That makes sense. My shallow knowledge of Hawaiian history can be summarized with “they got fucked”. Can’t blame them for not wanting to participate in the overtaking government.
For all the information in that article I am surprised they completely ignored the actual factual basis for their belief. The famous Dred Scott v. Sandford has never been actually overturned, the common legal view is that it was abrogated by the 14th Amendment. The 14th amendment only applies to those subject to the jurisdiction of the United States and as such a representative of a foreign entity nor their children would not qualify relevant USCIS guidelines for those children. Descendants of the Moors, a hard to define group dispersed worldwide, and Hawaiians, the Hawaiian Kingdom being overthrown by US mainland farmers on the island, could claim allegiance to their original sovereign. Technically this would mean that not only does the 14th amendment not apply but Dred Scott baring citizenship to non-whites would apply. It is a view many Jurists have actually expressed see dissent of UNITED STATES v. WONG KIM ARK and would serve as basis for the more out there claims. In such a scenario a person becomes merely property and their only way to legally engage in living is to be a corporation (ala citizens united) that is auto-protected by a corporate veil (shielding liability). This stuff is definitely fringe but not crazy, I look at it as people confronting the system and demanding either America overturning many troubled past transgressions or give them the benefit of the disparate treatment. The surprised pikachu comes in when the Jurist decides to split the difference and deny both forms of relief.
This stuff is definitely fringe but not crazy, I look at it as people confronting the system and demanding either America overturning many troubled past transgressions or give them the benefit of the disparate treatment.
Disagree there, it’s definitely crazy. If you’re starting to think this stuff makes actual sense and (more importantly) that you want to start testing the legal system using it, I suggest you seek some help from a mental health professional instead.
If you read the sources or even my closing line, I specifically disclaimed it’s usage, but at the end of the day the position was defeated 6-2 at the supreme court, with the two in dissent wholly agreeing with the argument put forth. Essentially arguing this in good faith would be no different than seeking an appeal or rehearing in other cases. It is the equivalent of calling everyone who tried to overturn Roe v Wade (a 7-2 decision) crazy because they lost one case. Some would argue the side against Roe is winning right now, so maybe its not even a safe bet to say nonwhites aren’t automatically citizens by birth.
It is the equivalent of calling everyone who tried to overturn Roe v Wade (a 7-2 decision) crazy because they lost one case.
I wouldn’t call them crazy because they lost one case, but rather because they believe that a cluster of cells is a person. But that’s getting off topic, because most of the legal “theories” behind sovcit have been thoroughly adjudicated and found to be entirely baseless.
People always hear about the white fringe/crazies/cults but its not like every other racial group is immune. From the the one you mentioned to the Black Hebrew Israelites to Jesus Morning Star (Korea) to Sanatan Sanstha (India) theres culty shenanigans all over the world.
Do you know of the Moorish Science Temple? A LOT of black sovcits come from that.
https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/extremist-files/group/moorish-sovereign-citizens
Thanks for posting. That’s fascinating. Had no idea there were multiple subcultures within this mess.
There’s a Hawaiian sovcit movement too!
That makes sense. My shallow knowledge of Hawaiian history can be summarized with “they got fucked”. Can’t blame them for not wanting to participate in the overtaking government.
For all the information in that article I am surprised they completely ignored the actual factual basis for their belief. The famous Dred Scott v. Sandford has never been actually overturned, the common legal view is that it was abrogated by the 14th Amendment. The 14th amendment only applies to those subject to the jurisdiction of the United States and as such a representative of a foreign entity nor their children would not qualify relevant USCIS guidelines for those children. Descendants of the Moors, a hard to define group dispersed worldwide, and Hawaiians, the Hawaiian Kingdom being overthrown by US mainland farmers on the island, could claim allegiance to their original sovereign. Technically this would mean that not only does the 14th amendment not apply but Dred Scott baring citizenship to non-whites would apply. It is a view many Jurists have actually expressed see dissent of UNITED STATES v. WONG KIM ARK and would serve as basis for the more out there claims. In such a scenario a person becomes merely property and their only way to legally engage in living is to be a corporation (ala citizens united) that is auto-protected by a corporate veil (shielding liability). This stuff is definitely fringe but not crazy, I look at it as people confronting the system and demanding either America overturning many troubled past transgressions or give them the benefit of the disparate treatment. The surprised pikachu comes in when the Jurist decides to split the difference and deny both forms of relief.
Disagree there, it’s definitely crazy. If you’re starting to think this stuff makes actual sense and (more importantly) that you want to start testing the legal system using it, I suggest you seek some help from a mental health professional instead.
If you read the sources or even my closing line, I specifically disclaimed it’s usage, but at the end of the day the position was defeated 6-2 at the supreme court, with the two in dissent wholly agreeing with the argument put forth. Essentially arguing this in good faith would be no different than seeking an appeal or rehearing in other cases. It is the equivalent of calling everyone who tried to overturn Roe v Wade (a 7-2 decision) crazy because they lost one case. Some would argue the side against Roe is winning right now, so maybe its not even a safe bet to say nonwhites aren’t automatically citizens by birth.
I wouldn’t call them crazy because they lost one case, but rather because they believe that a cluster of cells is a person. But that’s getting off topic, because most of the legal “theories” behind sovcit have been thoroughly adjudicated and found to be entirely baseless.
People always hear about the white fringe/crazies/cults but its not like every other racial group is immune. From the the one you mentioned to the Black Hebrew Israelites to Jesus Morning Star (Korea) to Sanatan Sanstha (India) theres culty shenanigans all over the world.