Doctors aren’t the only ones with power to end the strike. What about their demands? Doctors who aren’t getting what they need aren’t able to provide the best care either.
Understaffing, penny-pinching, forcing medical professionals to take on more and more work with no help, to say nothing of increased pay. These working conditions hurt patients chronically.
That’s why doctors and nurses strike. Especially THESE doctors - the new ones who just graduated from medical school. They’re the single most exploited group of people working in healthcare when you account for how little they are paid in comparison to how much they’re expected to work and how much revenue they generate.
In the US we call them resident doctors. In the UK junior doctors. I absolutely support their strike
It’s the government that has systematically been selling off the NHS to private companies and allowing private insurers to let those who can pay skip those queues making them longer for everyone else, and it’s the government that has refused to give enough money both to the NHS itself and its staff (intentionally, so that it can’t function, which makes people like you complain about queues and blame strikes instead of looking at why they are both happening in the first place, while they’re busy doing the aforementioned selling off and profiteering).
Well done for putting yourself up as an example to show everyone who this propaganda is aimed at and how well it works.
Whilst I agree that the daily mail is a peice of toilet paper, the rest of this post is concerning.
I would encourage you not to see the world in black and white. The NHS has been outsourcing operations to private providers since Tony Blares day, it’s not a new occurance.
Also private doesn’t have to mean american style healthcare. I would strongly encourage you to read up about how health care works in Germany and Franc. Both have fully privatised health care with goverment provided insurance coverage. Their systems are more efficient and provide better outcomes than the UK, whilst spending less money per person.
Whilst I agree front line staff are under paid, I also think the NHS suffers from poor management on a mid to upper level and that a polarised view set discourages us from seeking meaningful reforms.
The Dutch private system works very well, too. Unfortunately, as an American looking across the pond, it sure reads an awful lot to me like they’re just aching to get in on the absolute scam of a healthcare system we have here.
If doctors aren’t working, patients aren’t being seen.
It’s not really that deep, but for some reason you’ve assumed my entire political philosophy from one short comment. Which is precisely the problem with political debate nowadays.
Okay, so this kind of rationale is used a lot in the US to justify treating all kinds of professions (almost always those that exist at the action layer, where you’re doing the actual nominal work of the business) like shit. The rough format is “Won’t someone PLEASE think of the {customer}?!” Of course, this is always aimed at the people at the action layer, never ever at the administrative level. So, it might be more accurate to say “YOU need to care about the customer [because nobody else will].” It’s often very closely tied to sacrifice rhetoric in the workplace, where the employer places the onus on the employee to sacrifice, often without any bound. In other words, to accept personal loss with no expectations of recompense; they’ll take as much as they can get from the employee, and no amount of sacrifice will ever be ‘enough’, as there will always be some new crisis demanding a new sacrifice.
In teaching, this is “Won’t someone please think of the kids? What will they do if there’s no school? Remember why we’re here, it’s about the kids.” In EMS and all of healthcare, just replace the kids with the patients. It’s very common to see this in any industry where they think they can get away with paying their people in passion. It’s shitty and exploitive, and it ultimately does a disservice to the customer by creating high employee turnover, low organizational experience, organizational dysfunction (often in spite of ballooning admin costs and positions in these types of sectors) and more burned out employees.
How about, refusal to pay fair wages to [insert worker category] harms [insert end user]?
Article says it’s coming into a period when the NHS is coming under pressure- what do you think that translates to for the doctors and healthcare professionals that prop up that system? Sunshine and roses?
I made no comment on the merits of the strikes. I just said that if the doctors aren’t working then they’re obviously not seeing patients, which in turn will lead to treatments being delayed further. Which is obvious, so the headline is technically correct.
Not sure why people think that’s such a controversial thing to say. 😂
Okay, so, technically it may be correct, that there’s a causal relationship between access to medical services, the demand on those services and the availability of those providing the services. If supply goes down due to a strike, then yes, services are being interrupted to those who need them, and thus the situation is “harming” patients… By some definition of “harm”.
However, this bullshit headline implies that doctors are actively and intentionally harming patients and they are exclusively responsible for that, which is entirely untrue.
It’s the government’s responsibility to ensure that the healthcare system operates effectively and efficiently, and if they’re pushing people to the point where they feel that they need to execute a strike in order to be heard, that’s a significant sign of poor management at best, IMO.
The headline tries to shift the concept of responsibility for patients being “harmed” from the lack of doctors due to the strike… From the government, who is actually at fault, to the doctors, who are simply trying to get a fair deal.
The government for not negotiating to get this nonsense sorted out quicker, and the doctors for choosing to withdraw their labour. The doctors know full well that this will harm patients, but they chose to do it anyway. So let’s not pretend this is a one-sided thing.
I am not truly sure I could blame either side of that.
The government were - and are - people who explicitly campaign with/for this shit. You could be angry if they didn’t completely trash the country, its finances, and its health system to enrich themselves, after all that’s their very agenda. Voters for them - much as I cannot understand why anybody would vote that way - would rightfully be angry if they did stuff like care for anybody but themselvs. The voters would have been lied to.
At the same time, the doctors can only do so much to protest while also ensuring patients get as much care as possible. I talk to a doctor frequently. She was recently diagnosed with advanced-stage breast cancer while around the same time her mum was also diagnosed with cancer. You know what she did? Go to work. And do long hours. More than she is paid for. Becaue there’s no alternative. No one else can see to the patients. She would rather need to recuperate herself and care more for her mum, but there’s just no option. That’s so fucked up I lack words, and it also means the UK has a natural doctors problem: The ones that don’t move away because fuck, why wouldn’t you?!, they die off faster rather than slower or at least quit the field to protect their own health.
At some point, doctors end up having to force the issue. If they don’t do it, things never improve.
Well, appointments are being cancelled because of the strikes, so technically that’s correct? 🤷
Doctors aren’t the only ones with power to end the strike. What about their demands? Doctors who aren’t getting what they need aren’t able to provide the best care either.
Understaffing, penny-pinching, forcing medical professionals to take on more and more work with no help, to say nothing of increased pay. These working conditions hurt patients chronically.
That’s why doctors and nurses strike. Especially THESE doctors - the new ones who just graduated from medical school. They’re the single most exploited group of people working in healthcare when you account for how little they are paid in comparison to how much they’re expected to work and how much revenue they generate.
In the US we call them resident doctors. In the UK junior doctors. I absolutely support their strike
It’s the government that has systematically been selling off the NHS to private companies and allowing private insurers to let those who can pay skip those queues making them longer for everyone else, and it’s the government that has refused to give enough money both to the NHS itself and its staff (intentionally, so that it can’t function, which makes people like you complain about queues and blame strikes instead of looking at why they are both happening in the first place, while they’re busy doing the aforementioned selling off and profiteering).
Well done for putting yourself up as an example to show everyone who this propaganda is aimed at and how well it works.
Whilst I agree that the daily mail is a peice of toilet paper, the rest of this post is concerning.
I would encourage you not to see the world in black and white. The NHS has been outsourcing operations to private providers since Tony Blares day, it’s not a new occurance.
Also private doesn’t have to mean american style healthcare. I would strongly encourage you to read up about how health care works in Germany and Franc. Both have fully privatised health care with goverment provided insurance coverage. Their systems are more efficient and provide better outcomes than the UK, whilst spending less money per person.
Whilst I agree front line staff are under paid, I also think the NHS suffers from poor management on a mid to upper level and that a polarised view set discourages us from seeking meaningful reforms.
The Dutch private system works very well, too. Unfortunately, as an American looking across the pond, it sure reads an awful lot to me like they’re just aching to get in on the absolute scam of a healthcare system we have here.
deleted by creator
If doctors aren’t working, patients aren’t being seen.
It’s not really that deep, but for some reason you’ve assumed my entire political philosophy from one short comment. Which is precisely the problem with political debate nowadays.
And whose fault is it that those doctors aren’t working?
Could it be… The people not paying them enough?
Okay, so this kind of rationale is used a lot in the US to justify treating all kinds of professions (almost always those that exist at the action layer, where you’re doing the actual nominal work of the business) like shit. The rough format is “Won’t someone PLEASE think of the {customer}?!” Of course, this is always aimed at the people at the action layer, never ever at the administrative level. So, it might be more accurate to say “YOU need to care about the customer [because nobody else will].” It’s often very closely tied to sacrifice rhetoric in the workplace, where the employer places the onus on the employee to sacrifice, often without any bound. In other words, to accept personal loss with no expectations of recompense; they’ll take as much as they can get from the employee, and no amount of sacrifice will ever be ‘enough’, as there will always be some new crisis demanding a new sacrifice.
In teaching, this is “Won’t someone please think of the kids? What will they do if there’s no school? Remember why we’re here, it’s about the kids.” In EMS and all of healthcare, just replace the kids with the patients. It’s very common to see this in any industry where they think they can get away with paying their people in passion. It’s shitty and exploitive, and it ultimately does a disservice to the customer by creating high employee turnover, low organizational experience, organizational dysfunction (often in spite of ballooning admin costs and positions in these types of sectors) and more burned out employees.
“Look at how the poors keep trying to hurt the money!”
Ya an over worked under paid medical workers with limited resources is preferred… The only people hurting others is wealthy individuals
How about, refusal to pay fair wages to [insert worker category] harms [insert end user]?
Article says it’s coming into a period when the NHS is coming under pressure- what do you think that translates to for the doctors and healthcare professionals that prop up that system? Sunshine and roses?
Patients are already being harmed by draconian healthcare systems.
Back to reddit you go
The overreaction to a simple comment suggests it’s everyone else that needs to go back to Reddit.
What a weird thing to say.
Not at all. An understandable comment given that you ignored the thoughtful comments about why doctors are striking.
I made no comment on the merits of the strikes. I just said that if the doctors aren’t working then they’re obviously not seeing patients, which in turn will lead to treatments being delayed further. Which is obvious, so the headline is technically correct.
Not sure why people think that’s such a controversial thing to say. 😂
Okay, so, technically it may be correct, that there’s a causal relationship between access to medical services, the demand on those services and the availability of those providing the services. If supply goes down due to a strike, then yes, services are being interrupted to those who need them, and thus the situation is “harming” patients… By some definition of “harm”.
However, this bullshit headline implies that doctors are actively and intentionally harming patients and they are exclusively responsible for that, which is entirely untrue.
It’s the government’s responsibility to ensure that the healthcare system operates effectively and efficiently, and if they’re pushing people to the point where they feel that they need to execute a strike in order to be heard, that’s a significant sign of poor management at best, IMO.
The headline tries to shift the concept of responsibility for patients being “harmed” from the lack of doctors due to the strike… From the government, who is actually at fault, to the doctors, who are simply trying to get a fair deal.
But it’s both sides that are to blame.
The government for not negotiating to get this nonsense sorted out quicker, and the doctors for choosing to withdraw their labour. The doctors know full well that this will harm patients, but they chose to do it anyway. So let’s not pretend this is a one-sided thing.
I am not truly sure I could blame either side of that.
The government were - and are - people who explicitly campaign with/for this shit. You could be angry if they didn’t completely trash the country, its finances, and its health system to enrich themselves, after all that’s their very agenda. Voters for them - much as I cannot understand why anybody would vote that way - would rightfully be angry if they did stuff like care for anybody but themselvs. The voters would have been lied to.
At the same time, the doctors can only do so much to protest while also ensuring patients get as much care as possible. I talk to a doctor frequently. She was recently diagnosed with advanced-stage breast cancer while around the same time her mum was also diagnosed with cancer. You know what she did? Go to work. And do long hours. More than she is paid for. Becaue there’s no alternative. No one else can see to the patients. She would rather need to recuperate herself and care more for her mum, but there’s just no option. That’s so fucked up I lack words, and it also means the UK has a natural doctors problem: The ones that don’t move away because fuck, why wouldn’t you?!, they die off faster rather than slower or at least quit the field to protect their own health.
At some point, doctors end up having to force the issue. If they don’t do it, things never improve.