The nazis (in particular their graphic designer Walter Heck) did literally invent the sigrune/doppelrune, it doesn’t have roots in history and there is no excuse for them to have sent it given they admit they didn’t send it to germany. Like… no, there’s no justification for this one.
And the skull and crossbones has been used since the 1700s - and yet people happily run around sporting the Jolly Roger, while someone openly wearing the Totenkopf is undeniably a nazi (or Graham Platner, who as far as I can tell is somehow actually just that dumb)
I’m not disagreeing with that, but to say the Nazi shite invented runes is wrong. I thought it was pretty well known that the Nazis appropriated many of their symbols from historical findings.
Sorry, sincere question: do you not see it’s the same thing? They didn’t invent a squiggly line - they invented the concept which is represented as the specific angles of those squiggly lines. He didn’t invent the jolly roger, he invented the totenkopf.
edit: oi stop downvoting them they’re not wrong they’re just slightly misunderstanding my original statement.
No I understand that. The S rune on its own has its place in cultural history with all the other Runes, while putting two of them next to each other can only be seen as a Nazi symbol, much like the Swastika. In the modern practice of Heathenry and Paganism (which I practice) it is a very important distinction because the Nazis appropriated so much from European history for their symbolism. For example, the Swastika is the symbol for the Sunwheel, but I outright refuse to use it for anything because fuck Nazis. You can find it in ancient Buddhist temples that long predate Nazi Germany, and it has its own separate meaning for them, but for 99% of people it screams Nazi.
Another lesser known symbol appropriated by Nazis is the “Winged Othala” symbol. The regular Othala Rune is one thing, but adding those little “Wings” on the bottom makes it 100% a Nazi symbol.
I guess one of the points I’m trying to make is to know what is and isn’t some Nazi bs, and that some of those symbols are irredeemable after such strong Nazi usage, but others are just simply mistaken for Nazi symbols when they aren’t. I specifically avoid using anything in my religious practice that has Nazi association, and am ready to explain anything else that people might mistake otherwise.
Graham knew what it was. He’s a murderous psycho, by his own admission. This aw shucks I didn’t realize this was a nazi symbol shit, is just that, shit. He joined the military because he wanted to kill humans. He went on back to back tours until they said no. He then became a MERC so he could get around that and keep killing people.
It’s because the topic is about Nazis and the usage iconography that may or may not be associated with Nazis.
I’m not neurotypical myself so I get missing some nuance, but you can’t be neutral when it comes to Nazis, unless you’re actually OK with Nazis getting cozy in our spaces.
You basically have to say fuck Nazis in every comment. Fuck Nazis!
This could all be fun theory history lessons if we didn’t have literal Nazis running around. But that’s not the world we live in, sadly.
he wrote the bible or some shit when all he did was take what was already there and twisted it
I have really bad news if you think this wasn’t exactly what happened when they wrote the bible…
Gog admitted they knew what the symbols represented when they chose not to send them to German subscribers. There’s legitimately no excuse for using Nazi symbols in this case, regardless of your ideas about where they may have originated.
I have really bad news if you think this wasn’t exactly what happened when they wrote the bible…
If you’re agreeing he didn’t invent shit, I’d recommend amending your comment saying that he didn’t. No need to add legitimacy where there isn’t any. No pressure though.
As for gog, the deed is done and out in the world. Whatever they do from here on out, it will be with this burden attached.
Not even slightly, but I don’t particularly feel like going on about how no human creation is truly original, waxing interminable over the distinction between symbols and concepts or, you know, defending a nazi right now.
it will be with this burden attached
Probably this will be forgiven provided they don’t do anything more indicative of actually being Nazis. I’m not sure it should be given the spectacular process failures needed to knowingly email out a bunch nazi symbology, their history of trans/homophobic jokes, their insanely miserable work culture… but it probably will be, much as all those previous examples were. It’s depressing.
deeply tasteless but believably just really dumb mistakes, until they come in and clarify that that they knew what they were doing the whole time.
Even then it’s not unforgivable it’s just… really stupid and tone deaf. But the examples of them being really stupid and tone deaf keep piling up and it’s getting harder to overlook.
Yeah that’s tasteless, but the sort of think you can look past, especially 8 years later, but it definitely doesn’t look good in combination with this.
Not even slightly, but I don’t particularly feel like going on about how no human creation is truly original, waxing interminable over the distinction between symbols and concepts or, you know, defending a nazi right now.
But in a way, we kinda have to. I mean, are the nazis today the same as the nazis which started this movement or are they a separate entity and should be treated as such? Are all the nazi groups today are their own inventions and should they be granted the so-called ‘honour’ of having invented their particular brand of ‘doppelnazism’?
Or should we reserve that for when one particular branch starts calling itself something else and only looks to have been inspired by nazism, but is something else entirely?
Yeah, history is a continuous chain reaction. And the problem with fixating on specific points as the start of something has the disadvantages of ignoring everything which lead up to it and disagreeing on which point to put an end to it.
With your point of view, nazism ended with the second world war and what we suffer now is something different. A new invention as you say.
With my point of view, the dude didn’t invent shit and just stole what was already there and now we’re dealing with more of the same, the major difference being there’s no new brand of terror to set them apart visibly.
Uh, no? No we don’t? I’ve already expressed an utter lack of interest in arguing about this with you - this hasn’t changed. And please stop trying to force acceptance of your position onto me, this is the second time you’ve tried that and I’m still not going for it.
The nazis (in particular their graphic designer Walter Heck) did literally invent the sigrune/doppelrune, it doesn’t have roots in history and there is no excuse for them to have sent it given they admit they didn’t send it to germany. Like… no, there’s no justification for this one.
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That’s a different symbol?
Right, brainfart, it’s about the SS.
umm…
Wrong page?
In my mind, yes.
The Elder Futhark predates Nazi Germany by well over 1,000 years. Wikipedia says it was used between the 2nd to 8th centuries.
Edit: dang are people getting upset over a fact check? I never said it was okay to use symbols appropriated by Nazis.
And the skull and crossbones has been used since the 1700s - and yet people happily run around sporting the Jolly Roger, while someone openly wearing the Totenkopf is undeniably a nazi (or Graham Platner, who as far as I can tell is somehow actually just that dumb)
I’m not disagreeing with that, but to say the Nazi shite invented runes is wrong. I thought it was pretty well known that the Nazis appropriated many of their symbols from historical findings.
Sorry, sincere question: do you not see it’s the same thing? They didn’t invent a squiggly line - they invented the concept which is represented as the specific angles of those squiggly lines. He didn’t invent the jolly roger, he invented the totenkopf.
edit: oi stop downvoting them they’re not wrong they’re just slightly misunderstanding my original statement.
No I understand that. The S rune on its own has its place in cultural history with all the other Runes, while putting two of them next to each other can only be seen as a Nazi symbol, much like the Swastika. In the modern practice of Heathenry and Paganism (which I practice) it is a very important distinction because the Nazis appropriated so much from European history for their symbolism. For example, the Swastika is the symbol for the Sunwheel, but I outright refuse to use it for anything because fuck Nazis. You can find it in ancient Buddhist temples that long predate Nazi Germany, and it has its own separate meaning for them, but for 99% of people it screams Nazi.
Another lesser known symbol appropriated by Nazis is the “Winged Othala” symbol. The regular Othala Rune is one thing, but adding those little “Wings” on the bottom makes it 100% a Nazi symbol.
I guess one of the points I’m trying to make is to know what is and isn’t some Nazi bs, and that some of those symbols are irredeemable after such strong Nazi usage, but others are just simply mistaken for Nazi symbols when they aren’t. I specifically avoid using anything in my religious practice that has Nazi association, and am ready to explain anything else that people might mistake otherwise.
Graham knew what it was. He’s a murderous psycho, by his own admission. This aw shucks I didn’t realize this was a nazi symbol shit, is just that, shit. He joined the military because he wanted to kill humans. He went on back to back tours until they said no. He then became a MERC so he could get around that and keep killing people.
And people wonder where all the serial killers went. They fuckin got hired for their work.
Okay.
2nd to 8th centuries… so it’s been out of fashion for over a thousand years, before a certain group decided to ‘popularize’ it again. Hmmmm…
They’re used because you’re defending the Nazis!
Please explain how knowing about the Elder Futhark is defending Nazis?
It’s because the topic is about Nazis and the usage iconography that may or may not be associated with Nazis.
I’m not neurotypical myself so I get missing some nuance, but you can’t be neutral when it comes to Nazis, unless you’re actually OK with Nazis getting cozy in our spaces.
You basically have to say fuck Nazis in every comment. Fuck Nazis!
This could all be fun theory history lessons if we didn’t have literal Nazis running around. But that’s not the world we live in, sadly.
He didn’t invent shit. He copied a rune and appropriated it diagonally. S, N, Z whatever, it’s the same damn thing. Sowilo.
Ppl keep praising his ass here like he wrote the bible or some shit when all he did was take what was already there and twisted it.
I have really bad news if you think this wasn’t exactly what happened when they wrote the bible…
Gog admitted they knew what the symbols represented when they chose not to send them to German subscribers. There’s legitimately no excuse for using Nazi symbols in this case, regardless of your ideas about where they may have originated.
If you’re agreeing he didn’t invent shit, I’d recommend amending your comment saying that he didn’t. No need to add legitimacy where there isn’t any. No pressure though.
As for gog, the deed is done and out in the world. Whatever they do from here on out, it will be with this burden attached.
Not even slightly, but I don’t particularly feel like going on about how no human creation is truly original, waxing interminable over the distinction between symbols and concepts or, you know, defending a nazi right now.
Probably this will be forgiven provided they don’t do anything more indicative of actually being Nazis. I’m not sure it should be given the spectacular process failures needed to knowingly email out a bunch nazi symbology, their history of trans/homophobic jokes, their insanely miserable work culture… but it probably will be, much as all those previous examples were. It’s depressing.
Wait, they have a history of bigoted jokes?
To their credit not recently, but it’s all stuff similar to this nazi email:
https://dailydot.com/parsec/gog-transphobic-joke
deeply tasteless but believably just really dumb mistakes, until they come in and clarify that that they knew what they were doing the whole time.
Even then it’s not unforgivable it’s just… really stupid and tone deaf. But the examples of them being really stupid and tone deaf keep piling up and it’s getting harder to overlook.
Yeah that’s tasteless, but the sort of think you can look past, especially 8 years later, but it definitely doesn’t look good in combination with this.
But in a way, we kinda have to. I mean, are the nazis today the same as the nazis which started this movement or are they a separate entity and should be treated as such? Are all the nazi groups today are their own inventions and should they be granted the so-called ‘honour’ of having invented their particular brand of ‘doppelnazism’? Or should we reserve that for when one particular branch starts calling itself something else and only looks to have been inspired by nazism, but is something else entirely?
Yeah, history is a continuous chain reaction. And the problem with fixating on specific points as the start of something has the disadvantages of ignoring everything which lead up to it and disagreeing on which point to put an end to it.
With your point of view, nazism ended with the second world war and what we suffer now is something different. A new invention as you say.
With my point of view, the dude didn’t invent shit and just stole what was already there and now we’re dealing with more of the same, the major difference being there’s no new brand of terror to set them apart visibly.
Uh, no? No we don’t? I’ve already expressed an utter lack of interest in arguing about this with you - this hasn’t changed. And please stop trying to force acceptance of your position onto me, this is the second time you’ve tried that and I’m still not going for it.