Oh, the headphone jack… using a phone without it is so counter productive and annoying, wait for the phone to fully charge, now wait for your headsets to charge too, I don’t know why we’re moving backwards 🙄
I used to feel this way until I realized that a large percentage of phone users rarely used earbuds or headphones, including myself. Wired earbuds were a pain in the ass, nobody wanted to carry a coiled up cable in their pocket all day. But a little clamshell with a couple small buds in it fits pretty well into a jeans pocket. Once wireless earbuds hit the market, everyone started using them for a reason.
The only real argument for an analog headphone jack at this point is audio fidelity, and if you care about that you’re 1, not using your phone with a cheap DAC to do it and 2, your headphones probably use a 1/4" jack not a 3.5mm one. Wireless protocols are also catching up to analog as far as audio quality as well, and most people expect IP68 from a good phone these days, and you’re not getting that with a 3.5mm audio jack or removable battery.
The consumers who care about an audio jack on phones these days are a very vocal minority.
They were no more of a pain than fishing out a wireless holder, and they took up even less space. The reason people used wireless was because manufacturers stopped giving people the option to use wired. That being said, having a headphone jack still lets you use wireless.
And nobody actually uses wired for audio quality, they use it because they don’t have to charge their headphones and separate headphone case or deal with the health of another battery, they can connect and disconnect their audio devices faster and easier, they don’t have to pay for an extra wireless chip and dac in their headphones or a third battery and electronics in a case.
There’s actually quite a few good reasons to have the option available if you want it. I’d argue this is a “dress with no pockets” scenario, where everybody begrudgingly puts up with it because the manufacturers don’t give them an option.
Pretty much every single person i talk to about this thinks that removing the headphone jack was a stupid idea, and those who don’t think it’s stupid are indifferent anyway.
Galaxy S5 was IP67 with a headphone socket, removable battery and dedicated microSD card slot.
Others have also existed.
Taking like adding a headphone socket costs more than 5 cents is stupid.
I’m a Bluetooth buds convert now, but I’d still like the choice.
IP67 and IP68 are considerably different. It’s basically the difference between water-resistant and water proof. IP67 could handle splashes of water and, at least on paper, brief submersion. In reality, most. IP67 phones did not handle any level of immersion well.
IP68 on the other hand allows phones to be submerged deeper in water and for much longer. You can have IP67 with those features, but IP68 is a different beast.
Difference between x5 and x7 maybe.
To pass x6 a device must be submerged to a depth of 1m for 30 minutes.
IPx7 is for a device intended to operate permanently submerged. So not a phone.
That fact your picking the difference shows you don’t know the difference.
IP67 is just a marketing gimmick.
I’d be impressed if a phone with this rating would endure 12 months submerged and still function. Who needs this anyway?
IP67 in reality won’t last 30 minutes submerged in most cases. I’ve had flagship level IP67 devices get damaged by water ingress by being splashed or dunked a couple inches into a pool for less than a second. My Pixel 8 Pro goes into the shower, bath, pool, hot tub, and rain with me and it’s never skipped a beat.
Wired earbuds were a pain in the ass, nobody wanted to carry a coiled up cable in their pocket all day. But a little clamshell with a couple small buds in it fits pretty well into a jeans pocket.
Oh, sorry. Did you enjoy fishing them out of your pocket only to have everything else you happened to have in your pocket fall to the ground. Then once you picked up all your stuff, you still had to spend a couple minutes untangling and removing all the random knots that had appeared in your headphone cords since you put them in.
It was IP67 not IP68, which is what I stated. While it’s possible to have a headphone jack and IP68 resistance, it’s not cheap and you likely won’t find it on anything but niche flagship phones like the Asus Zenphone.
Nokia XR21 has IP69k and headphones jack. Galaxy Xcover6 pro has removable battery, headphone jack, and micro SD slot with IP68. S10e has IP68, headphone jack and SD card slot.
I don’t buy that headphone jack and SD card slot must disappear to achieve water resistance. They removed them because it was cheaper to produce and make you buy more expensive phone with bigger storage and wireless headphones once the battery degrades.
The limitation is not tech, it’s the cost to include those features in an IP68+ device. The XR21 is a $650USD phone, that’s near flagship prices, and very far from a budget phone.
Is it possible to create a device that has a jack, SD slot, and removable battery that’s also IP68+ certified? Absolutely, but doing that is quite a bit more expensive than the same features on an IP67 or lower device.
It’s not that it’s impossible, but the device will be both more expensive, and considerably thicker. Most people do not care about a headphone jack anymore, and even less so SD card slots and removable batteries. They want thinner, cheaper, waterproof phones. These features aren’t in high demand, and aren’t profitable for companies to produce.
Exactly. If anything, I’d much rather like to see a secondary USB-C port, preferably on top of the device. That would be an actual benefit for almost everyone.
The point is that their earbuds are absolutely non repairable, and admittedly so. Really hope they can improve that, but I think they might just discontinue the earbuds in favour of repairable headphones.
Do you really consider the $5 wired earbuds that came with the phone, the ones most people used, were repairable? Nah, they were way more disposable than even cheap wireless buds are these days.
Thanks for the anecdotal evidence, but in general those buds ended up in the trash in months, if not weeks. Out of all the people I know, pretty sure my wife is the only one that likes the wired buds that came with phones, but she went through a pair every few months. She switched to Pixel Buds a while back and only uses the wired ones when she runs, but still has to buy new ones twice a year.
@jol wait… this site’;s layout is confusing…
I meant fairphone discontinued their controversial bluetooth in-ears. Wired in-ear headphones in general are having a bit of a renaissance with so called “chi-fi”. Chinese brands launched after 2015, that sound great for $20-$50. Check out Crinacle’s youtube channel
They are also available in a few different shapes that may work better depending on device and user preferences and cost like 2-6 bucks on Ali. I use a different one with my steam deck that also has a little U adapter that 180s the plug direction and braces it against the back so it doesn’t torque off if I rotate the device in my hands.
From personal experience, headphone jacks have been more susceptible to wearing out than USB-C.
The connection became so loose that the plug would slip out on its own.
The jack would (I assume) partially lose contact, resulting in missing frequencies in the audio and crackling if I rotate the plug.
Both of these can be partially remedied by cleaning the port, but after six years with my old phone even that didn’t work anymore. The USB-C port still did, however.
I mean, there’s no lack of USB-C earphones these days, and adapters are tiny. I think for a brand like FairPhone the cost cutting of a feature almost no User cares for really makes sense.
Yes, adapters are tiny but they stock out sooooo much. At least with corded earphones some of them come with 90 degree plugs which is so much better and lesser chance of something breaking.
@jol@fubbernuckin Fairphone 4 owner here. I already had a dongle when I got it. Nope, it’s pretentious towards dongles, check list for known working models: https://forum.fairphone.com/t/fp4-list-of-usb-c-to-3-5-audio-jack-adapter/79386
at least the usb port is easy to replace if extra stress hurts it. They ate the extra “cost” with bluetooth buds, made with Fair trade metals, like their first phone. But un-repairable. People wanted lego modular design and felt that taking away the jack and selling disposable headphones was a conflict of interests.
I’m waiting for a fairphone with a headphone jack and then hopping on that.
Oh, the headphone jack… using a phone without it is so counter productive and annoying, wait for the phone to fully charge, now wait for your headsets to charge too, I don’t know why we’re moving backwards 🙄
I used to feel this way until I realized that a large percentage of phone users rarely used earbuds or headphones, including myself. Wired earbuds were a pain in the ass, nobody wanted to carry a coiled up cable in their pocket all day. But a little clamshell with a couple small buds in it fits pretty well into a jeans pocket. Once wireless earbuds hit the market, everyone started using them for a reason.
The only real argument for an analog headphone jack at this point is audio fidelity, and if you care about that you’re 1, not using your phone with a cheap DAC to do it and 2, your headphones probably use a 1/4" jack not a 3.5mm one. Wireless protocols are also catching up to analog as far as audio quality as well, and most people expect IP68 from a good phone these days, and you’re not getting that with a 3.5mm audio jack or removable battery.
The consumers who care about an audio jack on phones these days are a very vocal minority.
They were no more of a pain than fishing out a wireless holder, and they took up even less space. The reason people used wireless was because manufacturers stopped giving people the option to use wired. That being said, having a headphone jack still lets you use wireless.
And nobody actually uses wired for audio quality, they use it because they don’t have to charge their headphones and separate headphone case or deal with the health of another battery, they can connect and disconnect their audio devices faster and easier, they don’t have to pay for an extra wireless chip and dac in their headphones or a third battery and electronics in a case.
There’s actually quite a few good reasons to have the option available if you want it. I’d argue this is a “dress with no pockets” scenario, where everybody begrudgingly puts up with it because the manufacturers don’t give them an option.
Pretty much every single person i talk to about this thinks that removing the headphone jack was a stupid idea, and those who don’t think it’s stupid are indifferent anyway.
Galaxy S5 was IP67 with a headphone socket, removable battery and dedicated microSD card slot. Others have also existed. Taking like adding a headphone socket costs more than 5 cents is stupid.
I’m a Bluetooth buds convert now, but I’d still like the choice.
IP67 and IP68 are considerably different. It’s basically the difference between water-resistant and water proof. IP67 could handle splashes of water and, at least on paper, brief submersion. In reality, most. IP67 phones did not handle any level of immersion well.
IP68 on the other hand allows phones to be submerged deeper in water and for much longer. You can have IP67 with those features, but IP68 is a different beast.
LoL… Really?
1 number apart, but considerably different. Sure.
Difference between x5 and x7 maybe. To pass x6 a device must be submerged to a depth of 1m for 30 minutes.
IPx7 is for a device intended to operate permanently submerged. So not a phone.
That fact your picking the difference shows you don’t know the difference.
IP67 is just a marketing gimmick. I’d be impressed if a phone with this rating would endure 12 months submerged and still function. Who needs this anyway?
IP67 in reality won’t last 30 minutes submerged in most cases. I’ve had flagship level IP67 devices get damaged by water ingress by being splashed or dunked a couple inches into a pool for less than a second. My Pixel 8 Pro goes into the shower, bath, pool, hot tub, and rain with me and it’s never skipped a beat.
Lmao what??
Oh, sorry. Did you enjoy fishing them out of your pocket only to have everything else you happened to have in your pocket fall to the ground. Then once you picked up all your stuff, you still had to spend a couple minutes untangling and removing all the random knots that had appeared in your headphone cords since you put them in.
Somehow getting headphones out of my pocket isn’t such a challenge to me
Did everyone forget that Galaxy S5 exists with headphone jack, removable battery and water resistance?
It was IP67 not IP68, which is what I stated. While it’s possible to have a headphone jack and IP68 resistance, it’s not cheap and you likely won’t find it on anything but niche flagship phones like the Asus Zenphone.
Nokia XR21 has IP69k and headphones jack. Galaxy Xcover6 pro has removable battery, headphone jack, and micro SD slot with IP68. S10e has IP68, headphone jack and SD card slot.
I don’t buy that headphone jack and SD card slot must disappear to achieve water resistance. They removed them because it was cheaper to produce and make you buy more expensive phone with bigger storage and wireless headphones once the battery degrades.
The limitation is not tech, it’s the cost to include those features in an IP68+ device. The XR21 is a $650USD phone, that’s near flagship prices, and very far from a budget phone.
Is it possible to create a device that has a jack, SD slot, and removable battery that’s also IP68+ certified? Absolutely, but doing that is quite a bit more expensive than the same features on an IP67 or lower device.
It’s not that it’s impossible, but the device will be both more expensive, and considerably thicker. Most people do not care about a headphone jack anymore, and even less so SD card slots and removable batteries. They want thinner, cheaper, waterproof phones. These features aren’t in high demand, and aren’t profitable for companies to produce.
Whole disagreeing with you on usefulness of the jack, I will still point out one correction.
The USB c standard actually includes analog audio pin outs. So fidelity wise there’s no difference between using the adapter vs a 3.5mm jack.
However, since the removal of the jack, most phones have really skimmed down the dacs. Makes me miss my LG v40.
Exactly. If anything, I’d much rather like to see a secondary USB-C port, preferably on top of the device. That would be an actual benefit for almost everyone.
The point is that their earbuds are absolutely non repairable, and admittedly so. Really hope they can improve that, but I think they might just discontinue the earbuds in favour of repairable headphones.
Do you really consider the $5 wired earbuds that came with the phone, the ones most people used, were repairable? Nah, they were way more disposable than even cheap wireless buds are these days.
You forgot the part where they used half the materials and parts.
Yet lasted 1/10th as long.
Still using the buds I got with my galaxy S4. They’ve outlasted 4 sets of BT buds.
Thanks for the anecdotal evidence, but in general those buds ended up in the trash in months, if not weeks. Out of all the people I know, pretty sure my wife is the only one that likes the wired buds that came with phones, but she went through a pair every few months. She switched to Pixel Buds a while back and only uses the wired ones when she runs, but still has to buy new ones twice a year.
Well, FairPhone also had wired earbuds where you could replace the wires, which is the main reason people throw away wired earphones.
@jol @Enk1 the earbuds aren’t on sale anymore, and they did release proper modular& repairable “Fairbuds XL” over-ears.
Ooof really? That’s a shame. The wired earbuds seemed cool.
@jol wait… this site’;s layout is confusing…
I meant fairphone discontinued their controversial bluetooth in-ears. Wired in-ear headphones in general are having a bit of a renaissance with so called “chi-fi”. Chinese brands launched after 2015, that sound great for $20-$50. Check out Crinacle’s youtube channel
Honestly the only place I still use wired is my 3DS, not the most hi-fi system.
That’s what these are for
They are also available in a few different shapes that may work better depending on device and user preferences and cost like 2-6 bucks on Ali. I use a different one with my steam deck that also has a little U adapter that 180s the plug direction and braces it against the back so it doesn’t torque off if I rotate the device in my hands.
Having a jack entirely avoids the introduced problem by only having a USB port. Ie. Dongles
3.5mm jack is practically unbreakable. My usbc port isn’t.
From personal experience, headphone jacks have been more susceptible to wearing out than USB-C.
Both of these can be partially remedied by cleaning the port, but after six years with my old phone even that didn’t work anymore. The USB-C port still did, however.
I’m waiting for one with a good camera.
@cyberpunk007 @fubbernuckin
the FP5 has a good sony camera. I’ve seen people install the pixel Gcam app for the extra post-processing
I mean, there’s no lack of USB-C earphones these days, and adapters are tiny. I think for a brand like FairPhone the cost cutting of a feature almost no User cares for really makes sense.
Yes, adapters are tiny but they stock out sooooo much. At least with corded earphones some of them come with 90 degree plugs which is so much better and lesser chance of something breaking.
@jol @fubbernuckin Fairphone 4 owner here. I already had a dongle when I got it. Nope, it’s pretentious towards dongles, check list for known working models: https://forum.fairphone.com/t/fp4-list-of-usb-c-to-3-5-audio-jack-adapter/79386
at least the usb port is easy to replace if extra stress hurts it. They ate the extra “cost” with bluetooth buds, made with Fair trade metals, like their first phone. But un-repairable. People wanted lego modular design and felt that taking away the jack and selling disposable headphones was a conflict of interests.