do CLI or folder management to update was me point
One can argue that “install Arch properly” includes setting up a GUI button (like welcome window in endeavourOS) that triggers Pacman -Syu (or just yay) in the background outputting only warnings 🤔
Running pacman every two weeks seems like a bad idea if you have a lot of packages… The dependencies can get dicey if you have to update too many at once.
Well I meant two weeks is the longest period i can leave the system without updating and have no problems. And i have yet to break it with 300 pkgs updating at once.
I had about 600 yesterday after turning on an old laptop that hasn’t been on in months… I just broke it down into two chunks, making sure to install the libraries and shit first to try to reduce possible dependency issues. Worked fine.
Really, the worst time for me was when I had ~500 but did not realize that I did not have enough free space… I think I ended up just Time Shifting back after that one stopped me from booting.
The problem is that other 10% where I have to spend my time trawling the arch wiki to fix my OS instead of like… doing cool things on my computer. If that’s what you enjoy that’s great, but your hobby is not my hobby. I’ve used arch on several of my devices, it can be great! But there’s this idea that arch is the perfect solution to pretty much everyone’s desktop problems and it’s crazymaking to see repeated over and over on here.
On EndavourOS here, I spent hours upon install tinkering and setting everything like I wanted and forgot most of what I did ever since.
I’m so lazy I use a one word alias to update all my stuff in one go. I rarely have to bother myself reading and checking if everything’s fine (I still do it from time to time just to be safe but I do it less and less because it’s almost useless)… I even update a bit late sometimes and quite randomly in general.
It’s been almost 4 years like this now, nothing ever broke, had an issue with an Aur only once…never even had to tinker with anything.
I remember having harder times with Ubuntu or Manjaro like a decade ago…even had freaking issues with Mint, it’s crazy.
Yeah, I started on Ubuntu, got acclimated to Linux using it, went to mint, didn’t give me what I wanted and just dove into arch, been running the same install for 8 years now and honestly don’t want any more from my os… I also love my steam deck… It runs arch BTW 😉
I never touched /etc yet on my install 😄
I’m too lazy to maintain a mint install, so it is endeavourOS for me.
Just yay
I don’t use Arch because I don’t trust the AUR. I run ubuntu based distros on my desktop and servers for better compatibility with software and then use Fedora based software on my laptop and media center.