Heaven forbid a woman brings a witness with herself to meet a stranger who she met online and trying to reduce the odds that she ends up murdered or raped.
God damn blind ass male privilege having assholes.
Why not throw asking her what she brings to the table too. Entitled jerks.
I think it is totally fine to bring a friend for safety if they feel uncomfortable, the shady part is really only not telling him before so he knows what to expect, he might bring a friend too just to make it less awkward.
Honestly, I’m not a woman, but if I was going to meet a stranger in a coffee shop or something, I’d bring a friend along and not say anything, they’d sit at a different table and wait to make sure everything’s chill. If the other party knows they’re being watched, they might not act as they usually would, so I wouldn’t necessarily know if the lack of creep vibes is an act. But that’s just me.
… And that would be the winning move, for everyone involved. The woman is safer. The man doesn’t pay one extra drink/plate (why it’s always the man that has to pay in the US, I don’t understand). The friend doesn’t feel like it’s awkwardly in the middle of a date.
That’s fine. The problem is just bringing a friend who’s just sort of there in the middle. What’s the protocol here, do I ignore the friend, include the friend in conversation, what?
The whole point of meeting in a public place is so everyone feels safe, then if everything goes well you move on to subsequent dates and eventually something more intimate but how long’s the friend gonna be there for; because if they are there for anything other than the first date, then you’ve got a problem.
That’s what I was thinking. Maybe they could’ve turned it into a double date or something. Nothing wrong with that, and it would eliminate having the friend feel like an awkward third wheel.
Communication is key in any relationship, so the fact she seemingly sprung a random friend on him out of the blue doesn’t bode well, even if the rest of the date’s on the up and up.
That doesn’t entitle you ro surprise them with an unannounced third party after you agreed to a date. If someone brought up wanting to do something in a group setting first, at least you’re being transparent. But if surprised by it, my first thought isn’t going to be that his person needed to feel safe, it’s that they’re angling for a free dinner for her and her friend.
Exactly. It’s a violation of consent. Specifically a violation of romantic consent. People have a right to refuse to consent to participate in romantic situations just like they do sexual ones. I would call a move like this a violation of romantic consent similar in form to stealthing.
Obviously violations of romantic consent are not even in the same league in terms of seriousness as violations of sexual consent. It’s merely a rude thing to do rather than a deeply traumatizing felony. But it is still an issue of consent. People have a right to decide what type of romantic situations they get involved in, and it’s rude to pull a sudden change on them without their consent.
Why not be upfront about wanting to bring a friend? What if your date brought another person unannounced? Or just keep on hating all men or something I’m sure that’s a better option. Here I’ll make it easy for you.
“I bet she only brought her friend cuz they both wanted a free meal from the poor guy.”
there are about a hundred different ways to deal with this.
as a man, I dealt with things like this when I met dates from long distances.
write a note of who you’re meeting, when and where
include times you’ll meet and be returning
tell several friends or family members. give them copies of the note.
give them written instructions that if they don’t hear from you in x hours/days to contact police
I met my fair share of crazy women in the early 2000s and let my dick lead me into some of the darkest holes I could have disappeared in.
if you feel unsafe, don’t go to a bar. grab a coffee. meet at a library. go somewhere you trust and know the people around you.
if you want to bring a friend, do it. just don’t get so bent out of shape when the other person rejects you. do like they felt the need to do, move the fuck on.
If I were going on a first date with a woman and she wanted to bring a friend for safety that sits at a different table I’d be 100% in support of it. I’d want her to feel safe, because that’s a necessary first step to building any kind of relationship.
and that’s where your line is. don’t make yourself out to be some kind of a white knight though because you’re willing to put out the barest amount of effort.
personally, I wouldn’t care. the difference is you want to be commended for your actions and expect reciprocation where most couldn’t give two fucks. why else would you bring it up anyway?
I think you’re kind of a creep for bringing it up but you do you.
How do any of your bullet points prevent a woman from being raped and murdered? Those only apply if something has already gone terribly wrong. You know what does help? A Buddy system. Someone who can step in if the woman is drugged or incapacitated. A potential witness to a crime as a deterrent. Strength in numbers my dude.
What was discussed here wasn’t just bringing someone along for safety. You can bring someone along and have them sit at another table to keep an eye on you. That’s fine. But when you agree to go on a date with someone, the social expectation is that you are agreeing to meet one-on-one with someone. It’s a chance for potential romantic partners to have a close and intimate one-on-one discussion. This isn’t possible if a third person is present.
It’s perfectly fine to still have someone at the table. But you need to let all parties know in advance.
Romantic consent isn’t as serious a thing as sexual consent, but it still matters. People have a right to romantic consent. It would be wrong to force someone to go on a date against their will. And just like it’s a violation of consent for a guy to remove a condom prior to sex (changing what was agreed to,) it is a violation of romantic consent to completely change the agreed-upon form of the date.
Big yikes. You’re mostly correct, but also not in a lot of ways. Bringing a friend to hang around and not be a part of the date is fine, sure, you don’t have to and probably shouldn’t announce that. Not saying anything and then having the friend just appear to sit at the table? Not okay and you should maybe take a look at yourself if this is your reaction
She violated his consent. Romantic consent is a type of consent just like sexual consent. Obviously violations of romantic consent are not even remotely as serious as violations of sexual consent. It’s something that’s extremely rude, not an act of violence that does lifelong damage. But romantic consent is still something that is not OK to violate.
Examples of violations of romantic consent:
You go to what you think is a job interview, but it inexplicably turns into a date.
You show up for a dinner among friends, except they arranged ahead of time to have everyone but you and another person leave shortly after the start. You agreed to a dinner among friends, they turned it into a date without asking you.
You agree to the date, show up, and they completely ghost you.
You go to a date, but instead of participating in the date, they don’t talk to you and are just on their phone the whole time.
People have the right to consent to what kinds of romantic situations they get involved in. If you tell someone you’re intending one type of interaction, and you completely change it without informing them? That is a deep violation of romantic consent. Again, as some people struggle with nuance, this isn’t anywhere near as bad as violations of sexual consent. Violating romantic consent doesn’t mean you’re a violent criminal predator. It does however mean you are an asshole.
What this woman did was the romantic consent violation equivalent of stealthing.
Heaven forbid a woman brings a witness with herself to meet a stranger who she met online and trying to reduce the odds that she ends up murdered or raped.
God damn blind ass male privilege having assholes.
Why not throw asking her what she brings to the table too. Entitled jerks.
I think it is totally fine to bring a friend for safety if they feel uncomfortable, the shady part is really only not telling him before so he knows what to expect, he might bring a friend too just to make it less awkward.
Honestly, I’m not a woman, but if I was going to meet a stranger in a coffee shop or something, I’d bring a friend along and not say anything, they’d sit at a different table and wait to make sure everything’s chill. If the other party knows they’re being watched, they might not act as they usually would, so I wouldn’t necessarily know if the lack of creep vibes is an act. But that’s just me.
… And that would be the winning move, for everyone involved. The woman is safer. The man doesn’t pay one extra drink/plate (why it’s always the man that has to pay in the US, I don’t understand). The friend doesn’t feel like it’s awkwardly in the middle of a date.
That’s fine. The problem is just bringing a friend who’s just sort of there in the middle. What’s the protocol here, do I ignore the friend, include the friend in conversation, what?
The whole point of meeting in a public place is so everyone feels safe, then if everything goes well you move on to subsequent dates and eventually something more intimate but how long’s the friend gonna be there for; because if they are there for anything other than the first date, then you’ve got a problem.
That’s what I was thinking. Maybe they could’ve turned it into a double date or something. Nothing wrong with that, and it would eliminate having the friend feel like an awkward third wheel.
Communication is key in any relationship, so the fact she seemingly sprung a random friend on him out of the blue doesn’t bode well, even if the rest of the date’s on the up and up.
That doesn’t entitle you ro surprise them with an unannounced third party after you agreed to a date. If someone brought up wanting to do something in a group setting first, at least you’re being transparent. But if surprised by it, my first thought isn’t going to be that his person needed to feel safe, it’s that they’re angling for a free dinner for her and her friend.
Yeah this is also a huge problem if you have social anxiety of any form
Exactly. It’s a violation of consent. Specifically a violation of romantic consent. People have a right to refuse to consent to participate in romantic situations just like they do sexual ones. I would call a move like this a violation of romantic consent similar in form to stealthing.
Obviously violations of romantic consent are not even in the same league in terms of seriousness as violations of sexual consent. It’s merely a rude thing to do rather than a deeply traumatizing felony. But it is still an issue of consent. People have a right to decide what type of romantic situations they get involved in, and it’s rude to pull a sudden change on them without their consent.
Sure, but if you bring an extra person, it isn’t a date, it is a gathering.
Only if you bring 2 extra people, then it is a double date.
Why not be upfront about wanting to bring a friend? What if your date brought another person unannounced? Or just keep on hating all men or something I’m sure that’s a better option. Here I’ll make it easy for you.
“I bet she only brought her friend cuz they both wanted a free meal from the poor guy.”
Who said anything about males?
Clearly the stranger she met online couldn’t possibly be another woman, only straight people use online dating!
slow your roll there porky.
there are about a hundred different ways to deal with this.
as a man, I dealt with things like this when I met dates from long distances.
I met my fair share of crazy women in the early 2000s and let my dick lead me into some of the darkest holes I could have disappeared in.
if you feel unsafe, don’t go to a bar. grab a coffee. meet at a library. go somewhere you trust and know the people around you.
if you want to bring a friend, do it. just don’t get so bent out of shape when the other person rejects you. do like they felt the need to do, move the fuck on.
If I were going on a first date with a woman and she wanted to bring a friend for safety that sits at a different table I’d be 100% in support of it. I’d want her to feel safe, because that’s a necessary first step to building any kind of relationship.
and that’s where your line is. don’t make yourself out to be some kind of a white knight though because you’re willing to put out the barest amount of effort.
personally, I wouldn’t care. the difference is you want to be commended for your actions and expect reciprocation where most couldn’t give two fucks. why else would you bring it up anyway?
I think you’re kind of a creep for bringing it up but you do you.
How do any of your bullet points prevent a woman from being raped and murdered? Those only apply if something has already gone terribly wrong. You know what does help? A Buddy system. Someone who can step in if the woman is drugged or incapacitated. A potential witness to a crime as a deterrent. Strength in numbers my dude.
What was discussed here wasn’t just bringing someone along for safety. You can bring someone along and have them sit at another table to keep an eye on you. That’s fine. But when you agree to go on a date with someone, the social expectation is that you are agreeing to meet one-on-one with someone. It’s a chance for potential romantic partners to have a close and intimate one-on-one discussion. This isn’t possible if a third person is present.
It’s perfectly fine to still have someone at the table. But you need to let all parties know in advance.
Romantic consent isn’t as serious a thing as sexual consent, but it still matters. People have a right to romantic consent. It would be wrong to force someone to go on a date against their will. And just like it’s a violation of consent for a guy to remove a condom prior to sex (changing what was agreed to,) it is a violation of romantic consent to completely change the agreed-upon form of the date.
Consent matters. Learn to respect it.
Big yikes. You’re mostly correct, but also not in a lot of ways. Bringing a friend to hang around and not be a part of the date is fine, sure, you don’t have to and probably shouldn’t announce that. Not saying anything and then having the friend just appear to sit at the table? Not okay and you should maybe take a look at yourself if this is your reaction
She violated his consent. Romantic consent is a type of consent just like sexual consent. Obviously violations of romantic consent are not even remotely as serious as violations of sexual consent. It’s something that’s extremely rude, not an act of violence that does lifelong damage. But romantic consent is still something that is not OK to violate.
Examples of violations of romantic consent:
You go to what you think is a job interview, but it inexplicably turns into a date.
You show up for a dinner among friends, except they arranged ahead of time to have everyone but you and another person leave shortly after the start. You agreed to a dinner among friends, they turned it into a date without asking you.
You agree to the date, show up, and they completely ghost you.
You go to a date, but instead of participating in the date, they don’t talk to you and are just on their phone the whole time.
People have the right to consent to what kinds of romantic situations they get involved in. If you tell someone you’re intending one type of interaction, and you completely change it without informing them? That is a deep violation of romantic consent. Again, as some people struggle with nuance, this isn’t anywhere near as bad as violations of sexual consent. Violating romantic consent doesn’t mean you’re a violent criminal predator. It does however mean you are an asshole.
What this woman did was the romantic consent violation equivalent of stealthing.