Coming from Germany where a gesture even vaguely similar to a nazi salute is a criminal offence I naturally have a different stance on that. What fascists enjoy doing (and this pattern can be seen all over the word) is provoke with gestures, statements and symbols that look very similar to their fascist equivalent and they always have that smirk. They think it’s very clever. When called out on that of course they feign outrage and again with a slight smirk.
Journalistic integrity needs to recognize these patterns instead of giving the “benefit of the doubt”. They are being played otherwise because there will never be definitive proof if they did it or not.
There are very old posts on American neo-nazi BBSes that instruct users in this exact process. They know exactly what they are doing, even the “aren’t I clever” smirking is part of it.
Interesting. I always thought it was just some kind of a shared mannerism, didn’t expect there to be actual instructions for that. Do you have any more info on that?
You don’t need a degree or a certification to be a journalist. You are taking a flimsy norm that is on shaky ground anyway and elevating it to some higher status.
Journalists can use definitive language and protect themselves with adjectives like ‘alleged’.
Choosing ‘controversial gesture’ instead of ‘alleged nazi salute’ is an intentional choice and a cowardly one.
Having watched it, it’s complicated. The arm outstretched with the punchable smirk on her face is definitely Nazi.
Tapping her chest first is not, which is how it falls under “controversial gesture” territory.
It is not 100% Nazi so any reputable journalist isn’t going to call it that.
Coming from Germany where a gesture even vaguely similar to a nazi salute is a criminal offence I naturally have a different stance on that. What fascists enjoy doing (and this pattern can be seen all over the word) is provoke with gestures, statements and symbols that look very similar to their fascist equivalent and they always have that smirk. They think it’s very clever. When called out on that of course they feign outrage and again with a slight smirk. Journalistic integrity needs to recognize these patterns instead of giving the “benefit of the doubt”. They are being played otherwise because there will never be definitive proof if they did it or not.
There are very old posts on American neo-nazi BBSes that instruct users in this exact process. They know exactly what they are doing, even the “aren’t I clever” smirking is part of it.
Interesting. I always thought it was just some kind of a shared mannerism, didn’t expect there to be actual instructions for that. Do you have any more info on that?
And that’s just complete BS and why trust in journalism keeps declining.
If you honestly think that not calling a spade a spade is reputable journalism then journalism is worthless.
Journalists have standards above and beyond “random commenter on lemmy”.
Yeah, I get to call a Nazi a fucking asshole Nazi. Journalists should have better standards and spines to use “alleged Nazi”.
Your spouse’s standards are way too low.
It’s not her standards, it’s the standard for anyone with a journalism degree.
You don’t need a degree or a certification to be a journalist. You are taking a flimsy norm that is on shaky ground anyway and elevating it to some higher status.
Journalists can use definitive language and protect themselves with adjectives like ‘alleged’.
Choosing ‘controversial gesture’ instead of ‘alleged nazi salute’ is an intentional choice and a cowardly one.
Oh btw, here’s some journalist with some spine and integrity but I guess they’re not real journalist according to you and your spouse.
https://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/local/pennsylvania-laura-smith-towamencin-township-nazi-salute-controversy-elon-musk/4089263/
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/laura-smith-elon-musk-salute_n_6797ced6e4b0792017b78e5e
https://www.newsweek.com/pennsylvania-county-official-resigned-after-salute-video-2021155
https://www.inquirer.com/politics/pennsylvania/adl-nazi-salute-towamencin-supervisor-laura-smith-20250126.html