I’d wager I’ve been an active member of more leftwing movements than you, certainly since you seem to be in the very naive mindset of ‘anyone who disagrees with me must be a right wing monster’
But I’ll accept that as a ‘yes we still need roads and you were right about the integrated transport network thing and first/last mile and the many areas where trains don’t make sense economically or ecologically’
I think it’s Mao in Contradictions that talks about how in the search for a better world you can’t afford to hold resentment against tools simply because they were once in your enemies hands, or maybe it was Deng, but the point is if cars can help us in the structure of a better society we shouldn’t reject them just because they can also be useful in a bad society.
Certainly we shouldn’t resist improving them simply out of some emotive grudge.
Do you have any argument based on anything besides yelling and stomping your feet? So far all you’ve done is backtrack on your original statements and cry about how I’m not left wing enough, or the wrong kind of left wing or whatever your next childish attempt at defection from the topic is.
It’s ok you can just say that you don’t really understand the complexity of mass transit systems and that your original stance was nothing but kneejerk emotion - you don’t need to keep making yourself look more foolish.
I’m sure you’re very sweet really when you’re not all flustered like this, take a moment to breathe and try to remember that being wrong doesn’t have to be scary it can be exciting, it’s learning and putting you on a better track for thinking about things in the future.
Oh… look - the person that can’t argue without resorting to hysterical hyperbole is now hysterically (and hyperbolically) pretending I backtracked on something to save face.
Ho hum.
your original stance was nothing but kneejerk emotion
Oh… look - here’s my knee. And it’s still exactly where it was when we started.
Yeah but have you noticed how I keep going back to the subject at hand and reiterating my initial statements but you’re actively ignoring all of that and instead choosing to just try and insult me in vague terms?
You obviously realise that I have enough interest in and understanding of transport infrastructure that your emotive and catchy slogan based arguments aren’t going to hold water as I can refute them with actual evidence based studies and the work of experts in the field. Possibly you’re also aware that my grasp of the importance of such systems in a left wing or socialist state eclipses your rudimentary idealism.
If this was a debate for points and prizes then you’d be making the only sensible move, but we’re not here for prizes - we’re here to try and broaden understanding of what’s needed in a better world and to determine how we can work towards that together for the benefit of all.
So stop being hissy and get back to the important matters, you seem like a good kid with a lot of passion and energy - if that’s directed right then you could be a real boon to the movement for a better world. Getting lost in ego and fear of admitting you’re wrong isn’t going to help anyone though, least of all yourself.
Let’s make friends and forget about all the angry stuff you said, and yes I have been mean and rude too and I do apologise very genuinely for that, I just care about this stuff and it gets me caught up when I feel people are making it harder to shill for urban modernisation through trams and track based cargo networks. I don’t want to have to be explaining the limitations of mass transit but also I don’t want to be part of groups that will make me look foolish and to have to start every argument in favour of trains with ‘yes obviously a lot of people who argue for trains are crazy and wrong but…’
I’d wager I’ve been an active member of more leftwing movements than you, certainly since you seem to be in the very naive mindset of ‘anyone who disagrees with me must be a right wing monster’
But I’ll accept that as a ‘yes we still need roads and you were right about the integrated transport network thing and first/last mile and the many areas where trains don’t make sense economically or ecologically’
I think it’s Mao in Contradictions that talks about how in the search for a better world you can’t afford to hold resentment against tools simply because they were once in your enemies hands, or maybe it was Deng, but the point is if cars can help us in the structure of a better society we shouldn’t reject them just because they can also be useful in a bad society.
Certainly we shouldn’t resist improving them simply out of some emotive grudge.
Don’t bet anything you might need now, you hear?
I don’t give a fuck what Mao or Deng has to say about anything - do tell… what reactionary faux-left organisations have you actually been in?
No wonder you are so ready to shill for capitalists.
Do you have any argument based on anything besides yelling and stomping your feet? So far all you’ve done is backtrack on your original statements and cry about how I’m not left wing enough, or the wrong kind of left wing or whatever your next childish attempt at defection from the topic is.
It’s ok you can just say that you don’t really understand the complexity of mass transit systems and that your original stance was nothing but kneejerk emotion - you don’t need to keep making yourself look more foolish.
I’m sure you’re very sweet really when you’re not all flustered like this, take a moment to breathe and try to remember that being wrong doesn’t have to be scary it can be exciting, it’s learning and putting you on a better track for thinking about things in the future.
Oh… look - the person that can’t argue without resorting to hysterical hyperbole is now hysterically (and hyperbolically) pretending I backtracked on something to save face.
Ho hum.
Oh… look - here’s my knee. And it’s still exactly where it was when we started.
Fancy that.
Yeah but have you noticed how I keep going back to the subject at hand and reiterating my initial statements but you’re actively ignoring all of that and instead choosing to just try and insult me in vague terms?
You obviously realise that I have enough interest in and understanding of transport infrastructure that your emotive and catchy slogan based arguments aren’t going to hold water as I can refute them with actual evidence based studies and the work of experts in the field. Possibly you’re also aware that my grasp of the importance of such systems in a left wing or socialist state eclipses your rudimentary idealism.
If this was a debate for points and prizes then you’d be making the only sensible move, but we’re not here for prizes - we’re here to try and broaden understanding of what’s needed in a better world and to determine how we can work towards that together for the benefit of all.
So stop being hissy and get back to the important matters, you seem like a good kid with a lot of passion and energy - if that’s directed right then you could be a real boon to the movement for a better world. Getting lost in ego and fear of admitting you’re wrong isn’t going to help anyone though, least of all yourself.
Let’s make friends and forget about all the angry stuff you said, and yes I have been mean and rude too and I do apologise very genuinely for that, I just care about this stuff and it gets me caught up when I feel people are making it harder to shill for urban modernisation through trams and track based cargo networks. I don’t want to have to be explaining the limitations of mass transit but also I don’t want to be part of groups that will make me look foolish and to have to start every argument in favour of trains with ‘yes obviously a lot of people who argue for trains are crazy and wrong but…’