“Grindset” is based in old puritan morality dictating that you must suffer in order to deserve anything, including to live. It’s still “Christian” values fucking us over.
I would argue it’s not really even a solid overlap with Christianity. Puritan ideals are a small subset of the overall Christian world, and might not even be the most relevant religiously centered ideals affecting our society today (prosperity gospel folks might be more politically relevant in America these days, and they are basically saying the opposite, that their religion offers promises of riches now in this life, and Catholics don’t seem as likely as Protestants to see toil as virtue).
Perhaps more importantly, there is a strong overlap with some cultural forces in distinctly non-Christian societies, like in India and China and Singapore and stuff, where people actively preach a philosophy where people must suffer in order to develop their characters and earn happiness/prosperity. I have had colleagues from Singapore (both Chinese and Indian heritage) who talked about this kind of stuff a lot, and it’s consistent with some of the LinkedIn nonsense that I see and make fun of on a regular basis. I think the concept and the origins of these ideas are pretty far removed from Christianity.
“Pressure creates diamonds, yes, but it also creates rubble.”
I like your analysis. It feels more optimistic than the idea of an upper class foisting it on us to have us work harder and question less. Though I suppose they’re not necessarily mutually exclusive things.
Do you think that these are unrelated? Capitalism builds on puritanical protestant ideology, which played a part in the early spread of capitalist ideology. See Weber’s The Protestant Ethic and the Spirit of Capitalism. It’s not a perfect cause and effect, but rather one piece of a web of cultural influences.
Left leaning spaces have become really good at pairing “don’t work too hard” meme’s with “I can’t pay rent or eat” memes and also “why can’t we get anything done” memes. They all go together.
People say that as we age that most people gravitate towards the right. I think it’s that as we age we slowly realize how full of shit the left are and how they really are just lazy people full of ideas they can’t bother to fight for themselves. That “grindset” or whatever the fuck you call it mentality is at the core of the right wing. And it shows in that they tend to hold power even when they don’t. The average right winger will drive across states just to go shit on some insignificant thing because they all feel they can change things in their life with effort. The left can’t bother to do much beyond tell others to disengage and not work too hard.
This is actually changing. Historically, folks usually moved more right as they aged, but that is shifting as folks agr now. Times are different, tons of people who did everything right can’t even afford a house now.
The left can’t bother to do much beyond tell others to disengage and not work too hard.
You’re American, aren’t you?
You do know that in the US, roughly one people out of 10 are literal millionaires, yet your major cities still have huge homeless populations (whom most have jobs by the way, some homeless people working several jobs) and literal shit on the street.
Say what you want about the Nordic model but it’s definitely much further left than whatever bullshit America is doing.
And we’re doing pretty okay. We have no human shit on our streets. Can you say the same?
I’m Canadian. We get American politics infecting our country all the time. I agree inequality is rampant. Which pisses me off even more how ineffective the left are at capturing any of the population. It’s dead in the water.
ineffective the left are at capturing any of the population. It’s dead in
In North America.
I think your sense of politics on a national level, is massively dirtied by your southern neighbour.
The left isn’t ineffective. Most people definitely know and favour leftist policies if you go ask them. Only some weird right wingers wouldn’t agree that it’s the government’s job to help it’s people.
So because there’s no good talking points on the right, the current propaganda is “don’t even support the left, they won’t achieve shit”. As is sowing apathy. Apathy is the single greatest tool an oppressor could wield. When people don’t believe change is possible, no-one does anything about it. “why bother” they say “it won’t work anyway”.
You can’t know until you try. I know I’m too guilty of this as well. But realising something and being able to not be affected by it are two different things.
The reason that Europe is yet to be fucked as bad as the US is that we still have prominent leftist parties who actually do further leftist agenda.
I can reject cookies when I visit websites. Thanks lefties.
I don’t have to pay for my medications or doctors. Well, at most like a few hundred. At most. And if you don’t make any money, you don’t have to, social security will take care of your bills.
What has the right done, on the other hand? Taken away free dental care from under 18’s, massively fucked the dental for adults as well, mostly privatised it. Similar attempts with other systems.
So if one is actively seeking to make my life worse by not caring a single bit about the consequences of their policies, and the other is attempting to drive through policies which would counter said privatisation, and also have attempts to help the general populace, then yeah, I know who I’m voting for.
Luckily I don’t live in a silly two-party system, although partisan systems in general are kind of dumb in my opinion, even the multi-party ones. But that’s a step too far to discuss with someone used to North-American politics, I think. I mean granted Canada isn’t a two-party system but in practice it is closer to the US as a system than most European governments.
And let’s just skip over the whole part where your spreading of apathy is playing directly into the pocket of the right wing American parties and thus serving the Russian agenda.
What has the Left actually accomplished anywhere in the last ten years? Not just the U.S. anywhere. Rejecting cookies isn’t an achievement.
Globally, the Right has regained power and is effectively spreading its ideas.
The Left, including its voters, are disengaged and uninformed. And the excuses are endless: morality, propaganda, oligarchy, anything but self-awareness.
The reality is simple, the average Leftist is being outclassed by the average person on the Right.
Results are what matter, and the results are bad. The Right dominates media and public narratives worldwide. The was a Left owned thing for the longest time. We were the internet ffs. Nowadays the left often doesn’t even understand what’s happening.
This isn’t Russian propaganda. It’s the Left’s own behavior, retreating from conflict, abandoning platforms, and calling it virtue. That vacuum gets filled. The Left did this to itself, and while it fights a bullshit war with a glorified spellchecker, the Right keeps gaining power.
You refuse to accept reality and just whine on about how left won’t ever work.
And weirdly, you won’t address the part where I point out your naive and nihilistic bullshit wrong.
Just because you don’t care or understand politics except for the ones you see talked about on comedy shows doesn’t mean that they don’t exist.
You ignored the part where I point out here an unemployed person will have subjectively completely free healthcare. Doesn’t have to pay a dime for their meds or doctors meets or treatments.
You also ignore the part where your rhetoric is playing right into the pocket of the right wing / Russian agenda.
You’re just yelling “left bad left bad” while implying the right doesn’t suffer from absolute lunatics and uninformed voters. “The left doesn’t know what the fuck is going on half the time.” And right wingers never do, living in some lalalalands of their own imaginings. So the left still wins by knowing their shit at least half the time.
Either you’re dimwitted or just straight up bad faith propaganda spamming.
Fuck your dimwitted attempt at spreading apathy. No data and only vague bullshit about NA politics. Educate yourself better.
“Grindset” is based in old puritan morality dictating that you must suffer in order to deserve anything, including to live. It’s still “Christian” values fucking us over.
I would argue it’s not really even a solid overlap with Christianity. Puritan ideals are a small subset of the overall Christian world, and might not even be the most relevant religiously centered ideals affecting our society today (prosperity gospel folks might be more politically relevant in America these days, and they are basically saying the opposite, that their religion offers promises of riches now in this life, and Catholics don’t seem as likely as Protestants to see toil as virtue).
Perhaps more importantly, there is a strong overlap with some cultural forces in distinctly non-Christian societies, like in India and China and Singapore and stuff, where people actively preach a philosophy where people must suffer in order to develop their characters and earn happiness/prosperity. I have had colleagues from Singapore (both Chinese and Indian heritage) who talked about this kind of stuff a lot, and it’s consistent with some of the LinkedIn nonsense that I see and make fun of on a regular basis. I think the concept and the origins of these ideas are pretty far removed from Christianity.
Pressure turns coal into diamond - My Indian father taught me
I don’t believe it applies to humans now tho. I believe it comes from poor people trying to justify their hardships.
It comes from rich people starting on third base telling others they aren’t working hard enough.
My father doesn’t work for a rich person, never did.
“Pressure creates diamonds, yes, but it also creates rubble.”
I like your analysis. It feels more optimistic than the idea of an upper class foisting it on us to have us work harder and question less. Though I suppose they’re not necessarily mutually exclusive things.
It’s really not, it’s about greed and capitalism. People aren’t grinding just for the sake of grinding.
Do you think that these are unrelated? Capitalism builds on puritanical protestant ideology, which played a part in the early spread of capitalist ideology. See Weber’s The Protestant Ethic and the Spirit of Capitalism. It’s not a perfect cause and effect, but rather one piece of a web of cultural influences.
Left leaning spaces have become really good at pairing “don’t work too hard” meme’s with “I can’t pay rent or eat” memes and also “why can’t we get anything done” memes. They all go together.
People say that as we age that most people gravitate towards the right. I think it’s that as we age we slowly realize how full of shit the left are and how they really are just lazy people full of ideas they can’t bother to fight for themselves. That “grindset” or whatever the fuck you call it mentality is at the core of the right wing. And it shows in that they tend to hold power even when they don’t. The average right winger will drive across states just to go shit on some insignificant thing because they all feel they can change things in their life with effort. The left can’t bother to do much beyond tell others to disengage and not work too hard.
This is actually changing. Historically, folks usually moved more right as they aged, but that is shifting as folks agr now. Times are different, tons of people who did everything right can’t even afford a house now.
Is it really changing?
Anecdotaly I see more right leaning people of all ages. People on the left are in hiding.
You’re American, aren’t you?
You do know that in the US, roughly one people out of 10 are literal millionaires, yet your major cities still have huge homeless populations (whom most have jobs by the way, some homeless people working several jobs) and literal shit on the street.
Say what you want about the Nordic model but it’s definitely much further left than whatever bullshit America is doing.
And we’re doing pretty okay. We have no human shit on our streets. Can you say the same?
I’m Canadian. We get American politics infecting our country all the time. I agree inequality is rampant. Which pisses me off even more how ineffective the left are at capturing any of the population. It’s dead in the water.
In North America.
I think your sense of politics on a national level, is massively dirtied by your southern neighbour.
The left isn’t ineffective. Most people definitely know and favour leftist policies if you go ask them. Only some weird right wingers wouldn’t agree that it’s the government’s job to help it’s people.
So because there’s no good talking points on the right, the current propaganda is “don’t even support the left, they won’t achieve shit”. As is sowing apathy. Apathy is the single greatest tool an oppressor could wield. When people don’t believe change is possible, no-one does anything about it. “why bother” they say “it won’t work anyway”.
You can’t know until you try. I know I’m too guilty of this as well. But realising something and being able to not be affected by it are two different things.
What has the left done that you would say it’s effective politically or culturally on the last ten years
Again, quit being so ethnocentric.
The reason that Europe is yet to be fucked as bad as the US is that we still have prominent leftist parties who actually do further leftist agenda.
I can reject cookies when I visit websites. Thanks lefties.
I don’t have to pay for my medications or doctors. Well, at most like a few hundred. At most. And if you don’t make any money, you don’t have to, social security will take care of your bills.
What has the right done, on the other hand? Taken away free dental care from under 18’s, massively fucked the dental for adults as well, mostly privatised it. Similar attempts with other systems.
So if one is actively seeking to make my life worse by not caring a single bit about the consequences of their policies, and the other is attempting to drive through policies which would counter said privatisation, and also have attempts to help the general populace, then yeah, I know who I’m voting for.
Luckily I don’t live in a silly two-party system, although partisan systems in general are kind of dumb in my opinion, even the multi-party ones. But that’s a step too far to discuss with someone used to North-American politics, I think. I mean granted Canada isn’t a two-party system but in practice it is closer to the US as a system than most European governments.
And let’s just skip over the whole part where your spreading of apathy is playing directly into the pocket of the right wing American parties and thus serving the Russian agenda.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_disinformation
What has the Left actually accomplished anywhere in the last ten years? Not just the U.S. anywhere. Rejecting cookies isn’t an achievement. Globally, the Right has regained power and is effectively spreading its ideas.
The Left, including its voters, are disengaged and uninformed. And the excuses are endless: morality, propaganda, oligarchy, anything but self-awareness. The reality is simple, the average Leftist is being outclassed by the average person on the Right.
Results are what matter, and the results are bad. The Right dominates media and public narratives worldwide. The was a Left owned thing for the longest time. We were the internet ffs. Nowadays the left often doesn’t even understand what’s happening.
This isn’t Russian propaganda. It’s the Left’s own behavior, retreating from conflict, abandoning platforms, and calling it virtue. That vacuum gets filled. The Left did this to itself, and while it fights a bullshit war with a glorified spellchecker, the Right keeps gaining power.
You refuse to accept reality and just whine on about how left won’t ever work.
And weirdly, you won’t address the part where I point out your naive and nihilistic bullshit wrong.
Just because you don’t care or understand politics except for the ones you see talked about on comedy shows doesn’t mean that they don’t exist.
You ignored the part where I point out here an unemployed person will have subjectively completely free healthcare. Doesn’t have to pay a dime for their meds or doctors meets or treatments.
You also ignore the part where your rhetoric is playing right into the pocket of the right wing / Russian agenda.
You’re just yelling “left bad left bad” while implying the right doesn’t suffer from absolute lunatics and uninformed voters. “The left doesn’t know what the fuck is going on half the time.” And right wingers never do, living in some lalalalands of their own imaginings. So the left still wins by knowing their shit at least half the time.
Either you’re dimwitted or just straight up bad faith propaganda spamming.
Fuck your dimwitted attempt at spreading apathy. No data and only vague bullshit about NA politics. Educate yourself better.