swelling of progressive opposition (some of it organic
does not mean
Article makes it sound like people wouldn’t have had a problem with it…
You’re just uncomfortable with Trumpworld siding with you, which is fair. It’s unsurprising they are more concerned with moderate appeal than progressive appeal, though. They know they can demonize any progressive to rural voters, it’s a core part of their strategy. This would have been less effective against a guy that can point to school vouchers.
That said, all this means is we have a responsibility to make up for any potential loss with energy and outreach.
For one thing he grew up a farmer and became a school teacher; he’s a vet. He’s literally “one of them”. Except he doesn’t drink the maga rightaid, and is very good at progressive messaging.
No, it sadly won’t. He’s pro lgbtq+. That’s the work of the devil you know, the shadowy deep state that is turning all your kids gay. He was in charge during the BLM protests, so clearly he’s antifa and wants to defund the police to create more lawlessness. Sure he’s ex-military, but have you seen the military these days? Gays and women everywhere, it’s all DEI now. I could go on and on, they have a prepared line for almost every position we hold.
He does have one edge, he’s a gun owner. He hasn’t taken any NRA-supported positions in awhile though.
edit: Remember they’re in a frenzy of purging their party for the past few years. They’re very leery of anyone that might seem like one of them but is actually sane.
Oh definitely. Rural voters are rural voters though. When you look at the electoral map, that’s all the red parts in the middle of everything. They trust republicans because the gop is straightforward and nasty, and that makes more sense to them than anything more scientific, objective or pro-social.
It’s a region where when a HS quarterback rapes some girl, it’d usually get covered up, even by local law enforcement. When people are really backwards, it’s because that’s what they want.
I’m sure he might get a few, but he’s not going to suddenly un-maga the magas. That’s very wishful thinking.
I’m sure he might get a few, but he’s not going to suddenly un-maga the magas. That’s very wishful thinking.
He doesn’t need to, all he really needs to do is get the not-maga out to vote. That includes dems across the spectrum. That he can do.
And the more they try to demonize him… “I fed kids. I’m a monster. You’re trying to look up their skirts.”
It’s a region where when a HS quarterback rapes some girl, it’d usually get covered up, even by local law enforcement. When people are really backwards, it’s because that’s what they want.
You’ll do well not to paint entire regions you apparently know nothing about with that brush. Particularly since Minnesota is in that region. Also, that land doesn’t vote, people vote.
MN hasn’t gone red in a presidential in a whole lot of years, so it’s actually not.
And yes, if you go back to my original comment, that was more of less what I said, where we have a responsibility to provide energy and outreach. I just don’t think we should over-exaggerate how successful progressive messaging should be, as if moderates can simply be brushed aside and their disagreements with us ignored. We did lose a little bit by picking two more progressive people, and we do have to work to make up for it.
MN hasn’t gone red in a presidential in a whole lot of years, so it’s actually not.
that’s an idiotic and dismissive take. Sorry. but you really don’t know anything about us, or our politics.
Biden won MN by 230k votes. in 2020. To put that in perspective, there were a total of 3.2 million votes total. it’s the kind of thinking that lost Michigan in 2016, which was won by Obama in 2012 by 450k votes.
In 2020, Biden barely squeaked out a win, with the closest three states (GA, AZ, WI) having less than 20k votes. Democrats cannot afford to think of any state that has been reliably blue as not-vulnerable, because the margins are extremely, extremely thin. If you look at more than just what color our state is on the map, historically, you’ll see what I’m talking about.
2016, Hilary won MN by 44.5k. Obama by 226k in 2012, and 298k in 2008. Kerry won only 98k. Gore won only by 59k. These kinds of margins are extremely thin, and very easy to tip. (which is why, in point of fact, Trump came back despite having previously had a terrible experience and vowing to not.)
We did lose a little bit by picking two more progressive people, and we do have to work to make up for it.
And that’s the point I’m trying to make. Walz is the kind of progressive whose capable of pulling the overton window more to the progressive side. It’s how he’s done what he’s done as MN’s gov. In part because he himself has become more progressive. that line about “compromising without compromised values” or however he put it wasn’t just idle banter or empty promises. he knows when and how to work through disagreements- and when not to.
He knows when to offer a hand shake and when to throw some haymakers, and he’s not going to let them throw their downright abusive and weird politics at us and insist we turn the other cheek because of some dubious moral superiority. When you start hitting back with “No, you’re a creep, (for looking at kid’s genitals)”… it’s very hard for the centrists to be like “yeah but both sides”. in some respects, bothsidesism was enabled by that very silence.
Note, I was not trying to say that all of MN always votes blue. I also find it a little odd how personally you’re taking this. So, what I’m trying to point out, is that if you’re accustomed to “MN nice”, you do not have an accurate understanding of the depth of the hatred prevalent in much of the rest of the country. It’s not some gentle misguidedness, it’s a deep-seated meanness and corruption, a hatred of others and the self. A deep shame.
Not in everyone, not at all. But very prevalent, very noticeable.
Personally I’m from a state not famous for nice people and having lots of lakes and a funny accent like MN is known throughout our nation for, but a state very famous for its racism and poor education ranking. So I’ve see it a lot, it’s unfortunate and sad.
Now, I love Walz, Minnesotans and progressive values, but try not to be too surprised by the depth of the hatred out there, and just how dark and immune to the overton window the actual fascist-loving folks of the world can be. This is not some cure-all. The cure to it will be crushing it in an election, weathering the possible terrorism incidents that result, and proving that they’re all losers.
When it comes to the moderates, people like Never Trumpers, I’ll be surprised if they respond well to progressive ideas, they don’t actually like equality, they just hate Trump more.
This:
does not mean
You’re just uncomfortable with Trumpworld siding with you, which is fair. It’s unsurprising they are more concerned with moderate appeal than progressive appeal, though. They know they can demonize any progressive to rural voters, it’s a core part of their strategy. This would have been less effective against a guy that can point to school vouchers.
That said, all this means is we have a responsibility to make up for any potential loss with energy and outreach.
It’s gonna be hard to demonize Walz.
For one thing he grew up a farmer and became a school teacher; he’s a vet. He’s literally “one of them”. Except he doesn’t drink the maga rightaid, and is very good at progressive messaging.
No, it sadly won’t. He’s pro lgbtq+. That’s the work of the devil you know, the shadowy deep state that is turning all your kids gay. He was in charge during the BLM protests, so clearly he’s antifa and wants to defund the police to create more lawlessness. Sure he’s ex-military, but have you seen the military these days? Gays and women everywhere, it’s all DEI now. I could go on and on, they have a prepared line for almost every position we hold.
He does have one edge, he’s a gun owner. He hasn’t taken any NRA-supported positions in awhile though.
edit: Remember they’re in a frenzy of purging their party for the past few years. They’re very leery of anyone that might seem like one of them but is actually sane.
And that’s when he swings back.
You saw some of that last night (“we have a golden rule…. Mind your own damn business”… “Hella Weird”)
They can try, but the harder they push the weirder they become.
Oh definitely. Rural voters are rural voters though. When you look at the electoral map, that’s all the red parts in the middle of everything. They trust republicans because the gop is straightforward and nasty, and that makes more sense to them than anything more scientific, objective or pro-social.
It’s a region where when a HS quarterback rapes some girl, it’d usually get covered up, even by local law enforcement. When people are really backwards, it’s because that’s what they want.
I’m sure he might get a few, but he’s not going to suddenly un-maga the magas. That’s very wishful thinking.
He doesn’t need to, all he really needs to do is get the not-maga out to vote. That includes dems across the spectrum. That he can do.
And the more they try to demonize him… “I fed kids. I’m a monster. You’re trying to look up their skirts.”
You’ll do well not to paint entire regions you apparently know nothing about with that brush. Particularly since Minnesota is in that region. Also, that land doesn’t vote, people vote.
MN hasn’t gone red in a presidential in a whole lot of years, so it’s actually not.
And yes, if you go back to my original comment, that was more of less what I said, where we have a responsibility to provide energy and outreach. I just don’t think we should over-exaggerate how successful progressive messaging should be, as if moderates can simply be brushed aside and their disagreements with us ignored. We did lose a little bit by picking two more progressive people, and we do have to work to make up for it.
that’s an idiotic and dismissive take. Sorry. but you really don’t know anything about us, or our politics.
Biden won MN by 230k votes. in 2020. To put that in perspective, there were a total of 3.2 million votes total. it’s the kind of thinking that lost Michigan in 2016, which was won by Obama in 2012 by 450k votes.
In 2020, Biden barely squeaked out a win, with the closest three states (GA, AZ, WI) having less than 20k votes. Democrats cannot afford to think of any state that has been reliably blue as not-vulnerable, because the margins are extremely, extremely thin. If you look at more than just what color our state is on the map, historically, you’ll see what I’m talking about.
2016, Hilary won MN by 44.5k. Obama by 226k in 2012, and 298k in 2008. Kerry won only 98k. Gore won only by 59k. These kinds of margins are extremely thin, and very easy to tip. (which is why, in point of fact, Trump came back despite having previously had a terrible experience and vowing to not.)
And that’s the point I’m trying to make. Walz is the kind of progressive whose capable of pulling the overton window more to the progressive side. It’s how he’s done what he’s done as MN’s gov. In part because he himself has become more progressive. that line about “compromising without compromised values” or however he put it wasn’t just idle banter or empty promises. he knows when and how to work through disagreements- and when not to.
He knows when to offer a hand shake and when to throw some haymakers, and he’s not going to let them throw their downright abusive and weird politics at us and insist we turn the other cheek because of some dubious moral superiority. When you start hitting back with “No, you’re a creep, (for looking at kid’s genitals)”… it’s very hard for the centrists to be like “yeah but both sides”. in some respects, bothsidesism was enabled by that very silence.
Note, I was not trying to say that all of MN always votes blue. I also find it a little odd how personally you’re taking this. So, what I’m trying to point out, is that if you’re accustomed to “MN nice”, you do not have an accurate understanding of the depth of the hatred prevalent in much of the rest of the country. It’s not some gentle misguidedness, it’s a deep-seated meanness and corruption, a hatred of others and the self. A deep shame.
Not in everyone, not at all. But very prevalent, very noticeable.
Personally I’m from a state not famous for nice people and having lots of lakes and a funny accent like MN is known throughout our nation for, but a state very famous for its racism and poor education ranking. So I’ve see it a lot, it’s unfortunate and sad.
Now, I love Walz, Minnesotans and progressive values, but try not to be too surprised by the depth of the hatred out there, and just how dark and immune to the overton window the actual fascist-loving folks of the world can be. This is not some cure-all. The cure to it will be crushing it in an election, weathering the possible terrorism incidents that result, and proving that they’re all losers.
When it comes to the moderates, people like Never Trumpers, I’ll be surprised if they respond well to progressive ideas, they don’t actually like equality, they just hate Trump more.