• @Deestan
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    185 hours ago

    Saying “murder” about a military participant in an ongoing invasion reeks of propaganda, not reliable news coverage.

    • @[email protected]
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      3 hours ago

      Was he killed in combat? Was he killed by a member of the armed forces? Was he on active duty?

      I think in his case it is not so clear to deem him a combatant and legitimate target by the laws around warfare.

      His assassination is kind of similar to the attack on the Pentagon in 09/11. That is the part attacking US army personnel in the building, not the abducting and murdering civilians in a plane part.

      He is a high ranking paper pusher at home, rather than an armed or at least deployed fighter. The attack was not carried out by regular armed forces, but by intelligence or intelligence affiliated partisan/terrorist (depending on point of view) groups.

      In a similar question one would have to ask, if the assassination of JF Kennedy wasn’t a murder then, since Kennedy was the leader of an invading army in Vietnam.

      • @chonglibloodsport
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        228 minutes ago

        The laws of war are way more permissive than you think. All military officers are lawful targets. Even civilians working for the “war machine” are lawful targets. Munitions manufacturing plants, for example, tend to be full of civilian employees. They are lawful targets because destroying the enemy’s ability to conduct war is a lawful objective of military necessity.

        • @[email protected]
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          14 minutes ago

          I now had time to look into the matter. It seems people here who assert it to be legal are quite off:

          https://lieber.westpoint.edu/assassination-law-of-war/

          Although the term treachery did not feature in the article, the sense that certain acts violate the law of war principle of chivalry, which is reflected in the work of the earlier scholars, was clear. In Article 101 of the Code, however, the term did appear, demonstrating its centrality to how war was not to be fought: “While deception in war is admitted as a just and necessary means of hostility, and is consistent with honorable warfare, the common law of war allows even capital punishment for clandestine or treacherous attempts to injure an enemy, because they are so dangerous, and it is difficult to guard against them.” In subsequent national and international codification efforts, treachery assumed a place of prominence in the treatment of assassination, as it had historically.

          The most recent comprehensive treaty governing the conduct of hostilities is the 1977 Protocol Additional (I) to the Geneva Conventions of 12 August 1949, and relating to the Protection of Victims of International Armed Conflicts. Additional Protocol I’s Article 37 styles acts during an armed conflict that were previously labeled assassination as “perfidy.” The article confirms again that the essence of the prohibition is treachery, not mere deception or trickery.

          1. It is prohibited to kill, injure or capture an adversary by resort to perfidy. Acts inviting the confidence of an adversary to lead him to believe that he is entitled to, or is obliged to accord, protection under the rules of international law applicable in armed conflict, with intent to betray that confidence, shall constitute perfidy. The following acts are examples of perfidy:

          (a) the feigning of an intent to negotiate under a flag of truce or of a surrender;

          (b) the feigning of an incapacitation by wounds or sickness;

          © the feigning of civilian, non-combatant status; and

          (d) the feigning of protected status by the use of signs, emblems or uniforms of the United Nations or of neutral or other States not Parties to the conflict.

          Note that the examples refer to the second sentence, to give someone false security by suggesting he would be entitled to protection under laws.

          Blowing someone up with an explosive disguised as a civillian item in a civllian environment seems to be quite perfidious.

          Assassination during wartime denotes (1) the treacherous, (2) wounding or killing, of (3) individual adversaries, in other words, perfidious attacks. Although the two terms often appear in the disjunctive, it is also reasonable to include outlawry, such as putting a price on the enemy’s head, within the scope of the definition assassination, as was done in the Lieber Code and suggested by Greenspan.

          Military manuals have occasionally suggested that assassination is limited to non-combatants or requires a particular mens rea. […] However, the historical intent of the prohibition during armed conflict was to encompass the treacherous killing of the enemy, not just non-combatants. This is clear from the Hague Regulations’ Article 23(b)’s reference to “individuals belonging to the hostile nation or army,” which would include civilians and members of the armed forces. Additionally, the prohibition of assassination contains no mens rea requirement beyond an intent to betray a confidence or to encourage others to kill the individual(s) by placing a price on their head.

          It is perfectly reasonable to speak of a murder here.

      • @FelixCress
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        31 hour ago

        Are you clinically insane or just a Russian troll?

        This guy was a war criminal, responsible for use of chemical weapons. He was also an active duty soldier killed during the war by enemy combatants, in an operation directed by military intelligence.

        It was definitely a legitimate killing, not a “murder” - if anything I would call it a pest control.

        • @[email protected]
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          46 minutes ago

          Can you link to a source for your respective claims?

          I am not unhappy, that he is gone, but i am also not unhappy about other people being gone, where legally it is considered a murder.

          The allegations that he was a war criminal, which probably is true, doesn’t justify killing him without a conviction, albeit afaik the ICC does not hand out death sentences.

          Are generals sitting at home active duty soldiers? I don’t know, but again this means, that any killing of any head of state that is also considered commander in chief is legal, if their country is involved in an invasion or illegal occupation. So assassinating US presidents would be perfectly legal by this logic like it would be to assassinate Putin.

          Military intelligence is not regular armed forces and i strongly doubt that Ukraine will be providing detailed evidence who committed the killing, so it is well possible that they used a third party.

          That you refer to humans as “pest” does indicate though, that you have a strong disregard for basic human rights. It is a language that fits the Russian invaders and other war criminals, who rely on dehumanization to further their crimes.

          Murder is a legal category. It does not matter how much you or i think it is morally justifiable. Devalueing humans as “pest” however is always a strong indication, that someone has no interest in rule of law.

  • @3minutespast
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    125 hours ago

    Hang on a minute. Is this the media endorsing the celebration of murder? Also if this was in pursuit of political change then are they also celebrating terrorism?

  • Weirdmusic
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    37 hours ago

    Ah, of course, that icon of non partisan high brow news and information the World Socialist Web Site

    • XIIIesq
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      5 hours ago

      Do you disagree with the article or just the source?

        • XIIIesq
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          35 hours ago

          The article seems factual and unbiased as far as possible can tell.

          • @FelixCress
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            24 hours ago

            What about the title? Since when killing a soldier during war is a murder?