Democratic Senator Michael Bennet says GOP colleagues have privately confessed that the now-dead immigration deal was the toughest one they’d ever get.
You talk about “acceptable” and “deserving” but you have to realize that power is the only thing that matters in the end. They get power, they enact their whims. They don’t, they can’t. Right now, they have it, so you have to negotiate. That’s it, that’s just how it works.
People who complain about the Overton window are wasting their time. You don’t get to control that. Focus on winning what is possible with the window you have to work in. Expand that window if and when you can. Refusing to participate until the window looks like what you want it to is just ineffective.
And I just don’t agree with your characterization of the dems. I have my problems with their direction or actions at times, but they’ve fought and won for my rights and for the rights of various others in my lifetime. I do consider the more leftist parts of the party to be allies, but I’m not willing to give complete credit for those victories to only that wing of the party. I think it’s really disingenuous to look at the victories won for LGBT rights, climate change, and healthcare in the last 20 years (incomplete as they may be), and just write off the work done by democrats to achieve those.
Listen, spend your time shaking your fist at the democrats and ignoring the realities of politics all you like, but it’s not pragmatic. Again, I have my complaints, but overall I’m pleased with the way that democrats have operated recently. AOC is even a Democrat! It’s a big party with a lot of viewpoints, but has a throughline of empathy, minority rights, and democracy. There have been wins that have personally affected me in massive ways, almost entirely won by democrats.
I’m not much of a centrist really. I guess maybe on the global scale, but I’m a pretty average socdem. I’m not creating excuses for them at all. I’m mostly happy with what Democrats have accomplished and warded off for me and the country in my lifetime, so there’s nothing for me to excuse. There’s always room to grow and improve, for sure, but expecting perfection and my entire wishlist is ignoring those pesky real world obstacles again.
If you’re happy with the Dems, you’re not paying attention. While global warming ramps up, they ask for a slow transition to NATURAL GAS. Democrats do that for all topics. They are feet draggers and excuse makers.
Yes, that’s better than the cartoon villains of the Republicans… but if you’re happy to be represented by useful idiots… you’re not paying attention.
For all your noble ideals, you and much of the left has accomplished so little to achieve them. I share almost all of your convictions, but I value the people who can turn those dreams into a realistic plan and actually achieve it. That’s why democrats have won my right to marry others of my gender. Democrats have won my partner healthcare. You want more, but what have you ever actually won for me? I value your ideas, but you should stop hating your allies that spend blood, sweat, and tears getting what is feasible into reality. You can’t just ignore that you have obstacles and foes in your way who are going to chip away at what we all can do.
At the end of the day, we could be so much more productive together, focused on being better. Support and encourage to push things in your direction. Say “yes, and let’s do more!” instead of “no, you should be doing this”. We have complex problems to solve and nothing but imperfect people to fix them.
You talk about “acceptable” and “deserving” but you have to realize that power is the only thing that matters in the end. They get power, they enact their whims. They don’t, they can’t. Right now, they have it, so you have to negotiate. That’s it, that’s just how it works.
People who complain about the Overton window are wasting their time. You don’t get to control that. Focus on winning what is possible with the window you have to work in. Expand that window if and when you can. Refusing to participate until the window looks like what you want it to is just ineffective.
And I just don’t agree with your characterization of the dems. I have my problems with their direction or actions at times, but they’ve fought and won for my rights and for the rights of various others in my lifetime. I do consider the more leftist parts of the party to be allies, but I’m not willing to give complete credit for those victories to only that wing of the party. I think it’s really disingenuous to look at the victories won for LGBT rights, climate change, and healthcare in the last 20 years (incomplete as they may be), and just write off the work done by democrats to achieve those.
No, that’s the thing… we DO control the Overton window. Demovrats could easily stand their ground and keep it somewhere. They choose not to.
How much leftist progress came about because of Bernie and AOC simply being a voice of the left??
This shit matters, and Democrats CONSTANTLY shirk responsibility.
Listen, spend your time shaking your fist at the democrats and ignoring the realities of politics all you like, but it’s not pragmatic. Again, I have my complaints, but overall I’m pleased with the way that democrats have operated recently. AOC is even a Democrat! It’s a big party with a lot of viewpoints, but has a throughline of empathy, minority rights, and democracy. There have been wins that have personally affected me in massive ways, almost entirely won by democrats.
“Ignoring the reality of politics”
Ahh yes, you enlightened centrist, please tell me how CONSTANTLY letting dishonest actors be treated as if they are not dishonest helps anything?
The people denying reality are those like you. We NEED better than Democrats.
Stop creating excuses for them.
I’m not much of a centrist really. I guess maybe on the global scale, but I’m a pretty average socdem. I’m not creating excuses for them at all. I’m mostly happy with what Democrats have accomplished and warded off for me and the country in my lifetime, so there’s nothing for me to excuse. There’s always room to grow and improve, for sure, but expecting perfection and my entire wishlist is ignoring those pesky real world obstacles again.
If you’re happy with the Dems, you’re not paying attention. While global warming ramps up, they ask for a slow transition to NATURAL GAS. Democrats do that for all topics. They are feet draggers and excuse makers.
Yes, that’s better than the cartoon villains of the Republicans… but if you’re happy to be represented by useful idiots… you’re not paying attention.
For all your noble ideals, you and much of the left has accomplished so little to achieve them. I share almost all of your convictions, but I value the people who can turn those dreams into a realistic plan and actually achieve it. That’s why democrats have won my right to marry others of my gender. Democrats have won my partner healthcare. You want more, but what have you ever actually won for me? I value your ideas, but you should stop hating your allies that spend blood, sweat, and tears getting what is feasible into reality. You can’t just ignore that you have obstacles and foes in your way who are going to chip away at what we all can do.
At the end of the day, we could be so much more productive together, focused on being better. Support and encourage to push things in your direction. Say “yes, and let’s do more!” instead of “no, you should be doing this”. We have complex problems to solve and nothing but imperfect people to fix them.