• @[email protected]
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    701 month ago

    This is sending a giant red flag to America’s allies: we will not support you in times of war, do not rely on us since we will drop you whenever it is politically convenient to do so.

    Sadly, this shouldn’t be the case and it’s indicating an abdication of responsibility in being the Arsenal of Democracy for the free world.

    • @Maggoty
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      1 month ago

      Except if our religious conservatives vouch for you. Then you get the platinum package and a blind eye.

    • @SlopppyEngineer
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      111 month ago

      Europe better start their own version of NATO.

      • @Omgpwnies
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        201 month ago

        They kinda do, EU has a mutual defence policy as well

      • circuscritic
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        41 month ago

        The primary difference is defense industrial policy and production capacity.

    • @[email protected]
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      51 month ago

      I feel Turkey going with the Chinese moonbase instead of the US “moonbase” will come up as a turning point in future history books. Trump hollowed out a great deal of the remaining good will to the US. Biden can’t turn the corner with the potential of trump returning. The US should get ready to be a regional power in 50 years, after people in europe and asia get tired of hosting their bases for no protection.

      • @amorpheus
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        91 month ago

        America is Israel’s bitch, different situation.

  • Flying SquidM
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    681 month ago

    I really hope Europe can step up to fill America’s gap, because it’s clear that America will not get its shit together in time to help at this point, if it ever will again.

    • @assembly
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      551 month ago

      This has been so frustrating to watch. We have half of our country bootlicking the Russian leader that their cult leader is strangely endeared towards. This was our opportunity to really do the right thing and support a people defending themselves and their democracy. Something we as Americans could have been proud of for generations. But no. Republicans couldn’t have us do the right thing. Not even once.

      • @glimse
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        181 month ago

        Don’t say half the country - most of the country doesn’t vote. Trump got 74m votes and the US has a population of 330m.

        • @SomeKindaName
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          131 month ago

          You’re right. Not voting is a vote for Trump, so much more than half.

          • @glimse
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            1 month ago

            Snooze

            Not voting doesn’t mean you’re a Putin bootlicker. Way to move the goalpost

            I guess everyone with a marijuana conviction loves Putin, huh?

            • @SomeKindaName
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              161 month ago

              Fair point. Choosing not to vote then.

              • @Omgpwnies
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                71 month ago

                But you’re still kinda right. Not voting is a vote for trump, and conservatives know this. Disenfranchisement via drug convictions is a key weapon in their arsenal.

                • @glimse
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                  11 month ago

                  He’s not right to say that half the country voted for Trump. I am tired of the narrative that half the country is magats

        • @Ultragigagigantic
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          71 month ago

          Sounds like a good portion of the country is not represented and we need to do away with first past the post voting.

          More people voting means more democratic votes, so what’s the holdup blue states?

          What if Republicans want to not vote for Trump, but are tied to him because if they don’t vote for him the democrats win?

          • @glimse
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            121 month ago

            Not just FPTP voting…the electoral college has to go, tok. Many people think “my vote doesn’t matter, my state is voting X anyway” and, in a way, they’re right. The electoral college makes our votes matter less.

            There’s also too many people who are barred from voting. For example, one of the most politically-active people I know can’t vote because he got a felony for possessing a half ounce of weed 15 years ago in college.

        • @amorpheus
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          1 month ago

          So what, you assume that everyone not literally voting for Trump doesn’t support him? That’s ridiculous. The real number surely is closer to half than it is to the quarter that the votes add up to.

          • @glimse
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            01 month ago

            Not all all considering

            1. Young people generally lean left. Especially now with their access to information

            2. People with non-violent convictions like marijuana felonies also generally lean left. Disenfranchisement is a tool used mostly by one side of the aisle

        • @Centaur
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          11 month ago

          Yes, 330 million souls. But how many are voters? Or in US children vote in kindergarten 😉

    • @[email protected]
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      1 month ago

      America is occupied with sending aid to Israel. There’s only so much money Biden can draw down for foreign military aid with Congress being in the state its in and the budget being in the state its in. It’s been the Biden administration’s policy that Israel’s military needs are important as well and many bills have tied aid for Ukraine to aid for Israel.

      • @[email protected]
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        31 month ago

        This isn’t about the amount of money available, it’s the GOP intentionally doing what Putin wants.

    • @Burn_The_Right
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      1 month ago

      Only France is willing to fight. The rest of Europe are terrified of Putin. They will give Putin whatever he wants.

  • @Burn_The_Right
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    531 month ago

    As conservatives cheer. Conservatives did this. Your conservative neighbors, co-workers, family members and acquaintances… They all did this.

    • @Siegfried
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      141 month ago

      That pov only has value inside of america. This is a two sided sword, conservatives acted against it, democrats didnt do enough, and from outside, america choosed to let ukraine rot.

      Thinking retrospectively, It’s a good thing that they stoped their counteroffensive last year and ended up distributing forces in the multiple fronts.

      • @[email protected]
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        31 month ago

        Their kids will probably be honored to die for their country.

        A smart soldier focuses on letting the other side die for theirs.

      • @[email protected]
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        181 month ago

        Not only did they do this, they continue to do so. Because many Republicans in Congress are funded by dirty Russian money. Traitors all that should be tried for treason. And the ring leader in the clown car is the worst of all.

  • @NOT_RICK
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    291 month ago

    Fuck Mike Johnson

    • Neuromancer
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      -151 month ago

      Mike Johnson is pushing to get Ukraine aid. It’s part of why mtg is trying to get him removed. So while there are other issues with him, this isn’t one of them

      • @NOT_RICK
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        261 month ago

        I don’t get the impression he is trying very hard

        • @go_go_gadget
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          11 month ago

          We can use this argument? I don’t get the impression Biden is trying very hard on all sorts of things.

          For example, Biden went around congress to get weapons to Israel. So why isn’t he doing that for Ukraine?

              • @NOT_RICK
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                01 month ago

                Alternatively, Mike Johnson could simply call a vote. Congress is useless

                • @go_go_gadget
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                  -11 month ago

                  So we’ve established neither Mike Johnson nor Joe Biden are trying very hard to help Ukraine.

          • @NOT_RICK
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            11 month ago

            deleted by creator

          • Flying SquidM
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            141 month ago

            So he’s doing the bare minimum?

            • Neuromancer
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              -81 month ago

              Trying to get it pushed when your party says they’ll remove you is more than the bare minimum.

              Would you prefer he did nothing and Ukraine doesn’t get aid at all?

              • @Carrolade
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                171 month ago

                I’d prefer if he’d allow the Senate-passed bill, in front of him for months now, to come to a simple up-or-down vote by the people’s Representatives instead of obstructing it with his Speaker powers.

                But it seems he’d rather waste more time trying to write a different one, than allow any voting on the existing one.

              • Flying SquidM
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                141 month ago

                He’s not trying very hard. That’s the point. If he were trying hard he would be going on a punditry tour saying that Republicans are not playing ball on Ukraine and they had better start and why and that he is staking his position on it. That would be trying hard.

                And no, I am glad he is doing the bare minimum. I just wish he would do more than the bare minimum.

                • Neuromancer
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                  -71 month ago

                  I think he’s trying very hard. He has taken a position on it and spoke out against other republicans. Weird he’s done what you want him to do and you are still upset.

                  It’s part of why mtg is trying to remove him.

                  With your attitude, he should fall back to party lines and block the funding. If he can’t get support from the democrats then he needs to fall back in line.

              • @Burn_The_Right
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                71 month ago

                He’s playing both sides. He will never do anything that will result in Ukraine getting aid. He works for the Putin party.

                • @go_go_gadget
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                  21 month ago

                  He’s playing both sides.

                  So is Biden. So is every pro-corporate trash politician in this country.

          • @NOT_RICK
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            71 month ago

            It comes after Johnson has delayed for months on advancing aid that would provide desperately needed ammunition and weaponry for Kyiv, trying to find the right time to advance a package that will be a painful political lift.

            • Neuromancer
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              -51 month ago

              Yes he has to protect his job as well. It’s why we call it politics. Had he just pushed it forward, it would have failed.

              • @NOT_RICK
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                31 month ago

                I’m not so sure some of the more centrist republicans wouldn’t have voted for the aid in the same way they did on the stopgap funding bill that got McCarthy booted. Its not my job to worry about Johnson remaining speaker and I won’t give him credit for accepting house rules that leave him hamstrung by the space laser caucus.

                • Neuromancer
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                  11 month ago

                  Mtg needs to go. She’s a waste of space in my opinion. I’ll let time decide how I feel towards Johnson but I see him trying to get things done.

                  Boebert is another I’ll be glad to see leave.

      • BombOmOm
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        81 month ago

        All Mike Johnson has to do is schedule an up or down vote on the Ukraine Aid bill that the Senate approved months ago. That’s it. He has failed to do even that.

        • Neuromancer
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          -51 month ago

          If he does, it’ll be downvoted and fail. That’s what you want?

          • BombOmOm
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            1 month ago

            Given both Republicans and Democrats overwhelmingly voted for the Ukraine aid bill in the Senate, it will sail past an easy majority vote in the House. All Mike Johnson has to do is schedule a vote, a thing he has been stalling for months while Ukrainians die, Russians make advances, and America’s allies are forced to confront the reality of an unreliable American partnership.

          • BombOmOm
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            11 month ago

            If he does, it’ll be downvoted and fail. That’s what you want?

            I wanted him to do his job and put it up for a vote, where it just passed today with a supermajority in the House. Would have been so much simpler if he would have done this months ago.

  • @notaviking
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    271 month ago

    I think a lot of people forget how before the war, but after the 2014 annexure, Ukraine begged to be able to buy western weapons, such as the javelin, because one random guy can take out a whole tank (great force multipliers against the russian bear). Great deterrent. But they were not approved because they fought giving arms for Ukraine would provoke and not deter, and that dialog and greater economic integration with Russia would be the solution.

    So the west miscalculated, luckily Russia as well and Kiev did not fall, but now Ukraine is in a war, and unlike previously where they could have put resources into acquiring western weapons, they now have to input their resources into fighting and defending their country.

    The EU and America have stepped up initially, like 90% of the pledges went straight back into the American economy, since the give Ukraine their old stock and manufacture replacement stock for themselves. EU is close to matching USAs total contributions and if you look at France and their economy’s size they are percentage wise out spending the US in contributions.

    The nice thing here is most support money gets spend in their own country, stimulating their economy, Ukraine is putting their own citizens and soldiers life on the line and it will weaken a common Nato foe. But not supporting Ukraine will emboldened Russia and now that most of their military ineptitude and corruption has been exposed and is being improved, Russia might calculate further expansion, since that is their modus operandi.

    • @[email protected]
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      61 month ago

      giving arms for Ukraine would provoke and not deter

      This rationale is given time and time again for why we shouldn’t have supported Ukraine and every time it’s completely false.

      Hopefully people can learn from this history and not make the same mistakes in the past.

      Ukraine should’ve mined the shit out of their border with Russia.

      • @notaviking
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        31 month ago

        Exactly, but hindsight is 20/20. What I wanted to show was that a lack of support for Ukraine was then a win for Russia. But even more so now, that a lack of full continuous support for Ukraine today is just another win for Russia.

        • @amorpheus
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          31 month ago

          Guess what, they have mine fields now. Probably much more than a strategic strip at the border.

  • @distantsounds
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    231 month ago

    Well at least the US was able to aid the genocide in Gaza. I’m sure none of this will backfire.

    • @Mrkawfee
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      121 month ago

      Maybe the real genocide was the friends we made along the way.

    • @go_go_gadget
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      Yep. Strange how Biden was able to figure out how to get weapons to Israel without congressional approval and against the wishes of people he’s depending on to get re-elected but can’t use that same brain power of his to help Ukraine.

  • @venusaur
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    201 month ago

    I don’t understand why Israel needs so much money. They’re not a poor country.

    • @Carrolade
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      41 month ago

      This is actually a fair question. To answer it fairly, wars are extraordinarily expensive.

      Remember in the first Captain America movie, how Cap starts off as a showman, trying to sell war bonds to the American public? This bit of the movie is rooted in real history, the government actually did that, just to raise money to help pay for WW2. War bonds are basically just savings bonds, where the govt goes to its citizens and says “give me $100 now to help pay for the war, and we’ll pay you back with interest in a few years”.

      Israel has fewer borrowing opportunities than the massive US did, though, so it’s a little harder.

      Even Russia’s war, relying on huge backstocks of Soviet equipment, is very expensive, and they saved up a huge amount of money over many years to be able to do what they are doing right now.

      • @iarigby
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        41 month ago

        They don’t need to save up, they get billions from Europe for oil

        • @Carrolade
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          31 month ago

          Regardless of level of need, they did. They began the war with a gigantic war chest saved up. Hard to say what its at now, just about no level of income can pay for the level of expenditure a large, full-scale modern war requires.

      • @venusaur
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        11 month ago

        Haha but why we send it?

    • @ZILtoid1991
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      11 month ago

      Evangelicals think they need to trigger the apocalypse manually, part of it would involve all Jews returning to Israel.

      • @venusaur
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        01 month ago

        Interesting. But where is “Israel”? It’s all made up. The Kingdom of Judah?

  • @merthyr1831
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    171 month ago

    Thing is, even with the massive influx of weapons, Ukraine is going to face a severe risk of mutiny and exhaustion because they just don’t have enough people to rotate through the front lines.

    Even with the recent news of the expanded draft, the AFU just recently ended the service limit for conscripts and is still outnumbered by Russian troops on the front line.

    Either Ukraine will have to extend the draft further, seriously hindering their economy, or another country will have to get involved directly. France was supposedly considering deploying troops to the Ukrainian-Belorussian border to free up troops to fight in the East, but that clearly isn’t coming to fruition (yet?).

    The opportunity for Ukraine to get any kind of decisive victory and a decent peace deal was within the first year of the war. Russia was always going to have time on their side.

    • @Tebbie
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      21 month ago

      Definitely a good idea to secure Ukraine’s other borders so that they can focus on their defense.

  • @[email protected]
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    121 month ago

    I bet as people die, the amount of weapons needed to fight Russia increases. There will be a point of no return.

    Nearly every country dragged its heels.

  • @go_go_gadget
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    51 month ago

    Biden should go around congress to ship them weapons.

    • @RapidcreekOP
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      31 month ago

      Can’t buy weapons without money.