TL;DR

  • Efforts like Graphene OS face increasing pressure from apps that refuse to run on non-standard Android.
  • The custom ROM project characterizes Google’s approach to device attestation as incomplete and flawed.
  • Graphene OS is prepared to take legal action if Google won’t let it pass Play Integrity checks.
  • @FutileRecipeOP
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    181 month ago

    I’ve got old apps that won’t work any more.

    I’m actually for this. The bar to entry for the Play Store is too low with too many low quality and unmaintained apps. I’m all for booting insecure and super old apps. They cheapen the ecosystem.

    • @[email protected]
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      171 month ago

      Well that’s all very well, but I’ve got a bathroom speaker I can no longer access.

      So how about instead of Daddy Google deciding what’s best for everyone, they let things run and give you a warning?

      Hell, I’ve even got games I’ve paid for that are now gone. Honestly, fuck them for even thinking that’s acceptable.

      • @yamanii
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        111 month ago

        Same, it’s why I never buy a game or app nowadays, they will just stop working when the new OS version comes around, devs already got their money so they don’t have any incentive to care, and contrary to PC I can’t do shit about it myself on my phone, there’s no “androidbox” to run old apps inside my phone.

      • @[email protected]
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        1 month ago

        You’re really arguing for a covenant around tech that companies want to orphan. The rule needs to be the code is opened and a slacker code owner is appointed for handover.

        This is gonna embarrass Google a Lot but it’s gonna embarrass azn and m$ a whole lot more.

        The forced alternative is a refund if you can bring something recognizable with a serial number to your post office or something as ubiquitous, present and staffed - have them validate in the loosest fashion and require like 10 bizdays for the cash refund.

        Whether or not the post office is there for that or charges the OEM for the notary-light service is a matter for the courts, the USPS, and these days probably the fn SCotUS.

      • @TrickDacy
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        71 month ago

        So how about instead of Daddy Google deciding what’s best for everyone, they let things run and give you a warning?

        That is not what’s happening. It takes tons of work to maintain backward compatibility but you’re framing it as though it doesn’t and they’re just being a holes on purpose.

        • @[email protected]
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          81 month ago

          It doesn’t allow direct connection. You have to dick about with a stupid app to put it in “speaker mode” first.

          • @[email protected]
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            51 month ago

            Damn that sucks!!! I wish there was a way to sandbox older apps. I’ve ran into the same issue with old apps before.

          • @LinusSexTips
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            21 month ago

            Gives me Sonos vibes.

            I won a Sonos speaker years ago, thing needed (from memory) an app to switch to AUX mode. The speaker sounded great but I didn’t want to install an app just to use the thing.

            In a grand spectacle my ex’s cat kicked a potplant off a windowsill into our fish tank. That shorted a power board, we didn’t have breakers (ceramic / wire fuses) which ended up killing the speaker.

            Honestly as nice of a speaker it was, good riddance.

      • @[email protected]
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        21 month ago

        The problem is allowing the APIs it uses to exist at all in the OS is a huge security hole.

        • @[email protected]
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          31 month ago

          So it’s my choice to run them?

          If I can download an APK, I should be able to run it in a “compatibility mode” and have the OS do it’s best to run it.

          • @[email protected]
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            11 month ago

            There’s a few apps that let you virtualize an older version of Android, but in my experience they’re slow, and they’re all from sketchy-looking Chinese companies that are for sure harvesting all your data. There’s also an open source project running for this, but I don’t remember what it was called and it was fairly limited.

          • @[email protected]
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            -21 month ago

            It can’t.

            A compatibility mode would involve meaningful cost, massively compromise security, and not have a chance in hell of working.

            • @[email protected]
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              11 month ago

              They could just spin up a container of some sort. It’s still fundamentally Linux, so it should be possible to run Android inside an lxc container the same way you can run a desktop Linux distro in docker (which is based on the lxc functionality in the Linux kernel)

              • @[email protected]
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                21 month ago

                The point is that you have to emulate a fuckton of low level access to even have a chance of anything working. Either you replace the actual hardware access with junk data, making none of the apps work, or you break the whole permissions structure, and your security is completely gone.

                All of those APIs were deprecated because it’s impossible to provide them in any way that resembles security.

                • @[email protected]
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                  11 month ago

                  I mean, as long as it’s in a pretty robust sandbox and it’s either firewalled or has no network access (if possible for the app in question), I would think security implications are minimal. Like, even if the version of Android inside the container is compromised, the app could only take over its own container, which is non-privileged and doesn’t have access to anything you didn’t explicitly give it (in terms of user data).

                  • @[email protected]
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                    21 month ago

                    But almost every app is going to crash because they’re built on needing the information those APIs return.

                    His example of not being able to control some wireless speaker? Supporting that app is going to be a mess, best case.