If they force subs back open, mods all over the site should go on strike. If the admins don’t value mods enough to honor their word and follow their own rules, they should see what an unmoderated reddit looks like. Maybe that will be a wake up call.
I was a mod and just quit entirely. Fuck them.
I think mods should just do a bad job at modding. Silent quitting ftw. Let bots through, let spam pass through. At this point reddit made it clear they don’t want to work with mods.
If they replace the mods and add the ability to vote out mods like they said, community should just repeatedly vote out the scabs.
Or sabotage it by only voting for the worst mods.
Won’t happen because the votes aren’t actually going to be votes. Reddit will just claim a majority voted in favor of kicking out the current ones, and then claim that no one wants to kick out the ones they instill
Yeah it’s not like Reddit is a governmental body here lmao. What’s the repercussion if they fake a vote? Downvotes?
Do mods have the power to just nuke their subreddit? That’d be the biggest move. If a few big subreddits were to do this, that’d be an instant and significant loss.
Just make a python bot that auto removes every single post and comment from the subs. That would completely kill Reddit in a matter of hours
This’ll do it once you identify the right buttons: Selenium. Pick the WebDriver for your browser, and then start writing code to pull up a browser and start pretending to be you clicking the buttons.
I know there’s Selenium IDE on there that’s easier, but it’s too fragile for anything of this scale. You could record it logging in and then hitting delete once, and then it fails because it can’t find the next delete link.
I imagine somebody inside reddit has already considered that as a possibility, assuming it’s something they can do, and will have a plan involving backups to restore them. Assuming the backups aren’t full of deleted posts or garbage by the time they realize they need them.
plans to pursue changes” that would let regular users vote moderators out more easily
I think that’s a good thing in the long run. A lot of reddit moderators are absolutely shit people, and having an actual process to remove them is a good thing.
It should go without saying fuck u/spez and that his motives here are absolutely malicious in nature, but I do see some small good coming from this.
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Then we also don’t know if the action is just temporary to just remedy a problem before IPO or a serious consideration. Rolling it out quickly is moronic too because what about smaller subs & targeted harassment.
It might also cause some interesting problems.
What happens if a sub votes out all the moderators of a sub, before there are any new ones?
Could they remove Reddit devs from /r/Reddit or /r/Reddit.com? Being admins, they could probably just put themselves back on, but the imagery of them being forced off their own sub is a little funny.
I’m sure there would be zero abuse of this functionality to harass pro or publicly out LGBT moderators and remove them from their positions.
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Lol yeah this is not what happens. If anything, it’s the “pro-LGBT” would be the ones abusing this system to take over subreddit, and it’s impossible to deny at this point. It was funny seeing Bardfinn fail at taking over subreddit in spectacular fashion once as the head mod managed to get his account back before it submitted the request. These mods would even spam CSEM using sock accounts then report the victim subreddit for being unmoderated. Subreddits would go into approved posting mode to defend against this. So no, you’ve pegged the wrong people that’d abuse such a system.
EDIT: source
Oh it certainly can rub both ways. I’ve been publicly out as trans since 2015 and am quite outspoken against the modern LGBT community (and banned from half the spaces at this point anyway). That certain grifters and power hungry individuals have figured out how to game the modern moral system doesn’t mean that there is never any legitimate harassment towards LGBT individuals.
“Listen and believe” is quite possibly the dumbest thing to become a mainstream argument. As if nobody would ever figure out they can abuse this policy to lie or have ulterior motives or want to air petty drama or want to paint a target on someone for their followers to harass. Minorities are to be treated as God reincarnate and can do and say no wrong. Want to be the shittiest, most toxic person on Earth? Go ahead! Just be sure to say you’re trans so anyone who calls you an asshole is being transphobic. It’s OK to do vile things like spam child porn on a forum you don’t like in an attempt to get it shut down or seized by authorities. The ends justify the means after all!
I’m well aware of AHS’s bullshit over the years and the many, many, many times they’ve tried to shut down subs I browse.
Someone used /r/redditrequest to request /r/reddit last night because it’s a community which only allows mods to post and is only utilized every few months. They were automatically denied.
Pretty obvious that these tools only apply to dissenting subs… after this all blows over, there won’t be a single reddit employee even looking at this system
They even explicitly stated that!
If there are mods here who are willing to work towards reopening this community, we are willing to work with you to process a Top Mod Removal request or reorder the mod team to achieve this goal if mods higher up the list are hindering reopening. We would handle this request and any retaliation attempts here in this modmail chain immediately.
This system is being implemented for the sole purpose of kicking out mods that are keeping subs private. It’s absolutely retaliatory. There’s no chance that they maintain this system as an actual long-term change to reddit’s mod removal policies. It would be too much overhead to staff.
I think they’re rolling it out rapidly at this point in time for the same reason that they’ve resisted it for years - it’s going to ‘force’ subs / mods to become more populist and more easily bent & manipulated by the whims of people “outside” the community, like reaching them via /all or similar.
No denying that Reddit has been ass as far as accountability and addressing problem moderators - but unless this mechanism is made super arcane black-box shit to prevent manipulation, this is very liable to result in tightly focused communities getting completely redirected.
Worse IMO is how much anything like a mod “election” is like grade-school Class President elections - it’s not about realistic campaign points, or about accomplishing meaningful things, it’s about popularity and talking hot shit, regardless of practical outcomes or larger implications. The kid who is gonna abolish detention, make recess four hours, and give our free gummy frogs every Tuesday is gonna win the vote - even if they can’t realistically make changes to the school and can’t afford candy for the class each week.
Just wait until spam rings start hijacking small subs via botnet mod votes.
Along with the “better mod tools” … I was laughing my ass off when the fuckstick spez said that while they cut off the 3rd party apps, they are diligently working and will soon have “better mod tools” immediately. Which of course prompted someone to link to a quote from spez himself saying almost verbatim the same thing 6 years ago.
Self burn - those are rare.
In 2018 spez defended use of the n-word and I’ve been itching to leave since. I hate I needed an alternative to leave, but liking it here.
Also, the devil in in the details. How will the voting process work?
I can foresee this having quite an impact on the infamous u/AwkwardTheTurtle.
I think it’s a weird way to look at moderation as if it was democratic. Voting bad mods out is one thing, but I don’t think you can just vote new good mods in. Moderation is a lot of unpaid work. Even if a large part of a community is unhappy with a mod decision, removing the mods doesn’t mean there will be people with that much time on their hands to step up, and even if there are, it’s not easy to choose the good ones among them by a simple popular vote…
Some of the subs I was on had some elaborate setups with mod tools and bots and the mods were still quite busy. Replacing them with randoms who then also don’t have access to the tools would be entirely pointless.
On the other hand, it’s a terrible system to have mods as unassailable tyrants.
As an example, I was banned from a popular sub for corrective someone about a minor detail of a shooting. I correctly cited the appropriate state law in question, and I was banned for being a right-wing extremist. I am a leftist, and linked numerous comments I had made in the past that reflected as such. The mods made a vague excuse about how my comment would just cause unnecessary confusion and muted me. People like that should not be allowed authority over anything, let alone a forum for public discourse.
On the other hand, it’s a terrible system to have mods as unassailable tyrants.
Absolutely.
Unfortunately, I think the best system requires trusting site Admin to oversee and enforce things like code of conduct and standards. Setting up an external appeal mechanism of some sort. In Reddit’s case, it would be a massive job and the company can’t afford the staff to do that themselves, isn’t trying, and has just tossed hands up and walked away from the problem entirely. They’re not really to be trusted and the userbase knows that, so that’s IMO why the site has never come up with a good solution to the issue.
Most other mechanisms have or create bigger problems than they directly solve, and no solution will prevent 100% of wrongful bans or abuses of power.
Open elections leave communities - especially small ones - open to being overwhelmed and hijacked, while even if that can be avoided tend to result in mods being unwilling to make any tough decision that might risk their popularity, while also pandering to populist interests within the community.
Closed elections (ie: community participation thresholds) can be gamed with a little more effort, but tend to have the opposite problem from above - you create a clique that runs the community, very similar to the existing problem with moderator teams who’ll have each others’ back no matter how shitty the others are.
Oversight boards are a moderately better solution, in that they remove the direct populism and much of the risk of community hijack, but there then runs the risk that the board(s) themselves get either hijacked, or rule on cases according to their own biases, putting slant on whole-site culture.
I think that’s a good thing in the long run. A lot of reddit moderators are absolutely shit people, and having an actual process to remove them is a good thing.
You want Nazi’s taking over? Because that’s how you get Nazis taking over.
Divide & conquer
“you better get back to working for free or we’re going to let the bots vote you out in the future.”
This.
Everytime a vote would happen sub are going to get lot of "new subscriber"that vote exactly for the pro-reddit mod
This seems to have rattled a few cages. r/Science the latest to effectively back down and unfortunately I think there will be more following suit.
r/nfl did an hour and a half ago.
This, for me, was the final straw. Deleted my reddit and joined some of the alternatives.
Agreed. I’m no longer active on the fairly popular sub that I founded, but I can only imagine how it would have felt to receive this message if I were.
I put endless hours of work into my sub for years. Brainstorming scalable rules, working with the community to maintain discussion quality, acculturating new users, dealing with problem users, working with OPs to help their posts meet expected standards of quality. And we did a good job. We regularly sought feedback and had a great relationship with our community.
The absolute entitlement of this guy coming along and saying that those communities into which we poured our blood, sweat, and tears belong to him. Because there is absolutely nothing in these changes that serve to improve mod quality. It’s all about forcing subs back open.
This is the danger of building a home on land that you don’t own. Steve is about to learn, though, that his land isn’t worth what he thinks it’s worth when he drives away everyone who wants to build on it.
“In a pinned message on r/funny, the biggest subreddit to go private before recently reopening, a moderator implored Reddit “to listen to its moderators, its contributors, and its everyday users” and asked it to “not tacitly enable bad actors by working against your volunteers.” r/Apple also recently reopened after being closed out of fears that it would be forcibly reopened. “We want the best for this community and have no choice but to open it back up — or have it opened for us,” a moderator wrote. Another r/Apple mod is resigning in protest of Reddit’s actions.”
Imagine having no spine, except that 1 mod (kudos to that person).
Why even bother to blackout if you are gonna bulge after the first threat?
Do even the subs themselves thought that 48 hours was enough to do something? Can someone be that naive?
I thought the subs were actually gonna abide by what the community wants?
How is opening up helping the community when you voted to be down indefinitely just 1 day ago? It is actively screwing them because it shows Reddit is right.
Following it up with a pinned message telling how you still not agree, b*tch please.
Just stop with the posturing then and bend over for Reddit already.
It is like an abusive relationship. Just imagine how much time these mods spend on those subs. How much effort they’ve put in. I don’t fault some of them for not being able to walk away or be unable to bear handing the keys over to a bad actor.
I fully understand that. Plus, there would be no way of organizing what I had mentioned anyway. I just sucks seeing this guy lie, and tear down these communities and quite frankly, escapes for a lot of people.
I saw a comment on r/eyebleach asking them not to go private again, because they like to browse it when they’re feeling down… all because of greedy ass hats.
If Reddit is your only escape then one needs actual help.
Putting all your hapiness or support system into a application that is owned by a handful of stakeholders/investors who are looking at nothing but profit is nothing short of ridiculous.
They could literally put everything behind a paywall when they want and your support system would be locked and/or unavailable.
Also with the person above about a “Abusive relationship” I have been in 2 of them and the best course of action is to walk away.
You otherwise will just get strung along until Reddit (the abuser) makes a decision that will see you cut off and in shambles. It will happen.
People are also starting to forget that 3rd party applications were a big help towards the community and for moderators. The fact that some vain threats are enough to bulge is well hilarious and expected.
Conspire against them, and “replace” the mods with more who are just going to continue to protest as well!
Wishful thinking, I know.
It’s really eye opening reading thinly veiled threats in Reddit’s wholesome chungus corporate-speak these past couple days. What a garbage company
Delete your posts, edit your comments.
https://kbin.social/m/RedditMigration/t/35158/Joyfully-running-Shreddit#entry-comment-150413
And then watch the fuckery as it gets reversed. That’s how low they’ve stooped.
I’ll just edit it again. More load on the reddit API is not my problem.
The problem is finding your comments that were undeleted. They no longer show on your profile. Really really scummy behavior.
I’m plenty familiar with my profile. I’ll know. If it happens, then I know I have made the right decision, and delete my account.
plans to pursue changes” that would let regular users vote moderators out more easily
I think that’s a good thing in the long run.
There is already a perfectly fine mechanism to deal with bad mods, you just go to a different sub. That approach has worked fine for many years.
There’s a reason they never added any other mechanism.
Don’t forget there are people with tens of thousands of aged accounts that are itching for ways to make money with them.
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