What the title says, I’m tired of the trope where humans are the least advanced in the universe.
I’d like to read something different where we’re the more advanced ones (not necessarily the most advanced). As an example I quite enjoyed the Ender’s Game sequels and the angle of us being the more advanced ones was quite interesting.
Do you have any recommendations?
Project hail Mary was cool in the fact that it was just so… Different. Won’t say too much to avoid spoilers, but I think it’ll tick your boxes.
Was just going to suggest this same book! Very interesting take on what makes for a “more advanced” species.
Loved that book.
I highly recommend this book.
The culture series? It’s not outright said they’re human, but they’re clearly human. And they outscale basically every single thing in the universe. Or at least in the first few books. Might change later.
In Excession it felt more like
spoiler
The Culture is a race of intelligent starships that keeps humans as pets.
"Never forget I am not
this silver body, Mahrai. I am not an animal brain, I am not even some attempt to produce an AI through software running on a computer. I am a Culture Mind. We are close to gods, and on the far side."
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Thanks, will check it out.
If you haven’t read The Culture by Iain Banks, it’s among the best and most enjoyable sci-fi ever, in my opinion. The humans of the culture are quite near the most advanced in the universe, but there are entities more advanced, their own AI ships, prominently, but other species too that chose to “sublime” and exist outside of the normal universe, but because of that such ones are ever barely around. The humans of the culture could evolve that far too, but didn’t choose to do so yet in the series.
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Starship Troopers by Heinlein. Not at all like the movie. Pretty restrained, thoughtful, even meditative on war, fascism, military. One of my favorites.
Let’s be frank, the book was pro-fascism, and Heinlein was at the time himself pro-fascism. It’s still a good book, but calling it meditations on fascism sells it short.
Such a pile of shit. I’m so fucking tired of this old myth. Nothing about Heinlein was ever fascist and neither is this book.
Lmaoooo what a counterpoint to the hundreds of academics who have examined this and come to the same conclusion.
Quit your laughing smartass. Some have said that sure. Doesn’t make it fact or consensus. The guy was a fuckin American liberal socialist and then libertarian. Hardly goose-stepping. If you read the book it’s pretty fuckin obvious that commiting genocide isn’t Heinlein’s favorite things after Nazi memorabilia.
If you read his other books, it’s obvious he had strong political views one way or another. Not goddamn fascism.
The Bobiverse series eventually features some aliens. I don’t think that’s a spoiler at all… But they aren’t space-faring, so I dunno if that counts for what you’re looking for.
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I highly recommend the Bobiverse series as well, and feel free to join us over at lemmy.world/c/Bobiverse too!
I have a question about this series; I read maybe a third of the first book and so far it has felt a bit…i dunno, corny? So far the humor feels a little like low-hanging fruit and I have a hard time connecting with the main character because he’s just a mind and doesn’t seem to have much agency at this point. The larger world seems interesting and there’s plenty of mystery still but should I keep going or is it kinda more of the same?
Not trying to shit on it, I know a lot of people love it and I see it recommended all the time, and likewise it took me some getting used to the kind of goofiness of other series like Expeditionary Force, but just wondering if anyone else felt the same as me at first.
How you are viewing the book is incredibly valid.
The one way that I have come up with to describe a potential reason for the way the story is portrayed is this:
The ENTIRE series is from the perspective of a die hard semi-introverted software engineer and HUGE NERD who has this deep-seated need of just wanting to help and make things better.
Taking that into account everything written kind of states to make sense.
I love the series and it goes to some VERY interesting places.
There is one warning to give. At a certain point the book starts to suffer from scale creep. The characters are already able to do “X” so we need an enemy that can do “X+Y+Z” so now character learns to do "X+Y+Z TIME 10²“. At a certain point it’s best to just stop worrying about the explanations and just enjoy the story.
Highly recommend.
deep-seated
I fully blame autocorrect for that.
The ENTIRE series is from the perspective of a die hard semi-introverted software engineer and HUGE NERD who has this deep seeded need of just wanting to help and make things better.
TBH this makes it sound a lot like Ready Player One which I thought was quite bad, and I was getting similar sort of over-laden with pop culture references vibe here as well, but I’m willing to get it a bit more of a shot I think.
I just downloaded the 2nd audiobook and plan to start tomorrow. This series is really nice. The narrator is one of my favorite after hearing him narrate Project Hail Mary.
It’s criminal that no one has mentioned District 9 yet.
I would understand people ignoring it because of the fact that there is a space ship and they have tech, but the setting is ultimately about how the aliens completely need humanity’s help. There is a certain pairity in the movie since they are refugees with some better technology.
But anyway, it has a tremendous story, great action, pulls on the heart strings, super imaginitive idea of aliens being stuck on earth.
I agree, and I’m still waiting for a follow up…
We all are. :(
Old Man’s War series by John Scalzi. Humans are one of the newer space faring species but we are quickly becoming the most dominant group. Genetic engineering being a specialty. There are a few ascended species who are more advanced but they don’t really interact with the general galaxy anymore.
+1 for that series.
I love John Scalzi’s writing. And old man’s war is great fun. Finished the entire series in a single big binge over a few weeks.
Seconded. In @[email protected] Brin’s series humans are basically the only race that managed to uplift themselves making them a galactic oddball.
I inspired myself to reread it. So far, I’m pleased with my own recommendation
Sounds interesting, will check it out. Thanks.
No sweat!
The Road Not Taken by Harry Turtledove, about aliens trying to invade Earth and finding out there the less advanced race here
A fun little short story.
Ender’s Game by Orson Scott Card The Noon series by the Strugatsky brothers The Culture series by Iain M Banks (the protagonists are not humans, but a multi-species civilisation that includes humans) Strata by Terry Pratchett
Joe Haldeman - The Forever War
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Technically the aliens make the first step but true, it’s mostly about humanity reaching them. Excellent read.
One of my top ten fave scifi novels. Niven and Pournelle’s best work.
Did you know there was a sequel? Caught we totally by surprise last year and decades after I originally read Mote.
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Yes, while not as good as the OG, still a great read!
One of my favorite Sci-fi series books is the Ender’s game saga. I think this might meet your specifications. Don’t watch the movie! The book, as is often the case, is way better.
I’m glad I got to enjoy Ender’s Game before I learned about the author. I remember enjoying it, but teeth-grinding rage at the aims the author supports is going to prevent me from enjoying rereading it, or recommending it to anyone.
I am glad I don’t know about any of the authors politics. Now I will actively avoid information about him so as not to tarnish a good memory.
Children of Time sort of fits in. Also if you liked the Ender’s Game sequels and how he handled how aliens can truly be alien and the difficulty of aliens to communicate to each other you’ll most likely like the whole series by Adrian Tchaikovksy, and most likely some of his other sci-fi books.
I know referring people to Reddit is generally considered bad form around here, but check out reddit’s r/hfy. It’s mostly amateur stuff, but the subreddit centers around people writing stories about humans being good at something. I haven’t taken a look at it in a while, but some of the series I used to enjoy are: First Contact (the ralts_bloodthorne one), the Deathworlders (spawned the Deathworlders trope on TV tropes), Debris (ausnerd), Transcripts (squiggle story studios), They Are Smol (this is a god-tier scifi shitpost series by tinypracinghorse) along with its companion series The Smol Detective (frank leroux), and anything by regallegaleagle like Memories of Creature 88, Billy-Bob Space Trucker and Material Differences.
Memories of Creature 88 was amazing. It’s one of my favorite stories on HFY.
Thanks, will check it out when I have time, though I’m really looking for professional books (though I’m sure at least some of those you mentioned are definitely better than one of the worst sci-fi/fantasy books I ever read).
I say “amateur” in the sense that they’re free, tend to be released a chapter at a time (which means sometimes series go unfinished if the writer gets bored), and typically aren’t connected to a publisher. The writing quality itself can vary significantly with experience though, ranging from beginner to expert. Tbh, the ones I’ve listed are a lot better than 90% of the “professional” books I’ve read.
First Contact (by ralts_bloodthorne) and The Deathworlders are absurdly long at this point, so if you’re wanting something to keep you occupied for a long time, check those out.
Transcripts is very unique, and while the writing isn’t the best, it’s very wholesome. I don’t know how much I want to reveal, except that the differences between aliens and humans are “all in your head”. It brings up a number of subjects I haven’t really seen pondered in scifi, like how would an alien society with a significant empath/telepath population (significant enough to require telepathic translators) handle emotional outbursts? What are the moral issues of using cloning and gene editing to create individuals for a specific purpose in a society that is highly advanced in biotech but never figured out silicon? What if the society no longer has the base gene code for their member species because their previous masters destroyed it all in an act of spite? Are living machines morally acceptable?
Like I previously stated, They Are Smol is a shitpost and a good one at that. The first book is a little rough and the second one (the prequel aka the invasion of earth) has some serious emotional whiplash. However both are worth reading and written fairly well, just don’t expect 10/10 writing. The companion series, The Smol Detective, is a bit more serious but still kinda silly. It spoofs a lot of detective stories like Columbo, Sherlock Holmes, etc.
Regal Legal Eagle’s stuff is stellar, on par or better than pretty much any scifi I’ve read or watched. That said, Billy-Bob Space Trucker is his first book and is a bit rocky, especially at the beginning. However, it’s still worth reading for going full 'MURICA (written when “'murica” was a funny meme and not, “oh god what is going on”).
Debris is good and uses scifi as a lens for our current political climate (a human testing the first ftl capable ship experiences unexpected speeds and finds himself hundreds, if not thousands, of light-years from earth. He’s rescued by an alien freighter along with the debris of his craft, which is where the story starts). I wouldn’t say it’s really treading any new ground, but I’d say it’s still worth reading.
I can provide links if you’d like!
Edit: I also wanna say that /r/hfy stories (the good ones a least) tend to be a lot more… Colorful? Like, First Contact for an example, plays with the idea that humans, having become incredibly technologically advanced, only die if they have to. So stuff like Star Trek, Star Wars, Warhammer40k, Bolos, etc, are all semi-canon within the First Contact universe because different communities have reserved planets, stars, sometimes entire stellar clusters, for the purpose of LARPing these series with real weapons, full governmental systems, etc.
Like, something about a lot of hfy series tends to make them feel more real and engaging, whereas I’ve found a lot of published sci-fi works tend to end up feeling a little dry and humorless. Like, scifi is super serious business and we can’t discuss serious topics with a humorous tone.
HFY is a hit-or-miss kinda thing. Some of it feels like a professional book and some of it feels amateur.
A Fire Upon the Deep
Good recommendation indeed, the zones of thought are awesome. One of my all time favourites!
Will check it out, thanks!