There is growing concern about the harmful impact of pesticides on human health, agriculture and biodiversity, prompting calls from researchers to reduce their prevalence.
You know what I hate about this? In the past, you could very easily vote with your wallet by spending it on organic food, instead of this poison laden crap.
But these days, food is so expensive that very few have that option, so we pay a premium to these companies who really don’t give a damn about us, the planet, or biodiversity.
You know what I hate about this? Somewhere someone is getting paid to allow the ag industry to slide on requirements, with the end result of people being poisoned. And we have zero say or representation.
Well in the land of the fee, you might have about 50 000 say in total to be divided up to what you need (a bunch of that going straight to your landlord or mortgage company anyway), while big agriculture firms have 10 000 000s of say dedicated to the policy initiatives they want.
The dose makes the poison. They’re taking a science-based process to update the maximum residue limit.
…don’t give a damn about us, the planet, or biodiversity.
Significantly more land would have to be allocated to agriculture to produce the same amount of food without pesticides. That’s not good for the planet or biodiversity.
Yeah but what if by increasing its usage, it means that you get more into the underground water supply and you end up with elevated concentration in drinking water because of this?
It is pretty well understood at this point that a significant portion of pesticide runs off into our environment. It is reasonable to assume that an increase in usage will increase runoff and therefore increase risks of contamination.
Bro we’re not going to run off into a field with equipment and test this ourselves.
There has been many studies on the subject, done by scientists, with reports, that have been published. Some of which have been reported in the news and that also influenced Europe into taking the decision to stop using glyphosate and to reduce the usage of pesticides in general.
I’ve read many news articles on the subject over time and I know enough to know that we need to decrease our usage and use natural alternatives where possible because it has long term effects on our environment affecting drinking water, pollination insects such as bees, and can cause cancer in humans and animals.
Stop telling people to use the scientific method and science like we’re going to go out there and run experiments on our own like we have time to do that in our busy lives and we’re all environmental or chemical scientists. We’re not. We keep ourselves informed through the reports that have already been published as journalists who investigate into these things.
Why are you so pro pesticides? It’s not rocket surgery to connect these chemicals to various health and ecological issues today, some of which can take years to underatand/surface. This is clearly legislation designed for profits over human and environmental health. It is well documented and reaearched that many pesticides have serious health hazards, its kind of part of their job. “Science based apporach” is the media/governments term asking you not to question their decisions.
I’m not pro pesticides. I’m pro environment and this is a complex situation where we should use systems thinking. Pesticides increase crop yields which means less land needs to be used for agriculture. Less land used for agriculture means less deforestation which mitigates climate change. There is obviously a balance here, too many pesticides will have negative affects on the local environment and humans but too few pesticides will also have negative affects on the environment (and by proxy humans). Determining an accurate safe maximum residue limit helps farmers safely maximize crop yields. The dose makes the poison is the basic principle of toxicology. These limits aren’t being determined by politicians or companies, they’re being determined by Health Canada. It is difficult to be a corrupt scientist in Health Canada so I don’t believe the scientists involved in this system will have perverse incentives. I’m not pro pesticides, I’m pro environment.
These limits aren’t being determined by politicians or companies
Are you sure?
For instance, on June 27, the PMRA announced plans to increase the MRL for the fungicide fludioxonil on imported sugar beets from 0.02 parts per million (ppm) to 4 ppm. The increase was requested by pesticide manufacturer Syngenta so foods that contain levels of fludioxonil currently allowed in the U.S. but not in Canada can be imported and sold in here.
When Syngenta is involved, I’m extremely skeptical that the process is scientific or rather that the variables optimized for are people’s or the environment’s health. The dose isn’t an on/off switch, it isn’t boolean. Given Syngenta’s track record, I’m guessing that they’re optimizing for how much they can sell before the damage is apparent to most. I do believe they’re scientifically establishing these amounts.
“Safe Food Matters president Mary Lou McDonald agreed. Accessing the health and safety data the PMRA uses to determine MRLs is challenging due to stringent limits on what data can be seen — and shared — by the public to protect pesticide companies’ intellectual property. She noted issues with the accuracy and relevance of the data used by the government in its assessment process.
Moreover, she noted the PMRA and pesticide manufacturers have a close working relationship — an issue also flagged by Lanphear.“
The term “science-based process” is directly from the “Government of Canada moves forward on commitments to strengthen the pesticide review process” press release. I don’t believe in anti-science conspiracy theories. If there are issues with the data being used to make these decisions then that should be addressed but there is no evidence of that. You quoted the opinion of a trained lawyer from an anti pesticide charity, not a scientist.
You know what I hate about this? In the past, you could very easily vote with your wallet by spending it on organic food, instead of this poison laden crap.
But these days, food is so expensive that very few have that option, so we pay a premium to these companies who really don’t give a damn about us, the planet, or biodiversity.
You know what I hate about this? Somewhere someone is getting paid to allow the ag industry to slide on requirements, with the end result of people being poisoned. And we have zero say or representation.
The only say we have anymore is to do something about it.
Then they call those people eco-terrorists.
Well in the land of the fee, you might have about 50 000 say in total to be divided up to what you need (a bunch of that going straight to your landlord or mortgage company anyway), while big agriculture firms have 10 000 000s of say dedicated to the policy initiatives they want.
That’s a really long way to call me poor 😂
Well done. 👏
It seems like you can still vote with your wallet. It just takes harder voting.
The dose makes the poison. They’re taking a science-based process to update the maximum residue limit.
Significantly more land would have to be allocated to agriculture to produce the same amount of food without pesticides. That’s not good for the planet or biodiversity.
Yeah but what if by increasing its usage, it means that you get more into the underground water supply and you end up with elevated concentration in drinking water because of this?
If it’s dangerous then obviously stop doing it. But use science to test your hypothesis
It is pretty well understood at this point that a significant portion of pesticide runs off into our environment. It is reasonable to assume that an increase in usage will increase runoff and therefore increase risks of contamination.
Don’t assume, test the hypothesis. Why are you so against using the scientific method?
I’m honestly pretty shocked at how anti science this thread is. Wanting proof that something is safe or unsafe shouldn’t be a controversial position.
Bro we’re not going to run off into a field with equipment and test this ourselves.
There has been many studies on the subject, done by scientists, with reports, that have been published. Some of which have been reported in the news and that also influenced Europe into taking the decision to stop using glyphosate and to reduce the usage of pesticides in general.
I’ve read many news articles on the subject over time and I know enough to know that we need to decrease our usage and use natural alternatives where possible because it has long term effects on our environment affecting drinking water, pollination insects such as bees, and can cause cancer in humans and animals.
Stop telling people to use the scientific method and science like we’re going to go out there and run experiments on our own like we have time to do that in our busy lives and we’re all environmental or chemical scientists. We’re not. We keep ourselves informed through the reports that have already been published as journalists who investigate into these things.
Why are you so pro pesticides? It’s not rocket surgery to connect these chemicals to various health and ecological issues today, some of which can take years to underatand/surface. This is clearly legislation designed for profits over human and environmental health. It is well documented and reaearched that many pesticides have serious health hazards, its kind of part of their job. “Science based apporach” is the media/governments term asking you not to question their decisions.
I’m not pro pesticides. I’m pro environment and this is a complex situation where we should use systems thinking. Pesticides increase crop yields which means less land needs to be used for agriculture. Less land used for agriculture means less deforestation which mitigates climate change. There is obviously a balance here, too many pesticides will have negative affects on the local environment and humans but too few pesticides will also have negative affects on the environment (and by proxy humans). Determining an accurate safe maximum residue limit helps farmers safely maximize crop yields. The dose makes the poison is the basic principle of toxicology. These limits aren’t being determined by politicians or companies, they’re being determined by Health Canada. It is difficult to be a corrupt scientist in Health Canada so I don’t believe the scientists involved in this system will have perverse incentives. I’m not pro pesticides, I’m pro environment.
cc: /u/[email protected]
Are you sure?
You must be aware of the way lobbying works.
When Syngenta is involved, I’m extremely skeptical that the process is scientific or rather that the variables optimized for are people’s or the environment’s health. The dose isn’t an on/off switch, it isn’t boolean. Given Syngenta’s track record, I’m guessing that they’re optimizing for how much they can sell before the damage is apparent to most. I do believe they’re scientifically establishing these amounts.
Stop saying “science-based process,” Greg.
“Safe Food Matters president Mary Lou McDonald agreed. Accessing the health and safety data the PMRA uses to determine MRLs is challenging due to stringent limits on what data can be seen — and shared — by the public to protect pesticide companies’ intellectual property. She noted issues with the accuracy and relevance of the data used by the government in its assessment process.
Moreover, she noted the PMRA and pesticide manufacturers have a close working relationship — an issue also flagged by Lanphear.“
The term “science-based process” is directly from the “Government of Canada moves forward on commitments to strengthen the pesticide review process” press release. I don’t believe in anti-science conspiracy theories. If there are issues with the data being used to make these decisions then that should be addressed but there is no evidence of that. You quoted the opinion of a trained lawyer from an anti pesticide charity, not a scientist.