A new study projects that global fertility rates, which have been declining in all countries since 1950, will continue to plummet through the end of the century, resulting in a profound demographic shift.
Why would I want to bring another human being into this world? The planet is melting, greed is at insane levels, the future looks bleak. I don’t want my children to suffer and get thrown through the machine.
I’m glad my parents didn’t think like that. I vastly prefer non-optimal life to not existing at all.
I’m also not going to have kids but I do it because of me, not because of them. I don’t understand people who think they are so wise that they can make this judgement for others.
From subjective experience theres no difference. The moment you cease to exists you could just as well have never existed.
Also not existing is not something you do. Choosing to prevent something for existing that otherwise would have is. We’re however getting quite far from my original argument here which is that not making children because you think the world is an awful place and life is not worth living is, in my opinion, a bad reason.
I think it’s mostly up to the reader at what tone they’re going to intrepret my writing. I don’t notice such color in that. Then again I’m probably autistic so what do I know.
I’m glad my parents didn’t think like that. I vastly prefer non-optimal life to not existing at all.
Glad you were fortunate enough for this to be the case. It’s not the case for everyone.
I don’t understand people who think they are so wise that they can make this judgement for others.
Funny you’d say that, since you’re the only one here judging others for their personal choices.
My partner and I are content with our choice. We would not be able to give a child the life they deserve, nor will the world give that to them. Sure, maybe in another world we’d be willing. But now? Not for us.
Like it or not, by making that choice for yourself you are deciding to not bring them into the world, same as us. The outcome is the same.
Intentionally driving over someone and accidently doing so both have the same result but I don’t think you would claim that there is no difference. Intentions matter even if the outcome is the same. I’m not judging your choices but your reasoning.
In my opinion this applies to having children aswell. No one is under any obligation to have kids and there are plenty of valid reasons not to do so and this can be anything from financial, time saving or just personal preference. However, to me it’s hypocritical to justify not having children by essentially claiming that their life wouldn’t be worth living but at the same time you yourself continue your existence here. You basically set standards and then don’t apply them to yourself.
Infant mortality used to be insanely high before modern healthcare and medicine. There was no social safety nets expect for the community around you. There was no gurantees about access to food and clean water not to even mention education. Looking at virtually any metric life has never been better and yet people say “it’s not worth bringing children into this world”. I’m sorry but to me that kind of thinking is just insanely cynical and misjudged.
However, to me it’s hypocritical to justify not having children by essentially claiming that their life wouldn’t be worth living but at the same time you yourself continue your existence here.
I don’t think it’s hypocritical. To create new life and to sustain life are two different things. While there’s a certain relevance, the act of creating life has more to it than simply sustaining life. Sustaining maintains the status quo which while not ideal, the opposite also means ending a life which has far greater implications that are closer to ending life.
It’s not hypocritical to think that bringing someone to life might be a net negative and also agree that to stop continue living would result I’m a net negative because of reasons like how there’s people who are reliant on them.
Just to add to your point: the only reason I’m sustaining my life is because other people depend on me, not because my current life is really worth living for its own sake.
13.8 billion years of nothing untill a bundle of stardust on a random planet called earth combined in such a way that it suddenly became aware of its own existance. To our current knowledge that is about the most complex thing that has ever happened in the universe.
Yeah, I wont be there to experience my non-existence after I’m gone, but I’m more than happy to be here now.
It doesn’t add anything meaningful to the discussion. Basically everyone is aware of those arguments. The top level comment states some facts (e.g. climate change), but does not offer deeper insight or start a discussion. Nothing was gained from reading that comment, so it may as well not have been written in the first place.
In order to turn it into a meaningful contribution the author of said comment should have added something more.
For example by going into how they feel those facts are insurmountable and therefore how they see the demographic changes as inevitable and what sort of effects this will have on their personal life/on their community/on their country. This can then lead to a discussion about the severity of the effects and people can contribute what they think possible solutions are.
Or for another example, one could use these effects on demographic change as a basis to start a discussion about one of the contributing factors. i.e. take the difficulties that arise from lower birthrates as an argument for better family oriented policies/for more climate action/against bodily autonomy (that one would certainly start a fierce discussion, lol)
Why would I want to bring another human being into this world? The planet is melting, greed is at insane levels, the future looks bleak. I don’t want my children to suffer and get thrown through the machine.
I’m glad my parents didn’t think like that. I vastly prefer non-optimal life to not existing at all.
I’m also not going to have kids but I do it because of me, not because of them. I don’t understand people who think they are so wise that they can make this judgement for others.
How could you possibly know that? Do you remember not existing?
If I didn’t want to exists I would commit a suicide. The fact that I don’t want to do that indicates to me that it’s better for me to exist than not.
There is a massive difference between never existing and taking existence away from someone that already has it
From subjective experience theres no difference. The moment you cease to exists you could just as well have never existed.
Also not existing is not something you do. Choosing to prevent something for existing that otherwise would have is. We’re however getting quite far from my original argument here which is that not making children because you think the world is an awful place and life is not worth living is, in my opinion, a bad reason.
Have you considered practicing how to convey your thoughts and opinions in a less arrogant and off-putting way?
I think it’s mostly up to the reader at what tone they’re going to intrepret my writing. I don’t notice such color in that. Then again I’m probably autistic so what do I know.
Glad you were fortunate enough for this to be the case. It’s not the case for everyone.
Funny you’d say that, since you’re the only one here judging others for their personal choices.
My partner and I are content with our choice. We would not be able to give a child the life they deserve, nor will the world give that to them. Sure, maybe in another world we’d be willing. But now? Not for us.
Like it or not, by making that choice for yourself you are deciding to not bring them into the world, same as us. The outcome is the same.
Intentionally driving over someone and accidently doing so both have the same result but I don’t think you would claim that there is no difference. Intentions matter even if the outcome is the same. I’m not judging your choices but your reasoning.
In my opinion this applies to having children aswell. No one is under any obligation to have kids and there are plenty of valid reasons not to do so and this can be anything from financial, time saving or just personal preference. However, to me it’s hypocritical to justify not having children by essentially claiming that their life wouldn’t be worth living but at the same time you yourself continue your existence here. You basically set standards and then don’t apply them to yourself.
Infant mortality used to be insanely high before modern healthcare and medicine. There was no social safety nets expect for the community around you. There was no gurantees about access to food and clean water not to even mention education. Looking at virtually any metric life has never been better and yet people say “it’s not worth bringing children into this world”. I’m sorry but to me that kind of thinking is just insanely cynical and misjudged.
I don’t think it’s hypocritical. To create new life and to sustain life are two different things. While there’s a certain relevance, the act of creating life has more to it than simply sustaining life. Sustaining maintains the status quo which while not ideal, the opposite also means ending a life which has far greater implications that are closer to ending life.
It’s not hypocritical to think that bringing someone to life might be a net negative and also agree that to stop continue living would result I’m a net negative because of reasons like how there’s people who are reliant on them.
Just to add to your point: the only reason I’m sustaining my life is because other people depend on me, not because my current life is really worth living for its own sake.
Oh please, you were fine with not existing for 13.8 billion years. Existence is just a phase you’ll soon grow out of.
13.8 billion years of nothing untill a bundle of stardust on a random planet called earth combined in such a way that it suddenly became aware of its own existance. To our current knowledge that is about the most complex thing that has ever happened in the universe.
Yeah, I wont be there to experience my non-existence after I’m gone, but I’m more than happy to be here now.
I sure don’t. If I had a time machine I’d go back in time to when my mom was pregnant with me and push that stupid bitch down a flight of stairs.
Came to find this comment. Always gets upvoted, never relevant to the actual issue
Came to find this comment, always irrelevant, offers nothing.
How is it not relevant?
It doesn’t add anything meaningful to the discussion. Basically everyone is aware of those arguments. The top level comment states some facts (e.g. climate change), but does not offer deeper insight or start a discussion. Nothing was gained from reading that comment, so it may as well not have been written in the first place.
In order to turn it into a meaningful contribution the author of said comment should have added something more.
For example by going into how they feel those facts are insurmountable and therefore how they see the demographic changes as inevitable and what sort of effects this will have on their personal life/on their community/on their country. This can then lead to a discussion about the severity of the effects and people can contribute what they think possible solutions are.
Or for another example, one could use these effects on demographic change as a basis to start a discussion about one of the contributing factors. i.e. take the difficulties that arise from lower birthrates as an argument for better family oriented policies/for more climate action/against bodily autonomy (that one would certainly start a fierce discussion, lol)
Who would pre-check commentaries for uniqueness? And on what basis?
A thought might be banal for one and new for another.
ok 👍🏻 still not having kids