I am economically left, yes. I’m also a leftist who thinks you have to meet the working class where they are, and it seems to me most working class people in America are not necessarily socially progressive, especially on trans issues. That doesn’t necessarily mean most working class people are hostile to trans people, but some, many even, have strong feelings about gender identity, especially when it comes to children. I think it is a huge mistake to alienate a large percentage of the working class for the sake of a relatively small number of people and a niche issue. Again, I don’t think most working class Americans are necessarily anti-trans. I think most working class Americans are perfectly willing to adopt a live and let live attitude toward trans people. But I think it’s potentially a wedge issue, and I think the conservatives know that and that’s why they won’t shut up about it. The best thing the left can do is not take the bait and be diligent in steering the conversation back to the day to day economic issues that actually affect the majority of working class people.
Edit: I keep seeing the slippery slope logical fallacy in the responses to my comment. It’s ridiculous to suggest that what I’m talking about will inevitably lead to trans people being rounded up and put into extermination camps. That’s very extreme. As I’ve already said, I think most working class people are more than willing to let trans people be. Many of you are mistaking indifference for hatred. Violent hatred, even. I’m not denying the existence of people who do have a violent hatred of trans people, but those people are a very small minority and in no way indicative of the working class generally.
Just out of interest, what do you make of this situation in my country? Roma people make up less than 5% of the population of the country. They are heavily discriminated against. The majority of the population are racist against them. By your logic, we should ignore and maybe even embrace the racism to steer the conversation back to economic issues?
But I think it’s potentially a wedge issue, and I think the conservatives know that and that’s why they won’t shut up about it.
Brother it is 100% a wedge issue. Just like abortion. It’s easy to get people riled up over anything related to sex and sexuality.
Nobody is going around thinking about other people abortions, or whether or not the garage matches the trim.
The thing is, social issues, when it comes to sex and sexuality, there’s a whole distribution network for getting people riled up, and it’s been around for centuries. The church.
You know the easiest way to strip someone of their humanity is to take away their agency over their sexual partners?
Doesn’t matter if you’re literally raping someone, forcibly breeding your slaves, or telling someone they aren’t allowed to love someone else (whether because of race or passport or genitals). The net effect is the same - a piece of their humanity and agency is taken from them.
Anyway that deep-rooted Catholic shame is good for something…getting people uneasy talking about sex and sexuality (and the consequences therein). And when something outside the heteronormative comes up and makes them think about it, it makes them angry.
I appreciate your comment and perspective, and I do really think it’s something that’s missed by a lot of the compassionate social progressives. Acceptance is a good thing…but it can’t be forced on everyone. Everyone has to get there on their own, and until they do, all this transgender talk makes them uneasy.
The best thing the left can do is not take the bait and be diligent in steering the conversation back to the day to day economic issues that actually affect the majority of working class people.
Sure, it shouldn’t be the focus of a campaign, but this strategy of caving to the right’s BS rhetoric simply does not work.
First off, it legitimizes their positions, when even democrats start spouting transphobic nonsense, it makes it seem like there’s legitimate concerns and a debate to be had, when in reality it’s just these far-right weirdos and conspiracy theorists talking nonsense.
Second, you’re concerned about alienating people for the sake of a small segment of the population, but by caving to the right’s rhetoric, you are not only alienating trans people but also allies, which is discussed in the article. How does that number actually compare to the number of people for whom trans acceptance is a deal breaker, but who aren’t just going to vote republican regardless?
Third, this does not stop at trans people, and certainly not at trans kids. Once they have demonstrated that they can demonize (and eventually exterminate) trans people, next they will come for other gay people. Trans bathroom bans have often led to cis lesbians being harassed because they don’t “look feminine enough.” The government is now talking about screening testosterone levels in cis men in the military.
Where will be in 20 years? Will cis men with long hair be forced to cut it off? Will women only be permitted to wear skirts?
These freaks are living in the 1800s, their values and agendas are absolutely not in line with the average person. But, they are able to advance their agenda by selling it one small step at a time, and they’re able to keep taking steps because the democrats keep caving and accommodating them, allowing them to redraw the line.
Where exactly is your line? Is there one? Or will you hold on to this logic of “it’s not worth standing up for such a small minority” all the way to the gas chambers?
There is no widespread boom of doctors gleefully diagnosing patients as trans and prescribing lifechanging medicine and surgery on a whim.
That stuff is all bullshit to get you to alienate yourself from people who agree with you on basically everything else.
The process is long and arduous especially for parents trying to help their kids.
You’re worried about kids permanently damaging their bodies and living messed up lives?
Good. Don’t force them to go through the wrong puberty by denying them the medicine their doctors prescribe.
Mind. Your. Business.
Let doctors do their jobs. Let families decide this stuff without you. They don’t know you and you don’t know them. Not everyone is the same, and there are professionals that deal with this stuff for a reason.
I am economically left, yes. I’m also a leftist who thinks you have to meet the working class where they are, and it seems to me most working class people in America are not necessarily socially progressive, especially on trans issues. That doesn’t necessarily mean most working class people are hostile to trans people, but some, many even, have strong feelings about gender identity, especially when it comes to children. I think it is a huge mistake to alienate a large percentage of the working class for the sake of a relatively small number of people and a niche issue. Again, I don’t think most working class Americans are necessarily anti-trans. I think most working class Americans are perfectly willing to adopt a live and let live attitude toward trans people. But I think it’s potentially a wedge issue, and I think the conservatives know that and that’s why they won’t shut up about it. The best thing the left can do is not take the bait and be diligent in steering the conversation back to the day to day economic issues that actually affect the majority of working class people.
Edit: I keep seeing the slippery slope logical fallacy in the responses to my comment. It’s ridiculous to suggest that what I’m talking about will inevitably lead to trans people being rounded up and put into extermination camps. That’s very extreme. As I’ve already said, I think most working class people are more than willing to let trans people be. Many of you are mistaking indifference for hatred. Violent hatred, even. I’m not denying the existence of people who do have a violent hatred of trans people, but those people are a very small minority and in no way indicative of the working class generally.
Just out of interest, what do you make of this situation in my country? Roma people make up less than 5% of the population of the country. They are heavily discriminated against. The majority of the population are racist against them. By your logic, we should ignore and maybe even embrace the racism to steer the conversation back to economic issues?
Brother it is 100% a wedge issue. Just like abortion. It’s easy to get people riled up over anything related to sex and sexuality.
Nobody is going around thinking about other people abortions, or whether or not the garage matches the trim.
The thing is, social issues, when it comes to sex and sexuality, there’s a whole distribution network for getting people riled up, and it’s been around for centuries. The church.
You know the easiest way to strip someone of their humanity is to take away their agency over their sexual partners?
Doesn’t matter if you’re literally raping someone, forcibly breeding your slaves, or telling someone they aren’t allowed to love someone else (whether because of race or passport or genitals). The net effect is the same - a piece of their humanity and agency is taken from them.
Anyway that deep-rooted Catholic shame is good for something…getting people uneasy talking about sex and sexuality (and the consequences therein). And when something outside the heteronormative comes up and makes them think about it, it makes them angry.
I appreciate your comment and perspective, and I do really think it’s something that’s missed by a lot of the compassionate social progressives. Acceptance is a good thing…but it can’t be forced on everyone. Everyone has to get there on their own, and until they do, all this transgender talk makes them uneasy.
Sure, it shouldn’t be the focus of a campaign, but this strategy of caving to the right’s BS rhetoric simply does not work.
First off, it legitimizes their positions, when even democrats start spouting transphobic nonsense, it makes it seem like there’s legitimate concerns and a debate to be had, when in reality it’s just these far-right weirdos and conspiracy theorists talking nonsense.
Second, you’re concerned about alienating people for the sake of a small segment of the population, but by caving to the right’s rhetoric, you are not only alienating trans people but also allies, which is discussed in the article. How does that number actually compare to the number of people for whom trans acceptance is a deal breaker, but who aren’t just going to vote republican regardless?
Third, this does not stop at trans people, and certainly not at trans kids. Once they have demonstrated that they can demonize (and eventually exterminate) trans people, next they will come for other gay people. Trans bathroom bans have often led to cis lesbians being harassed because they don’t “look feminine enough.” The government is now talking about screening testosterone levels in cis men in the military.
Where will be in 20 years? Will cis men with long hair be forced to cut it off? Will women only be permitted to wear skirts?
These freaks are living in the 1800s, their values and agendas are absolutely not in line with the average person. But, they are able to advance their agenda by selling it one small step at a time, and they’re able to keep taking steps because the democrats keep caving and accommodating them, allowing them to redraw the line.
Where exactly is your line? Is there one? Or will you hold on to this logic of “it’s not worth standing up for such a small minority” all the way to the gas chambers?
“Especially when it comes to children”
They always weaponize children.
There is no conspiracy to trans your kids.
There is no widespread boom of doctors gleefully diagnosing patients as trans and prescribing lifechanging medicine and surgery on a whim.
That stuff is all bullshit to get you to alienate yourself from people who agree with you on basically everything else.
The process is long and arduous especially for parents trying to help their kids.
You’re worried about kids permanently damaging their bodies and living messed up lives?
Good. Don’t force them to go through the wrong puberty by denying them the medicine their doctors prescribe.
Mind. Your. Business.
Let doctors do their jobs. Let families decide this stuff without you. They don’t know you and you don’t know them. Not everyone is the same, and there are professionals that deal with this stuff for a reason.
Don’t vote against trans rights.
They’re just human rights.
Trans people are not the boogeyman.