House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries and his leadership team said they would vote to table any motion by Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene to remove the speaker.
so, on the premise that Johnson will at least honor his deals and the next dumbass probably won’t… it’s more valuable to keep him around.
Oh I appreciate the realpolitik of it all, but let us not forget its an election year, maybe the most significant ever. The Democrats got what the needed from Johnson, but they really can’t appear to be playing ball ‘too hard’. Their leverage comes from him being on a string, not being confident in his position; likewise, being ‘partners’ with Republicans puts them in an awkward position (especially in the house) from a campaigning perspective. Strange bedfellows, but Democrats need to keep the “Johnson’s” at arms reach because individually, they need to win their races, and even moreso, chaos within the Republican party is marketing for Democrats moving into November.
but Democrats need to keep the “Johnson’s” at arms reach because individually, they need to win their races, and even moreso, chaos within the Republican party is marketing for Democrats moving into November.
they also need to maintain the visage of the adults in the room. Fucking over Johnson won’t accomplish anything, and likely get a worse candidate in office. It’ll give real ammunition to any one campaigning against them and take away the accusation that the republicans are obstructionist simply to be obstructionist.
Yep. They have to look both left and right at the same time, so I expect alternating narratives from honey moon lovey dovey to on the rocks romance broken, planted from both sides every 2- 3 weeks from now until November.
Do you think the House writ large needs to pass another bill before November or was this sufficient to earn their keep?
Do you think the House writ large needs to pass another bill before November or was this sufficient to earn their keep?
do you think there’s nothing that needs attention? no problems that require legislation to solve, no… I don’t know, aid packages to be signed. or relief for anything…?
I’m speaking purely in terms of sportsball/ realpolitik, in the most cynical manner possible.
Like, I can’t think about anything other than funding international war that both Democrats and Republicans agree enough upon to be worth bringing to the floor other than to say you tried and let it die so you can campaign on it.
I guess my thinking is that this might have been enough for at least the Democrats in the house to run on, if they can keep the Republicans annoyed enough at it being presented as a Democratic victory, and especially if they can point to Republicans revolting against Johnson as to why they can’t get any more done for this session of congress.
On the Republican side, the passage doesn’t seem like a victory for Republican voters. No real accomplishments other than being able to fund the Israeli genocide. I’m not sure how high that ranks of a priority that is for Republican voters. Like the genocide was fully funded, it didn’t really need the help, so it just doesn’t have the same staying power as funding the Ukrainian resistance does for Democratic voters.
I guess my thinking is that if we go into November without another single thing getting done in the house, the W for this season goes into the D column, almost certainly. So the need to get more done is mostly going to come from the R side of aisle.
I guess my thinking is that if we go into November without another single thing getting done in the house, the W for this season goes into the D column, almost certainly. So the need to get more done is mostly going to come from the R side of aisle.
the issue is that the DNC has become the “Any functioning adult” party. they’re going to take a hit if they vote and congress completely seizes up. better to work someone who won’t try to fuck you over than to get somebody whose going to be worse. and congress will completely seize up.
Toungue in cheek obviously but the point remains. I firmly agree with your point about the Democrats ability to campaign on the “Any functional adult” party, but that goes away if they elevate Republicans the level of ‘also being function adults’. Congress being seized up actually works for the Democrats so long as they can firmly pin it on Republicans, unless its explicitly a Democratic policy priority. Which is like… Maybe? But that works so hard against Johnson and the Republicans in the house; his leash just isn’t that long.
So my bet goes to stagnation, which I assess as a D’ win. If you think there is something both D’ and R’ can vote yes on going into campaign season, I’m all ears. Maybe marijuana legalization?
Abysmal political strategy. Like if you want to lose an election your party is already struggling in (as in, the Democrats are struggling), the Democrats should do exactly what you describe.
The only things on the table that Republicans are willing to work on are gigantic L’s for the Democrats. There is no issue (unless you have one you are holding back on, and again, maybe mj reform?) that Republicans would put forward that Democratic voters can support.
If they did what you are advising, Democrats would go from having ‘won’ the house game of the last 2 years (from the minority position no less), to having ‘lost’ the house game. It would be idiotic to give Republicans one iota of rope more than exactly what it takes to hang themselves.
(Tongue in cheek, I actually appreciate our discussion here.)
Just off the top of my head? FAA reauthorization, FY2025 federal budget package, …oh that pesky temporary stopgap funding measure to re-up this summer, some election integrity bills…
Stop gap, for sure, same with FAA. Not sure election integrity is a ‘need to have’ for the House ‘writ large’. Would be a big feather for Dems, not sure Repubs care.
I’m still very dubious of the argument in favor of House Dems working with Repubs. Dems have finally wrangle the Repubs onto their heals, and giving out any unnecessary points seems counter productive. I think this because I think, for House Republicans, their biggest issue going into November is that they’ve got absolutely jack shit to show for their time in office, except for a few Democratic wins. From a Dem strategy perspective, it just doesn’t make sense to give the R’s anything to campaign on, and the R’s are extremely desperate for anything.
I’d rather suffer through a few more months of a do nothing congress, and then sweep the House into a Democratic super majority than offer some fawning victory lap points to only somewhat less extreme Republicans. I think Democrats are well positioned for that, but they need anything that comes out of the House to be a clear Democratic victory. Thoughts?
Yeah I think we’re pretty locked in at this point, at least in regards to preference. Turnout however, I think is completely up in the air. I also agree on just accepting impass at this point. If the Dems see this as an opportunity for bipartisanship, that’s just political suicide. They can cleanly make this a referendum on the very principal of modern republicanism as being obstructionist (worthless house), anti-women (RvW), criminals (Trump on trial). Like its pretty easy. Just go home and campaign.
Oh I appreciate the realpolitik of it all, but let us not forget its an election year, maybe the most significant ever. The Democrats got what the needed from Johnson, but they really can’t appear to be playing ball ‘too hard’. Their leverage comes from him being on a string, not being confident in his position; likewise, being ‘partners’ with Republicans puts them in an awkward position (especially in the house) from a campaigning perspective. Strange bedfellows, but Democrats need to keep the “Johnson’s” at arms reach because individually, they need to win their races, and even moreso, chaos within the Republican party is marketing for Democrats moving into November.
they also need to maintain the visage of the adults in the room. Fucking over Johnson won’t accomplish anything, and likely get a worse candidate in office. It’ll give real ammunition to any one campaigning against them and take away the accusation that the republicans are obstructionist simply to be obstructionist.
Yep. They have to look both left and right at the same time, so I expect alternating narratives from honey moon lovey dovey to on the rocks romance broken, planted from both sides every 2- 3 weeks from now until November.
Do you think the House writ large needs to pass another bill before November or was this sufficient to earn their keep?
do you think there’s nothing that needs attention? no problems that require legislation to solve, no… I don’t know, aid packages to be signed. or relief for anything…?
I’m speaking purely in terms of sportsball/ realpolitik, in the most cynical manner possible.
Like, I can’t think about anything other than funding international war that both Democrats and Republicans agree enough upon to be worth bringing to the floor other than to say you tried and let it die so you can campaign on it.
I guess my thinking is that this might have been enough for at least the Democrats in the house to run on, if they can keep the Republicans annoyed enough at it being presented as a Democratic victory, and especially if they can point to Republicans revolting against Johnson as to why they can’t get any more done for this session of congress.
On the Republican side, the passage doesn’t seem like a victory for Republican voters. No real accomplishments other than being able to fund the Israeli genocide. I’m not sure how high that ranks of a priority that is for Republican voters. Like the genocide was fully funded, it didn’t really need the help, so it just doesn’t have the same staying power as funding the Ukrainian resistance does for Democratic voters.
I guess my thinking is that if we go into November without another single thing getting done in the house, the W for this season goes into the D column, almost certainly. So the need to get more done is mostly going to come from the R side of aisle.
the issue is that the DNC has become the “Any functioning adult” party. they’re going to take a hit if they vote and congress completely seizes up. better to work someone who won’t try to fuck you over than to get somebody whose going to be worse. and congress will completely seize up.
Toungue in cheek obviously but the point remains. I firmly agree with your point about the Democrats ability to campaign on the “Any functional adult” party, but that goes away if they elevate Republicans the level of ‘also being function adults’. Congress being seized up actually works for the Democrats so long as they can firmly pin it on Republicans, unless its explicitly a Democratic policy priority. Which is like… Maybe? But that works so hard against Johnson and the Republicans in the house; his leash just isn’t that long.
So my bet goes to stagnation, which I assess as a D’ win. If you think there is something both D’ and R’ can vote yes on going into campaign season, I’m all ears. Maybe marijuana legalization?
To answer the assassin goose…
Anything they can get. They’ve got more leverage with Johnson to push whatever agenda they want than they will have with who or whatever comes next.
(Edit going nuclear with the attack birds, are we? lol. )
Yeah that’s just…
Abysmal political strategy. Like if you want to lose an election your party is already struggling in (as in, the Democrats are struggling), the Democrats should do exactly what you describe.
The only things on the table that Republicans are willing to work on are gigantic L’s for the Democrats. There is no issue (unless you have one you are holding back on, and again, maybe mj reform?) that Republicans would put forward that Democratic voters can support.
If they did what you are advising, Democrats would go from having ‘won’ the house game of the last 2 years (from the minority position no less), to having ‘lost’ the house game. It would be idiotic to give Republicans one iota of rope more than exactly what it takes to hang themselves.
(Tongue in cheek, I actually appreciate our discussion here.)
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Stop gap, for sure, same with FAA. Not sure election integrity is a ‘need to have’ for the House ‘writ large’. Would be a big feather for Dems, not sure Repubs care.
I’m still very dubious of the argument in favor of House Dems working with Repubs. Dems have finally wrangle the Repubs onto their heals, and giving out any unnecessary points seems counter productive. I think this because I think, for House Republicans, their biggest issue going into November is that they’ve got absolutely jack shit to show for their time in office, except for a few Democratic wins. From a Dem strategy perspective, it just doesn’t make sense to give the R’s anything to campaign on, and the R’s are extremely desperate for anything.
I’d rather suffer through a few more months of a do nothing congress, and then sweep the House into a Democratic super majority than offer some fawning victory lap points to only somewhat less extreme Republicans. I think Democrats are well positioned for that, but they need anything that comes out of the House to be a clear Democratic victory. Thoughts?
deleted by creator
Yeah I think we’re pretty locked in at this point, at least in regards to preference. Turnout however, I think is completely up in the air. I also agree on just accepting impass at this point. If the Dems see this as an opportunity for bipartisanship, that’s just political suicide. They can cleanly make this a referendum on the very principal of modern republicanism as being obstructionist (worthless house), anti-women (RvW), criminals (Trump on trial). Like its pretty easy. Just go home and campaign.