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Source? I can not find anything that says Crowder was even aware of Hale on March 27, 2023 (Day of shooting) and the earliest mentions of the writing’s release are November 6, 2023.
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Thank you for the sources, I see you revised your statement, although I do wonder your thoughts considering the sources provided. They seem to take the position that the leak shows Hale’s intent was based racially rather than any sexual orientation and that Crowder intended to show that.
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Ah yes the ultimate punishment: don’t have to work, and you get paid.
Lemmy: Unions are absolutely necessary to protect worker’s rights!
So police unions should fight for their members to be on paid leave until the truth is out and the case settled?
Lemmy: Not like that!
It really is a conundrum and I just happened to be thinking about it today. I got no answers. Maybe blacklist them once convicted? Could it be that easy? But why would the unions go for that? Also, I’m pretty sure blackballing worker’s is straight up illegal.
I’m very opposed to taking away people’s rights, employment, etc., on the strength of a mere accusation. OTOH, I loathe police.
And if you young people think you hate 'em, let me tell some tales of the 80’s and 90’s. They’re so much more professional compared to those days, it’s stunning to me.
(Some 14-yo will come along and call me a bootlicker. Get it over with.)
EDIT: There are some great ideas below. The kinda conversation I wished to have. Thanks to those who spoke sanely.
You realize police unions are nothing like other unions, right? Because their employees effectively get carte blanche to kill.
Don’t make false equivalences. That does not a good argument make.
That doesn’t mean that the union itself should be scrapped.
Put it this way…in any other career, suspensions with pay would be something a union probably should provide for employees. It’s “innocent until proven guilty” and employers should not be able to withhold pay or hours on accusations or theories alone. That also incentivizes prioritizing the investigation.
To say cops shouldn’t have this benefit, I think, would be especially unfair…because cops are in a position to receive far more baseless accusations from the public. Their job is literally to make peoples days shit.
https://lemmy.world/comment/5267126
Instead of repeating, I’ll link to my previous response.
So we pull the plug on police unions? On what legal grounds, what precedent? We would almost have to make law enforcement a distinct class of citizen.
And for the record, I believe they are a different class of citizen and I believe they should be held to higher standards. And yes, if I had my druthers, that distinction would be written into law, perhaps even on a federal level.
But how do we legislate that? Also, if we do this thing, it’s going to cost a mountain of political capital. “Defund the police” is the dumbest political slogan I’ve ever heard in life. The idea is rock solid, the soundbite ain’t. Now imagine trying to push legislation that pulls the teeth on cops.
Maybe my premise was dumb, but I want to explore solutions. Been pushed around, jailed and had my ass beaten by cops with utter impunity. And I’m a white guy! Imagine how this shit goes for others.
I like the idea of making cops carry insurance. Too many incidents and their premiums go up or they get dropped. This also pushes the costs off of the taxpayers when these incidents happen.
I’m sure there are issues with this approach though
I love the idea, and see it as the most workable way to bring police under some kind of genuine public control.
Probably the only issue with it is that the cops and their unions would be opposed. They’d shout loudly that it’ll lead to mayhem in the street, rape and pillage, gang warfare, anarchy, human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together, mass hysteria, etc.
Police as a whole need to be gutted. It’s a body of force that is largely unnecessary and reactive. They are not a useful arm of public safety. They are an arm of force.
If you want crime to drop, invest in public health, housing, minimum wages, education, and other social safety nets. Then police can be used as an arm for the rare circumstances that force and punishment would actually be needed for.
Right now, police are a massive taxpayer funded powerhouse with virtually no oversight, carte blanche to fucking KILL, and have extremely low repercussions for abuse of their power.
Fuck the police.
If they have to be licensed, there’s not a thing the unions can do. When a cop causes harm, they lose their license, like a hundred other professions. No license, no employment. Go cry, union.
On paper it makes sense. In practice it’s a way for them to act like something was done when in reality they’re given a paid vacation.
The largest part of the problem is how loyal they are to each other. If a teacher gets fired for misconduct, it’s exponentially harder to get another job as a teacher. Even if it’s in an entirely different state… Where a cop can go to the next precinct and get a desk job without much hassle.
Exactly why I brought up blackballing! Again, I’m pretty sure that’s illegal, but fuck else can we do?
EDIT: Took a poke at looking up blackballing/blacklisting. tl;dr: Depends on the state (US).
Maybe it doesn’t have to be a “do not hire” list and more of a publicly available “here are the facts of this officer’s departmental separation”?
When a given cop gets hired again and causes more trouble, we’d had a voice to say, “And you (hiring dept.) already knew about this?!”
