China has higher per capita CO2 emissions than Europe, despite a lower per capita economic output. While there has been significant investment in renewable energy recently, there is still a large amount of coal power and China has been slow to phase out fossil fuels.
In terms of income inequality by Gini coefficient, China is estimated to be in the higher 30s, substantially worse than Canada, Australia, Japan and almost every European country. China has a minimum income guarantee (unlike the USA for example), but it is very low by European standards. In terms of the number of US$ billionaires, China ranks second globally behind the US, though in terms of billionaires as share of the population does not rank as high.
So how does it look if we break down where the many products China produces for others are actually sold?
Many countries at the top of that list outsourced a lot of their manufacturing and production to China, meaning they no longer create the industrial pollution locally to make the products actually consume. So their pollution is artificially lowered by that outsourcing while China’s is inflated.
Imported or embedded emissions are taken into account in the carbon footprint datas (at least in the EU).
China construction sector accounts for almost half of the CO2 emissions of the construction sector worldwide. It’s entirely local, and only concerns 1/8th of the population (the Chinese population).
Also, manufacturing is low carbon compared to transportation or construction.
China just doesn’t give a fuck, same as most western countries. They just build solar panels to reduce their dependency to Russia’s petrol.
Edit : phrasing and added a link. My claims also come from other datasets but finding those on the phone was too long.
Depending on the production line it’s kinda both. Some companies apply strict audits and demand clean production, others don’t give a shit, and when they don’t give a shit it’s both down to that company and to the local cheap manufacturer that they choose to pollute. It’s not like most companies go to China and ask them to pollute, they just want it cheap. In that case the responsibility is shared IMHO because both sides can fix it.
There are a lot of things China does badly but not the ones you mentioned.
Okay, but the stat you linked confirms China’s per capita emissions are pretty bad, more than double France’s for example.
As for income inequality, I was looking at the World Bank data listed here. There might be a discrepancy due to difficulty in obtaining reliable data for China.
It feels a bit like cherry picking. Europe is much closer to China than the bigger polluters like NA and Australia. And a lot of China’s pollution is because of rampant consumerism in NA and Europe amongst others.
The wealth inequality is lower than two European states and very close to others below it. China is 78 on your list, Lithuania 79 and Italy is 91.
I feel like your comment didn’t give the full picture. China isn’t exactly the worst on those fronts, especially when you take into account the manufacturing they do for foreign markets (offsetting Europe’s and NAs own emmissions), while they are also one of the few actually making an effort to go green. State repression and the rest tho, ouf. And it’s true that the numbers can’t necessarily be trusted.
Not “the worst,” but also not anywhere close to the least worst, which are obviously European social-democracies, and even their efforts for the renewable transition and tackling income inequality are not that impressive. But I suppose capitalist European countries are less suitable of a subject for tankie memes.
Comparing China to Europe is apples and oranges. Europe didn’t start the last century as a feudal backwater with 3 centuries a century of imperialists extracting its wealth and invading to get its citizens addicted to opium. China was unimaginably poor even 50 years ago. The fact that their economy is so strong now is frankly astounding, and a true testament to the effectiveness of socialism.
The inequality has led to crazy situations. For instance, people from cities are banned from buying property in rural areas because they would price locals out of the market. However this ban also extends to institutions, which means that effectively banks (being urban) are banned from offering mortgages on rural properties which creates real problems for the locals who then can’t afford the properties anyway.
Yeah that’s true and I am not excusing the emissions, but they kinda do a dual purpose of manufacturing renewable energy hardware with fossil fuels, but then using those hardware for green energy transition. That strategy paid off this year, when Trump’s war in Iran caused global oil supply restrictions. With China being the biggest importer of oil, they stopped importing and drew from their own fossil fuel stockpiles they have been building up and used the green energy to fill the rest of the requirements. The country has been preparing for such scenario (which is why China is the pioneer in renewable energy) and it proved prescient.
China also at least tax their billionaires without fear of “leaving with their business”. The state also don’t bail out failed companies that completely messed up through the company’s own fault.
China has higher per capita CO2 emissions than Europe, despite a lower per capita economic output. While there has been significant investment in renewable energy recently, there is still a large amount of coal power and China has been slow to phase out fossil fuels.
In terms of income inequality by Gini coefficient, China is estimated to be in the higher 30s, substantially worse than Canada, Australia, Japan and almost every European country. China has a minimum income guarantee (unlike the USA for example), but it is very low by European standards. In terms of the number of US$ billionaires, China ranks second globally behind the US, though in terms of billionaires as share of the population does not rank as high.
You mean these flattening emissions while manufacturing most of the worlds finished goods along with a lot of the inputs for our manufacturing?
So how does it look if we break down where the many products China produces for others are actually sold?
Many countries at the top of that list outsourced a lot of their manufacturing and production to China, meaning they no longer create the industrial pollution locally to make the products actually consume. So their pollution is artificially lowered by that outsourcing while China’s is inflated.
Imported or embedded emissions are taken into account in the carbon footprint datas (at least in the EU).
China construction sector accounts for almost half of the CO2 emissions of the construction sector worldwide. It’s entirely local, and only concerns 1/8th of the population (the Chinese population).
Also, manufacturing is low carbon compared to transportation or construction.
China just doesn’t give a fuck, same as most western countries. They just build solar panels to reduce their dependency to Russia’s petrol.
Edit : phrasing and added a link. My claims also come from other datasets but finding those on the phone was too long.
Depending on the production line it’s kinda both. Some companies apply strict audits and demand clean production, others don’t give a shit, and when they don’t give a shit it’s both down to that company and to the local cheap manufacturer that they choose to pollute. It’s not like most companies go to China and ask them to pollute, they just want it cheap. In that case the responsibility is shared IMHO because both sides can fix it.
A lot of that pollution is Western pollution outsourced to China.
It’s like how California has a water crisis because its agriculture is supporting half the country, making their per capita water usage insane.
Here is the Ginni link, it isn’t updated often but China isn’t exactly topping the list
https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/gini-coefficient-by-country
There are a lot of things China does badly but not the ones you mentioned.
Okay, but the stat you linked confirms China’s per capita emissions are pretty bad, more than double France’s for example.
As for income inequality, I was looking at the World Bank data listed here. There might be a discrepancy due to difficulty in obtaining reliable data for China.
It feels a bit like cherry picking. Europe is much closer to China than the bigger polluters like NA and Australia. And a lot of China’s pollution is because of rampant consumerism in NA and Europe amongst others.
The wealth inequality is lower than two European states and very close to others below it. China is 78 on your list, Lithuania 79 and Italy is 91.
I feel like your comment didn’t give the full picture. China isn’t exactly the worst on those fronts, especially when you take into account the manufacturing they do for foreign markets (offsetting Europe’s and NAs own emmissions), while they are also one of the few actually making an effort to go green. State repression and the rest tho, ouf. And it’s true that the numbers can’t necessarily be trusted.
Not “the worst,” but also not anywhere close to the least worst, which are obviously European social-democracies, and even their efforts for the renewable transition and tackling income inequality are not that impressive. But I suppose capitalist European countries are less suitable of a subject for tankie memes.
Comparing China to Europe is apples and oranges. Europe didn’t start the last century as a feudal backwater with
3 centuriesa century of imperialists extracting its wealth and invading to get its citizens addicted to opium. China was unimaginably poor even 50 years ago. The fact that their economy is so strong now is frankly astounding, and a true testament to the effectiveness of socialism.Let’s not be hasty now. I’m pretty sure that describes describes Poland and the Balkans, but now Poland is flourishing and the Balkans are
Poland also didn’t have an intense civil war stoked by the US and other capitalists only 30 years ago.
Or the greed of corporations outsourcing work and jobs there to increase their own selfish profits.
Wow, inflation really got that century of humiliation hard
Yeah that’s fair actually. Edited my comment.
The inequality has led to crazy situations. For instance, people from cities are banned from buying property in rural areas because they would price locals out of the market. However this ban also extends to institutions, which means that effectively banks (being urban) are banned from offering mortgages on rural properties which creates real problems for the locals who then can’t afford the properties anyway.
Yeah that’s true and I am not excusing the emissions, but they kinda do a dual purpose of manufacturing renewable energy hardware with fossil fuels, but then using those hardware for green energy transition. That strategy paid off this year, when Trump’s war in Iran caused global oil supply restrictions. With China being the biggest importer of oil, they stopped importing and drew from their own fossil fuel stockpiles they have been building up and used the green energy to fill the rest of the requirements. The country has been preparing for such scenario (which is why China is the pioneer in renewable energy) and it proved prescient.
China also at least tax their billionaires without fear of “leaving with their business”. The state also don’t bail out failed companies that completely messed up through the company’s own fault.