As the AI market continues to balloon, experts are warning that its VC-driven rise is eerily similar to that of the dot com bubble.

As the AI market continues to balloon, experts are warning that its VC-driven rise is eerily similar to that of the dot com bubble.

  • @aestheleteEnglish
    1•1 year ago

    Nah, I’m speaking in practical terms. I frankly don’t have enough illicit online purchases to navigate all of the bullshit around coins and wallets and vendors to bother with “privacy coins”.

    I also wonder why someone would subpoena your PayPal account if you weren’t doing illegal things.

    If you want to make anonymous transactions, cash is still king.

    EDIT: And it’s also not a matter of whether I think “only criminals deserve privacy” but a legitimate question of who, other than criminals, needs absolute, unsubpoenable privacy in online financial transactions? I’d say privacy for everyone is paramount when it comes to communications, but who needs to exchange money illicitly other than those breaking the law?

    Additionally, with crypto (unlike PayPal) there is no mediator to act on behalf of one of the parties when they don’t do what they’re supposed to do. Unless you are purely exchanging currencies or NFTs or something, there’s no way to dispute a transaction. That capability is far more necessary for people conducting normal online transactions than privacy, and is largely why PayPal was created in the first place.

    • @FreesoftwareenjoyerEnglish
      1•1 year ago

      There are a few problems when it comes to privacy. First is the bank or PayPal tracking your every transaction. If the government needs a subpoena to access that data, that’s good, because they probably won’t be tracking everybody in an automated way. But I suspect that’s not the case in every country. The second problem is random stores knowing who you are. When you buy digital stuff like music or a game, why should the website know your identity? I don’t want my private information to leak to random people when the website gets hacked. The less they know about me, the better.

      I also wonder why someone would subpoena your PayPal account if you weren’t doing illegal things.

      This probably depends on a country.

      If you want to make anonymous transactions, cash is still king.

      True, but not for online payments.

      I’d say privacy for everyone is paramount when it comes to communications, but who needs to exchange money illicitly other than those breaking the law?

      Your transactions can say a lot about you. It doesn’t matter if it’s just something you buy or you want to support a political cause. In some countries it might be dangerous to reveal certain information about yourself. Everyone deserves privacy though.

      Additionally, with crypto (unlike PayPal) there is no mediator to act on behalf of one of the parties when they don’t do what they’re supposed to do.

      There is no mediator, but I think there can be. You can see it in some decentralized exchanges. I don’t know much about it, but you can read how Bisq handles it here: https://bisq.wiki/Frequently_asked_questions#Is_Bisq_safe.3F

      • @aestheleteEnglish
        1•1 year ago

        So now we’ve pivoted again from mainstream usage to some hypothetical country where the government asks for every transaction you ever do… But also in which the citizens have unfettered Internet access, and it’s still not clear what you’d be doing on there that isn’t criminal.

        I dunno man, seems pretty fringe to me.

        I also think there’s a way to make digital cash, but I highly doubt distributed ledgers are a good way to accomplish that. Seems like any good version of digital cash would be easily usable and exchangeable offline, easily verifiable without going back through the history of the planet first, and not carry with it a complete transactional history as a functional requirement.

        Ironically enough scammers today already use things similar to the above as actual currency right now, they call them Amazon gift cards.

        The “decentralized” bug has bitten you so good that you don’t see how an alternative, actually useful form of digital currency could be created with a central signing authority (or several). IMO “decentralized” is yet another “feature” that serves no meaningful purpose.

        I’d recommend buying drugs in person and in cash.

        • @FreesoftwareenjoyerEnglish
          1•1 year ago

          So now we’ve pivoted again from mainstream usage to some hypothetical country where the government asks for every transaction you ever do… But also in which the citizens have unfettered Internet access, and it’s still not clear what you’d be doing on there that isn’t criminal.

          We haven’t pivoted anything. I use cryptocurrency to increase my privacy online. But each country has different laws and there are countries with corrupt governments.

          I also think there’s a way to make digital cash, but I highly doubt distributed ledgers are a good way to accomplish that. Seems like any good version of digital cash would be easily usable and exchangeable offline, easily verifiable without going back through the history of the planet first, and not carry with it a complete transactional history as a functional requirement.

          I’m sure it would be easy to create something centralized. But if you want decentralized there might not be any other way. This video explains some of it: https://youtu.be/bBC-nXj3Ng4

          Ironically enough scammers today already use things similar to the above as actual currency right now, they call them Amazon gift cards.

          Yes. Unfortunately some of them make their victims buy cryptocurrency instead.

          The “decentralized” bug has bitten you so good that you don’t see how an alternative, actually useful form of digital currency could be created with a central signing authority (or several). IMO “decentralized” is yet another “feature” that serves no meaningful purpose.

          You could say the same about the Fediverse. In both cases it’s not true though. In cryptocurrency decentralization is there to eliminate the problem of trust. It’s a trust-less system, because it doesn’t rely on central authority. You accuse me of bias for no good reason. If there was another form of online payment that provided anonymity, I would use it. But there is no alternative right now. I would love to use GNU Taler, but it’s not used anywhere. You have made up your mind about cryptocurrency without having basic knowledge on the subject and you accuse me of bias.

          I’d recommend buying drugs in person and in cash.

          I don’t buy drugs, but people who buy them online use Monero. Thanks for the recommendation though.

          • @aestheleteEnglish
            1•1 year ago

            You could say the same about the Fediverse

            Why? It is a feature in the fediverse in a meaningful way.

            I can go to a different Lemmy server when mine is down. The only thing it’s missing is some type of open id integration to allow me to carry my account between servers.

            And that’s versus decentralization in “currency” which provides me? Trustless? Stores of value? How can I meaningfully make use of any of it? If the ledger forks off, it essentially creates a new coin. The standard way to obtain coin is now not through mining because mining is too resource intensive (by design) but through a centralized exchange anyway because you can’t trust random strangers on the Internet. Seems like a meaningless buzzword that’s summarily explained as being advantageous to the people that made the original coin and nobody else.

            There’s multiple problems with the way crypto bros like yourself talk about crypto but one of the problems is that you conflate a bunch of concepts around currency, markets, currency exchange, investments, payments, and ledgers simply because crypto technology is a giant, indecipherable mess that didn’t meaningfully distinguish between any of these concepts.

            You have made up your mind about cryptocurrency without having basic knowledge on the subject and you accuse me of bias.

            I have “basic” and even advanced knowledge about cryptocurrency. Monero isn’t even as private as you’re pretending, and Bitcoin (and most other coins) are not private at all.

            Just a brief search will show you the multiple exploits that can compromise monero privacy, and while there are other coins that claim to solve those problems it doesn’t get you around the fact that every transaction is stored forever and that is a design requirement for these types of crypto coins.

            • @FreesoftwareenjoyerEnglish
              1•1 year ago

              And that’s versus decentralization in “currency” which provides me? Trustless? Stores of value? How can I meaningfully make use of any of it?

              You don’t have to trust a bank or some company. Nobody can deny you access to your money or prevent you from using it. It’s not something you make use of, it’s just a property of cryptocurrency.

              If the ledger forks off, it essentially creates a new coin.

              So what? This is decided by the people who use the network, not by a central authority.

              The standard way to obtain coin is now not through mining because mining is too resource intensive (by design) but through a centralized exchange anyway because you can’t trust random strangers on the Internet.

              But using the currency still doesn’t require trust. You are wrong though, since there are decentralized exchanges too and they don’t require trust. I’ve already told about Bisq. Other ways of getting cryptocurrency are buying it from an ATM (done that) or accepting it as payment for your work (this is rare, but I’ve heard of it).

              Seems like a meaningless buzzword that’s summarily explained as being advantageous to the people that made the original coin and nobody else.

              It is not. You should read about it before making up a conspiracy theory.

              There’s multiple problems with the way crypto bros like yourself talk about crypto but one of the problems is that you conflate a bunch of concepts around currency, markets, currency exchange, investments, payments, and ledgers simply because crypto technology is a giant, indecipherable mess that didn’t meaningfully distinguish between any of these concepts.

              This is ridiculous. Cryptocurrency or any other technology is not an indecipherable mess. It’s nothing new and we know exactly how it works. You can read about it on the internet. There is no conspiracy to make it difficult to understand. I event sent you some links. I haven’t said anything about investments, so no idea how that’s relevant or what it has to do with this technology, since that’s not its purpose.

              I have “basic” and even advanced knowledge about cryptocurrency. Monero isn’t even as private as you’re pretending, and Bitcoin (and most other coins) are not private at all.

              I’ve never said that Bitcoin was private. I’ve said that it can be used anonymously unlike any other form of online payments (except other cryptocurrencies). Monero is probably the most private online payment option that exists.

              Just a brief search will show you the multiple exploits that can compromise monero privacy, and while there are other coins that claim to solve those problems it doesn’t get you around the fact that every transaction is stored forever and that is a design requirement for these types of crypto coins.

              There is nothing that can let you figure out someone’s transactions with 100% certainty. Governments could try this and they might be able to track some targeted individuals, but not everyone. This is better privacy than any other payment option provides. There is a whole video series about Monero’s security, but I haven’t watched it yet: https://youtu.be/WOyC6OB6ezA

              • @aestheleteEnglish
                1•1 year ago

                You don’t have to trust a bank or some company. Nobody can deny you access to your money or prevent you from using it. It’s not something you make use of, it’s just a property of cryptocurrency.

                Nope, you just have to make sure that you don’t accidentally get swindled or defrauded online (often in ways that aren’t possible with, you know, a normal bank account or a wallet with some money in it). Also, I don’t have to trust the bank to keep my deposits. The FDIC exists. Frozen assets and bank accounts aren’t something I concern myself with daily as a normal person who isn’t running a money laundering, mail fraud, or other type of crime ring.

                EDIT: I also left out here that you also have to make sure to remember your password / passphrase information so that you won’t lock yourself out, as many people have already done and will continue to do because there’s no really good way for most people to store this information.

                But using the currency still doesn’t require trust. You are wrong though, since there are decentralized exchanges too and they don’t require trust. I’ve already told about Bisq. Other ways of getting cryptocurrency are buying it from an ATM (done that) or accepting it as payment for your work (this is rare, but I’ve heard of it).

                How do you convert USD to one of your crappy coins with a decentralized, trust-less exchange? I get how you can transfer around between cryptocurrencies (though I have no idea why you’d want to) once you’re inside of crypto, but how about when you are holding actual money?

                Never mind, you just do it through a cEnTRaLiZEd service (that already has your banking information…see step #3 of “getting started”): https://bisq.network/getting-started/

                Wow, I can really see the usefulness of this “feature”. Also, how does that ATM to bitcoin conversion happen, pray tell? Through magical pixie dust, or through a series of services provided to ATM vendors, which almost certainly comply with existing banking laws?

                Cryptocurrency or any other technology is not an indecipherable mess.

                The tech sucks (blockchain is more of an albatross than a gift given from the heavens that crypto fellaters seem to think it is), but more than that the rhetoric and philosophy around it is an indecipherable mess. It’s buzzword soup, full of people who are trying to “invest” in a currency when that’s not what you’d ever do with a currency in the first place. Payment systems and currency aren’t the same thing…except in crypto because everything is a knotted mess and it’s a Ponzi scheme masquerading as some leap forward in tech…a solution looking for a problem.

                There is nothing that can let you figure out someone’s transactions with 100% certainty. Governments could try this and they might be able to track some targeted individuals, but not everyone. This is better privacy than any other payment option provides. There is a whole video series about Monero’s security, but I haven’t watched it yet: https://youtu.be/WOyC6OB6ezA

                Again, cash exists which offers much better privacy protection than Monero. If I want privacy in transactions I’m going cash 10 times out of 10. The security of Monero is again a tack-on because it cannot change the way that crypto works generally (a huge ledger which cannot be altered ever and records every single transaction):

                https://www.wired.com/story/monero-privacy/

                • @FreesoftwareenjoyerEnglish
                  1•1 year ago

                  You don’t get defrauded, unless you willingly give someone your money. This is not a valid criticism of cryptocurrency.

                  Also, I don’t have to trust the bank to keep my deposits. The FDIC exists. Frozen assets and bank accounts aren’t something I concern myself with daily as a normal person who isn’t running a money laundering, mail fraud, or other type of crime ring.

                  Good, but PayPal has locked me out of my account multiple times. So I prefer to use cryptocurrency where that can’t happen.

                  How do you convert USD to one of your crappy coins with a decentralized, trust-less exchange? I get how you can transfer around between cryptocurrencies (though I have no idea why you’d want to) once you’re inside of crypto, but how about when you are holding actual money?

                  You go on (for example) https://localmonero.co and you buy it with your preferred payment method.

                  Also, how does that ATM to bitcoin conversion happen, pray tell? Through magical pixie dust, or through a series of services provided to ATM vendors, which almost certainly comply with existing banking laws?

                  I was just giving you alternatives to mining. It’s irrelevant how you got your cryptocurrency.

                  The tech sucks, but more than that the rhetoric and philosophy around it is an indecipherable mess. It’s buzzword soup, full of people who are trying to “invest” in a currency when that’s not what you’d ever do with a currency in the first place. Payment systems and currency aren’t the same thing…except in crypto because everything is a knotted mess and it’s a Ponzi scheme masquerading as some leap forward in tech…a solution looking for a problem.

                  A distributed ledger is not a scam. The only way that a technology could be scam is if it didn’t work as advertised, but it does. As I said it’s not anything new and we know exactly how it works. I don’t understand why you can’t accept this. I don’t care if people are trying to invest in it. Feel free to criticize their behavior, but that is not valid criticism of this technology. What people say about cryptocurrency is also irrelevant to this discussion.

                  Again, cash exists which offers much better privacy protection than Monero.

                  Yes, but cash can’t be used for online payments. Monero is the most private way to pay online.

                  The security of Monero is again a tack-on because it cannot change the way that crypto works generally (a huge ledger which cannot be altered ever and records every single transaction):

                  This doesn’t disprove the fact that Monero is the most private way to pay online and the article you linked doesn’t disprove that either.

                  • @FreesoftwareenjoyerEnglish
                    1•1 year ago

                    How do you convert USD to one of your crappy coins with a decentralized, trust-less exchange? I get how you can transfer around between cryptocurrencies (though I have no idea why you’d want to) once you’re inside of crypto, but how about when you are holding actual money?

                    You go on (for example) https://localmonero.co and you buy it with your preferred payment method.

                    I might have been wrong there. I’m not sure how trust-less that is. But cryptocurrency is still a trust-less system.

                  • @aestheleteEnglish
                    1•1 year ago

                    You don’t get defrauded, unless you willingly give someone your money. This is not a valid criticism of cryptocurrency.

                    I’m not sure that’s always even true, but it’s a lot easier to get defrauded when everyone you’re transacting with is online people with a series of randomesque “hashes” tying them to a wallet…and more importantly…the fraud is often irreversible. I’ve had people steal my credit card multiple times and not paid a dime when it happened.

                    Good, but PayPal has locked me out of my account multiple times. So I prefer to use cryptocurrency where that can’t happen.

                    I haven’t had this experience as a user…so I guess for doing whatever likely weird things you’re doing Monero is best. ¯_(ツ)_/¯

                    That doesn’t mean it’s good for most, or even many people though.

                    You go on (for example) https://localmonero.co and you buy it with your preferred payment method.

                    I’m guessing they too use a payment gateway (often PayPal), and I have no idea who these people are and have no guarantee that they aren’t going to defraud me or that they will keep my information private.

                    A distributed ledger is not a scam.

                    Nah, the whole ecosystem is though. There was an era where cryptocurrency felt somewhat less scammy, but it was also worth less (or worthless) during that time. A distributed ledger is just not that useful of a technology. Especially one that works the way blockchain works, that’s why it’s being used almost 100% for fake-o “currencies”, NFTs, and ponzis.

                    Yes, but cash can’t be used for online payments. Monero is the most private way to pay online.

                    Again, I don’t have a need for this and like I’ve also said several times most people also do not. Hell, most people make online payments peer-to-peer using venmo with their transactional history set to fucking public. Just because you sit in some weirdo niche category doesn’t mean that this is an overall useful thing for many or most.

                    EDIT: And actually now that I think of it, you could just buy a prepaid credit card using cash and buy shit online using that.