You mean in 1534 when they were permitted by Ottomans to establish a Jewish City-State?
Or maybe you mean in 1821 when the Jewish adviser and finance minister to the rulers of the Galilee, Haim Farkhi, was murdered and the Ottomans allowed their army to conquer Galilee?
I’m not even sure what these have to do with modern Israel, which is ideologically a late 19th/early 20th endeavor.
Everything since 1917 was with the intention of creating a Jewish-majority state in Palestine. Palestine that’s, for obvious reasons, populated with Palestinians basically everywhere. You can’t have a Jewish majority state in Palestine without kicking Palestinians out of their home; it’s just not physically possible. And then you had a “Jewish state” with as many Jews and as few Palestinians as possible. Does that sound like the blueprint for an egalitarian state?
I’m not even sure what these have to do with modern Israel, which is ideologically a late 19th/early 20th endeavor.
You don’t think that the established Jewish territory prior to and during the 20th century has anything to do with modern Israel? You think that the revitalization of a Jewish homeland was unique to Zionist ideology when their occupation of both Galilee and Jerusalem was sanctioned by the Ottomans in 1534-1742?
You can’t have a Jewish majority state in Palestine without kicking Palestinians out of their home; it’s just not physically possible.
Of course you can, you just need more than one state. This had been the plan instituted by the British, but the British Mandatory authorities strayed from the plan as I already stated.
Of course you can, you just need more than one state.
No, because like I said you can’t have a state without a majority, or at least a significant minority, of Palestinians. It’s geographically impossible. That goes directly counter to the Zionist goal of a Jewish state with as many Jews and as few Palestinians as possible.
It’s a hard problem to solve. Every time Jews had established themselves in the area they got conquered or kicked out, who’s to say it wouldn’t have just happened again? And it doesn’t help that 5 Arab nations initiated a war of extermination before Zionists had the chance to expose these alleged intentions of ethnic-cleansing. In fact, Israel’s actions of returning land they had captured whenever Arabs went to war with them seemed to be in direct contradiction of the allegations.
When I examine the entire chain of events, I see two sides that had unrelenting ideologies. Not one.
Every time Jews had established themselves in the area they got conquered or kicked out, who’s to say it wouldn’t have just happened again?
What? Palestine has had Jews ever since the Arab conquest.
And it doesn’t help that 5 Arab nations initiated a war of extermination before Zionists had the chance to expose these alleged intentions of ethnic-cleansing.
Uh… There had been numerous massacres before Arab involvement in the war. Remember Dier Yassin?
In early April 1948, the Israelis launched Plan Dalet, a large-scale offensive to capture land and empty it of Palestinian Arabs.
In fact, Israel’s actions of returning land they had captured whenever Arabs went to war with them seemed to be in direct contradiction of the allegations.
Uh… What? Israel definitely didn’t return that land because they wanted to. Just look at the Golan Heights.
What? Palestine has had Jews ever since the Arab conquest.
And? Babylonian, Greek, Roman, and Byzantine conquests? Crusades? Ottomans deporting them from Tel Aviv and Gaffa? We just went over this, keep up.
Uh… There had been numerous massacres before Arab involvement in the war. Remember Dier Yassin?
Remember the Hebron massacre in 1929 and 1936-1939 Arab revolt in Palestine that I mentioned? Remember the Hebron massacre of 1834? 1921 Jaffa riots? Stop playing games.
In early April 1948, the Israelis launched Plan Dalet, a large-scale offensive to capture land and empty it of Palestinian Arabs.
“According to the Israeli Yehoshafat Harkabi, Plan Dalet called for the conquest of Arab towns and villages inside and along the borders of the area allocated to the proposed Jewish State in the UN Partition Plan.[4] In case of resistance, the population of conquered villages was to be expelled outside the borders of the Jewish state. If no resistance was met, the residents could stay put, under military rule.[qt 1][5][6][7]”
Nonviolent occupation under UN sanctions. Really spooky stuff.
Uh… What? Israel definitely didn’t return that land because they wanted to. Just look at the Golan Heights.
You’re going to have to provide sources for this. You’re genuinely coming across as extremely predisposed to pardon any attempt of complete, violent obliteration by Israel’s neighbors. It’s fascinating to watch though.
And? Babylonian, Greek, Roman, and Byzantine conquests? Crusades? Ottomans deporting them from Tel Aviv and Gaffa? We just went over this, keep up.
Those are all Europeans. They have 0 relation to anybody in the region today (except the Ottomans who are in kind of a weird spot).
Nonviolent occupation under UN sanctions. Really spooky stuff.
Nonviolent. Nonviolent? Do you believe what you just said?
You’re going to have to provide sources for this. You’re genuinely coming across as extremely predisposed to pardon any attempt of complete, violent obliteration by Israel’s neighbors.
Uh… Egypt had to declare a whole other war to get Israel to give back Sinai. The Golan heights are effectively Israeli territory today. Palestinians needed the first Intifada to get a semblance of nominal independence. Israel never gave back anything willingly.
Anyway I won’t engage any further, but you need some serious introspection if you actually believe the nonsense you just said.
I’m not even sure what these have to do with modern Israel, which is ideologically a late 19th/early 20th endeavor.
Everything since 1917 was with the intention of creating a Jewish-majority state in Palestine. Palestine that’s, for obvious reasons, populated with Palestinians basically everywhere. You can’t have a Jewish majority state in Palestine without kicking Palestinians out of their home; it’s just not physically possible. And then you had a “Jewish state” with as many Jews and as few Palestinians as possible. Does that sound like the blueprint for an egalitarian state?
You don’t think that the established Jewish territory prior to and during the 20th century has anything to do with modern Israel? You think that the revitalization of a Jewish homeland was unique to Zionist ideology when their occupation of both Galilee and Jerusalem was sanctioned by the Ottomans in 1534-1742?
Of course you can, you just need more than one state. This had been the plan instituted by the British, but the British Mandatory authorities strayed from the plan as I already stated.
No, because like I said you can’t have a state without a majority, or at least a significant minority, of Palestinians. It’s geographically impossible. That goes directly counter to the Zionist goal of a Jewish state with as many Jews and as few Palestinians as possible.
Completely baseless. Take it up with the British Mandate authority and the League of Nations that wanted them to be able to stand on their own.
I mean yes I do think the British and the League of Nations are as responsible for the current state of Palestine as Zionists.
It’s a hard problem to solve. Every time Jews had established themselves in the area they got conquered or kicked out, who’s to say it wouldn’t have just happened again? And it doesn’t help that 5 Arab nations initiated a war of extermination before Zionists had the chance to expose these alleged intentions of ethnic-cleansing. In fact, Israel’s actions of returning land they had captured whenever Arabs went to war with them seemed to be in direct contradiction of the allegations.
When I examine the entire chain of events, I see two sides that had unrelenting ideologies. Not one.
What? Palestine has had Jews ever since the Arab conquest.
Uh… There had been numerous massacres before Arab involvement in the war. Remember Dier Yassin?
Uh… What? Israel definitely didn’t return that land because they wanted to. Just look at the Golan Heights.
And? Babylonian, Greek, Roman, and Byzantine conquests? Crusades? Ottomans deporting them from Tel Aviv and Gaffa? We just went over this, keep up.
Remember the Hebron massacre in 1929 and 1936-1939 Arab revolt in Palestine that I mentioned? Remember the Hebron massacre of 1834? 1921 Jaffa riots? Stop playing games.
“According to the Israeli Yehoshafat Harkabi, Plan Dalet called for the conquest of Arab towns and villages inside and along the borders of the area allocated to the proposed Jewish State in the UN Partition Plan.[4] In case of resistance, the population of conquered villages was to be expelled outside the borders of the Jewish state. If no resistance was met, the residents could stay put, under military rule.[qt 1][5][6][7]”
Nonviolent occupation under UN sanctions. Really spooky stuff.
You’re going to have to provide sources for this. You’re genuinely coming across as extremely predisposed to pardon any attempt of complete, violent obliteration by Israel’s neighbors. It’s fascinating to watch though.
Those are all Europeans. They have 0 relation to anybody in the region today (except the Ottomans who are in kind of a weird spot).
Nonviolent. Nonviolent? Do you believe what you just said?
Uh… Egypt had to declare a whole other war to get Israel to give back Sinai. The Golan heights are effectively Israeli territory today. Palestinians needed the first Intifada to get a semblance of nominal independence. Israel never gave back anything willingly.
Anyway I won’t engage any further, but you need some serious introspection if you actually believe the nonsense you just said.