(definitely not satire )
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Also voting for the lesser of two evils makes you evil because less evil is still evil even though it’s also more good, but it’s not good enough so it’s evil and so are you.
Also politicians only really listen when they find out you don’t vote- really makes them want to work harder to impress you so you’ll vote for them.
unambiguously and absolutely true. 👍
I feel like the sarcasm dripping off this post is going to be lost on far too many.
Not gonna lie this one probably would have gotten me if it was on any other post. I feel like it could use a few more unnecessarily large words to really sell it.
I didn’t vote last election and Joe Biden called me up and asked me what he had to do for me to vote for him and I asked for what any other red-blooded American would.
A Joe Biden dick pic.
Here that Joe? Youll never get SatansMagottyCumFart without a dick pic!!!
Oh, he delivered.
He’s got my vote.
i think politicians listen best when we do a huge strike and cost them actual money.
The ones in office might- but who is in office if\when that happens determines if\how they react. Some might make the policy changes the public is demanding, others might call in the jackboots.
both will call the jackboots when really needed. biden made that threat to railworkers for example, and are constantly doing it to socialists, queers, blacks you name it. its just not shown on the msm.
both parties are subordinated to the same capital masters, hurt their profits enough and they will be forced to respond to us. resisting the jackboots is clearly but sadly a part of it, they aint letting us take away their power easily.
Let me know when the general strike starts. Until then I’ll keep voting for whoever isn’t actively trying to become a dictator to give you more time. It would be nice if you’d do the bare minimum to help with that but sounds like you have more delusional priorities.
thats not how it works. allow me to explain in good faith:
it did with the railworkers i just mentioned. but then some people got conviced by the “but the economy!!” rhetoric and they shut it down without resistance or questioning.
change are not built by a magical leader who somehow comes to save us its made by us. the leader is just someone at the right place and time to represent us. thats history.
the real delusion here is being comfy enough to think that choosing between two genocidal maniacs will somehow fix the trainwreck we are hurling towards. by all means, go scribble on a stupid fucking rigged ballot and see for yourself if it does anything to stop trump or something. (spoiler: he already won)
in the mean time i suggest you go learn how your own political system works, im not gonna waste that time on you anymore.
lol- okay then. You’ve convinced me you in particular probably shouldn’t vote so I’m happy to take responsibility for choosing who gets to spend your taxes.
sure man, if you think so
Ok allow me to explain in real terms: 50% of the US thinks Donald Trump is a reasonable leader, and you think that you will somehow convince enough of these people to participate in collective direct action before you will convince them to just not vote for a fucking idiot?
if you consider voter turnout, its more like 20-30%ish. in my country, our trump-equivalent had about 25%. you wont convince most of them, and you dont need to.
you dont need the entirety of the population onboard. in fact you can see the amount of damage this 20-30% was and still is able to do.
the railroad strikes, what is their percentage of the population? that got them scared already. with results will come more supporters.
Deontology brains be like
and you cannot must not never ever vote for anyone who doesn’t 100% completely totally have do exactly what you want
literally never ever do this you will regret it!
Personally, I plan to vote for Biden. However, everyone has a limit. I’m not going to blame, accuse, or get upset at all towards the people that choose to abstain from voting for a presidential candidate because they cannot in good conscience vote for a person complicit in genocide. I agree with their reasoning, but I cannot in good conscience abstain and let the country fall to fascism again. Complicity in genocide is a reasonable thing for people to say they won’t vote for the “less bad” option.
That’s fine, but those people cannot complain about trump if he wins
fair.
blame, accuse get upset? no. present them with information and ask to please reconsider for the sake of their neighbors’ safety? yea.
I’ll do the blaming, accusing, and getting upset part.
This, we need to respect other peoples decisions. You’re not going to win their vote by harassing them over their refusal to do so.
Moderates need to accept that they need to play nice with liberals. Attacking us for valid reasons for not voting, or even attacking those of us who are voting for said candidate while not being quiet about our issues with said candidate is not helping.
The moderate left is genuinely working down this path towards becoming aggressive as the far right at this point. We know you’re scared that Trump’s going to get in office, but when you reach the point of harassing other people over their choices regarding voting you’re becoming just as bad as Trump’s mobs.
I think you finally made me understand. You say “moderates” but see yourself as a real leftist. So it’s a matter of ideology to you, not of cause and effect.
But it wouldn’t make you a hypocrite to acknowledge that as fucked as the US democracy is, voting against orange guy could make a material difference. If the next US election was like so many others, just one run-off-the-mill neoliberal ghoul vs another, I’d say you do you. But Trump has the very real potential to be so much worse.
Trump is racist, sexist, anti-left, and anti-lgbt, and he wants to 1. be a fascist dictator and 2. make policies that punish those he hates. And the international radical left watches with abject horror that some of you don’t vote in for the guy who wants to keep women’s rights, immigrant rights, and rights for queer people.
People like yourself remind me of corporations dumping the blame of pollution onto the masses.
It’s the same concept here. Voters should not be the final line of defense against someone like Trump. There were so many possible stop gaps prior, so many times before this that something should have been done, and yet nothing was done.
Don’t get me wrong. Some of us realize that we have no choice, but the onus should have never been on our shoulders.
People like yourself are likely grateful for Trump if you ask me. Why stop him prior to the elections if possible when you can use him to forcefully fearmonger with real threats? You enjoy being able to grab the average American liberals face and shove it in the direction of Trump and say, “Look, this is what’s going to happen. Side with me or else.” The reality is that if we had two sane candidates and the DNC candidate wasn’t to our liking, then we’d be able to look away.
You know what the international radical left really watched with abject horror? They watched our political system and its corrupt officials allow Trump to get this far to begin with all so you could pin the blame on voters.
Why stop him prior to the elections if possible when you can use him to forcefully fearmonger with real threats?
So we can start shifting the country back to the left? It took the right 70 years to pull off what they have. I honestly don’t expect “the left” to be able to reverse it in any less. You have a lot of should’s and need-to’s in you comments but not a lot of “going to” or “do’s,” I think that’s really emblematic of the issue. The other commenter is right, you see yourself as “the actual left” even though you likely don’t actually participate in the process in any real way. You essentially do not exist to pols because you don’t actually use your voice, yet you get to preach to actual progressives who are trying to change things.
You enjoy being able to grab the average American liberals face and shove it in the direction of Trump and say, “Look, this is what’s going to happen. Side with me or else.”
Yeah, I love trying to explain basic civics to the terminally online and apathetic.
The reality is that if we had two sane candidates and the DNC candidate wasn’t to our liking, then we’d be able to look away.
I agree, unfortunately mobilizing the base (that’s you) to actually push for these changes is difficult. “The left” is plagued by in-fighting and it’s difficult to get them to agree on a goal much less the means to accomplish it. A couple states have implemented RCV and more are becoming aware of it. Organizers have pretty decent luck pushing things at a state-level if they can get their positions before the people but of course the right has every motivation to just maintain the status quo.
You have a lot of should’s and need-to’s in you comments but not a lot of “going to” or “do’s,” I think that’s really emblematic of the issue. The other commenter is right, you see yourself as “the actual left” even though you likely don’t actually participate in the process in any real way. You essentially do not exist to pols because you don’t actually use your voice,
You took the time to dig through my post history, so clearly you’d know I have intentions of voting, that I have voted before, and that I don’t simply vote in big elections, but rather at various different levels. I’m trying just as hard as you are, I’m just more understanding of those that aren’t, and I’m not defending all of my preferred candidates choices.
But hey, reading is difficult. Easier to come online and be an asshole.
I simply have more understanding of the general voting base. I’m not out of touch. Maybe if the moderates were capable of such they could convince people to vote.
Also do some self-reflection. You need it with the amount of hypocrisy you just blatantly dropped.
People like myself? Like anarchists? Who don’t live in the US?
Why would we be “grateful for Trump”
You missed the point.
Anyways, I had no idea you weren’t from this country. It’s a bit hard to tell with how passionate you are about our politics.
Only the respect they deserve and not a jot more. Those that paralyze themselves over absolute morality will get none should things get worse. Largely ignored should things stay the same or get slightly better. Because they were of no help to anyone, not even themselves.
Sure, and you will understand when I say that this is an incredibly privileged position, and is a direct reason why abortion is no longer considered a fundamental human right in the US.
As long as you are willing to accept that moral liability then we are cool.
And by “complicit in genocide” you mean “navigating a delicate geopolitical situation by being a serious voice of restraint from the start?”
I swear, the singular thing which enables this nonsense on the internet is that these people know they will never have to actually lead or be held accountable for their outrageous policy positions as long as they continue to hold onto the privilege of their own armchairs.
Sending billions in weapons and money, and vetoing ceasefire resolutions helps the genocide along a lot more than talking to Bibi has stopped or even slowed it down at all. Actions are stronger than words. Poll numbers seem to only be the only thing that had pushed him to take this more seriously, too.
You apparently have Biden confused with Netanyahu. Biden has been trying to get Bibi to stop his “over the top” response from the start. Now there is a risk of a regional conflict which would be really, really bad. Biden set conditions today.
Actions speak louder than words. Circumventing congress to deliver $18B worth of 2000lb bombs and F15s says a lot more than his words.
If Israel suffers another October 7th after Biden withdraws aid, that’s the end of Biden. He must toe the line between continuing to support Israel’s defense while preventing their egregious offensive actions.
That being said just today Biden and Blinken publicly noted that they are now considering conditioning aid.
Israel is talking about invading Rafah and civilians are saying that the IDF is already there. I do not give a fuck about an imaginary hypothetical. Biden needs to stop providing offensive weaponry to the IDF and the settlers.
Oh now they are at least considering putting a condition on the aid… like what we do with Ukraine. Well as long as he keeps giving us words i am sure we can forgive the continual lack of action. Its also good that we can hand wave genocide as long as it helps Biden in the election! I was worried that i would have to not vote for Biden because of my moral compass. I guess the blood will be on the hands of the disenfranchised voters if Biden loses. And that Israeli lives are worth more then Palestinian. Glad you cleared that up. /s
Hahaha oh please, if this isn’t the biggest form of grandstanding meets concern-trolling I’ve seen in a long time… Spare me this armchair expert analysis from a position of comfort and doing substantively nothing.
But do contact the White House with your genius insight. I’m sure you’ve totally evaluated all aspects of this decision-making and totally aren’t missing variables, Mr.Dunning-Kruger. ;)
Like wise to you! We have every right to criticize Biden, and it’s our civic duty to do so and to vote as we will. Maybe next time we be allowed to strategically vote in order to get representation, oh but not this time because trump is the opponent, as if there isn’t a line of stooges in the republicans party waiting for him to die to co-opt his nationalistic hate mob.
As a matter of fact, the way i see it, if the democrats lose this election because they disenfranchised the voters, this would be a huge incentive to have an actual left candidate after the next 4 trump years. Which would benefit me in the long term. Otherwise we will be stuck in the “you can’t vote for who you want, if you don’t vote for the slightly less evil candidate, democracy will die” hole forever. And always shifting right in the process.
You seem to believe that progress and maintenance of the status-quo can easily remedy the damage done by a legitimate fascist regime as seen in the Trump party. Even if you got your dream candidate in after another 4 years of Trump, they wouldn’t be able to reverse the damage done – simply due to entropy, and quite possibly due to the fact that our Democratic system would be completely broken after another 4 years. I don’t see any evidence whatsoever that there is anyone who can rally the Trump cult base who has affixed themselves to his personality. DeSantis was supposed to be a more finely-groomed copy of Trump and he failed miserably. Republicans hitched their wagon to Trump and with him goes the party for better or worse.
By all means, try to influence Biden to further action. However the calculus is pretty simple:
- If your goal is to minimize genocide, both in Palestine and Ukraine.
- If your goal is to ensure that we don’t fall further into fascism.
- If the choices on the ballot in November are a constant, regardless of anything else that happens.
- If you understand the nature of entropy in that maintaining let alone building-upon a trillion-piece puzzle is exceedingly more taxing than smashing it.
- If other guy is significantly-worse for Ukrainians, Palestinians, US, and the World.
- If you understand the mathematical trend of FPTP and the Spoiler Effect.
… Then one understands the logical choice is voting for Biden and doing anything else from not voting, voting Republican, voting 3rd-party, writing-in – is utterly self-defeating and short-sighted to the aforementioned goals.
If you don’t understand these things, then yes, one might have built their ardent beliefs atop a house of cards.
Of course if Biden gets ahead of the polls, pulls aid too quickly, he risks jeopordizing the votes of nearly 7 million Jewish-American voters who still strongly support Israel. He risks losing independents who 1/3 side with Israel and 1/3 are undecided on whether Israel is going too far. So until you and I can convince THOSE people that what Israel is doing is wrong, then it’s natural for Biden’s team to be wary of losing those critical votes (who dwarf the Muslim population and dwarf the progressive population).
Bro you don’t understand what happening. Joseph Biden is personally stopping peace between Israel and Palestine from happening. Like it would have been such a trivial issue to solve if Biden hadn’t personally decided that he wanted this war to continue forever and ordered Israel to do a genocide.
Absolutely?! Else why would his first name be genocide? It’s literally built into his identity.
You’re so right, the situation is so complicated that biden just has to supply billions of dollars and military equipment in full support of the genocide! It’s just impossible to not support genocide. It’s so important that it’s worth sacrificing poll numbers to do it!
Yeah youre so right, because we all know the president is basically just king of America and can just do whatever he likes at all times.
It’s not like there are dozens of factions within even just his own party, many of which support Israel, or at least see them as an incredibly important strategic ally in the middle east who are basically our proxy against countries like Iran and also represent the security of American corporate interests in the region, and those corporations and their billionaire owners have massive influence over the government via individual politicians campaign finances and would bankroll Trump in a heartbeat if they thought Biden is going to ruin their relations in the middle east.
And even if that was all true. Biden is all powerful so he doesn’t have to care about any of that messy “politicking” nonsense.
Biden seems to have all the power in the world when it comes to supplying a campaign of genocide. Are you arguing that it takes more power to simply do nothing? Doing nothing would actually be an improvement in this situation.
I forget that reading comprehension isn’t a thing here.
No, Biden doesn’t really have the power to “do nothing” because, again, he isn’t King, has a loft of people of varying importance that he has to keep happy. Those people include people with close ties to Israel, staunch zionists, oil tycoons and “defence” companies that all put pressure on Biden to keep sending weapons to Israel.
And they are likely a powerful enough group to potentially sway the election. So if Biden just decided to do the moral thing and say fuck Israel, cut aid to them and accuse them of war crimes. He’s going to personally piss off that pro Israel faction and they will likely switch support to the extremely pro-Israel Trump.
So Biden will be having to weigh up making that decision, what actual benefits it will have (Israel still has a stockpile, they can buy weapons from other countries, would that just force them into a bloody ground offensive?) And wether that’s worth the potential ck sequence of those key people switching sides and possibly swaying the election for Trump who is strong anti-palestine and would undoubtedly make the situation far worse. And thinking about if he can use his position to influence Israel’s actions and help get aide into Palestine in a way that doesn’t piss off the pro Israel faction.
Please just take a breath and realise the realities of the highest stakes geo politics, is that doing the thing that obviously a good thing, ultimately might not be the best course of action.
I can read your dumb posts just fine. You sound like those people who claim that Putin just had to invade Ukraine. In case you haven’t realized it, genocide is bad, and trying to cover it up with “it’s complex” doesn’t make it any better.
Oh shit man, I never considered “genocide is bad” before.
Hey you should go tell that to the UN. You could be reasonable for world peace with such enlighten takes like that my guy!
Also remember to take memes seriously and get in fights with strangers on the internet.
<pausesatire> it’s not too much of a hyperbole to suggest that memes are deadly serious and it’s not a coincidence they have been used in misinformation campaigns and psyops. the arguments with strangers thing i’m 60/40 on tho for sure. </pausesatire>
It’s also really easy to put whatever dumb shit out there and then when called on it just say “it’s just meme bro!”
No I won’t
You must be a republican american posting from a Mac with a take like that. The worst kind of person on Lemmy!
Oof that hurts
Call me crazy but I think this might be exaggerating for effect.
absolutely not this post is so deadass?
When I was a kid I didn’t understand how people let a genocide happen. I mean, just go there and protest, disrupting everything you can until they’re forced to stop. Everyone’s against genocide, right? We should be able to get millions of people to completely flood the streets and prevent everything from happening, including the killing. Sure, they’d gun some of us down, but it’d have to be less than they’d kill otherwise.
Now I’m voting for the guy supplying the weapons.
Am I wholly supporting him and am complicit in everything he has ever done and ever will do? No, but I’m disgusted with myself, and always will be. I have the ability to put my life on the line for the sake of saving those who are losing theirs, and instead I vote for the guy handing out the guns. I have no right to be anything but disgusted with myself. If you can rationalize it and forgive yourself, that’s cool I guess, but I’m not going to give myself that out.
Innocent people - mothers, children - will be killed because of the actions of a man I voted for. The least I could do is feel bad about it. If people were being mowed down in my town by guns supplied by another country, I know I’d forever hate the people of that country for not doing something, ANYTHING, to stop it. Our country was founded by the act of stepping up to fight a government that doesn’t care about people. Look at us now.
Holy shit homie :(
I guess if you are voluntarily refusing to give yourself an out, that’s your right.
But you absolutely are not required to feel any culpability for this. The meme is satire. The system which precipitated the current crisis wasn’t a product of you, nor your generation, nor even the previous one. You are operating as a reasonable and honest individual looking out for their neighbor in a shitty fucking situation.
The evil and oppression of centuries of white capitalists, imperialists, colonialists and slaveowners is not a cross that needs to dig into your own emotional wellbeing, this point only strengthened by the fact that none of those oppressive scum ever shed a single tear for the terror they wrought.
Thank you for your honesty and courage in posting this. I wish you a bright today and tomorrow ♥️
I appreciate the kind words, but I’m only responsible for my own actions, and at the end of the day, I have the ability to buy a ticket to Israel or DC to start a protest there.
It wouldn’t do much good with just me, but maybe I’d drum up some support and get a few people to join me. That’s how movements start, after all - one person becomes a few, becomes a lot, becomes a force to be reckoned with. But I’m not doing that. I’m posting on social media just like the “thoughts and prayers” crowd.
This whole situation has shown me exactly how people can let atrocities happen - they simply don’t believe their actions would be enough to make a difference, so they sit and hope someone has the balls to do what they can’t bring themselves to.
For what it’s worth, internet protest is a thing too.
I don’t know about you, but I grew up basically permanently online, and I gained a lot of my current political insight from raw and honest comments just like yours. It might not seem like it, but there are certainly eyes taking in your words right now that might change the way they look at the situation. While the barrier to entry for internet posting is low, that doesn’t make the outcome value of it nill.
And check out some local protests. The media has made it so that you certainly don’t need to book a ticket to DC to make your voice heard. 🫶
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My fucking guy
By this line of reasoning you are personally complicit in literally every bad thing that anyone does. It’s stupid and you’re stupid for thinking it. Snap the fuck out of your martyr complex. You’re not important enough to be a martyr. You’re just a dude. The world does not rest on your shoulders.
I literally said I’m not complicit. I’m only responsible for myself, but I know that everyone is just some guy until they aren’t. I know every movement started with some guy who decided to try to make a change. The world needs some guy right now, but it’s not going to be me.
Democracy is intended to make having the top job conditional on following the will of the people.
If a waiter says fuck you, you don’t get fries, I want to throw shit at you, they get fired.
If a president says fuck you, you don’t get basic human decency, I want to exterminate brown people, he gets fired.
THAT IS THE ENTIRE POINT OF THE SYSTEM.
If he wants to continue being president, he has to make with the basic human decency. It’s not a hard concept.
And if the guy who will surely get hired instead is a monster and it’s desperately important for everyone’s sake that he keep the job, then it’s HIS responsiblity to do the fucking job he’s hired for.
That’s literally not at all how the Presidency works and it’s a terrible analogy.
It literally is how it works.
Every four years, there’s a performance review. People decide whether hiring the guy was a mistake - and if he doesn’t measure up, they don’t extend his contract.
You obey the people who give you the job, or you don’t continue working there.
The people want Biden to stop helping Israel exterminate Palestinians - and indeed, to put significant and effective pressure on Israel to stop doing it altogether.
If he won’t do that, they won’t vote to extend his presidency for another term.
That’s the entire point. That’s what democracy is for.
If your leader is being a piece of shit, you get to dump his ass. Otherwise, they could keep on being pieces of shit, and nobody could stop them.
It’s a vastly insufficient mechanism, but it’s the only one we’ve got.
Biden is being a contemptible piece of shit. He can stop doing that, or he can look for another job.
It’s not “this guy, yes or no”. It’s “this guy or that guy”. The position will be filled. You get to pick which of the two candidates gets the job, but there are only two candidates.
Given that all your complaints with this guy are also present in the other guy, except way worse, I think you should choose this guy.
It’s not “this guy, yes or no”.
It is for this guy.
Go spit in your boss’ face, then tell him he can’t fire you, you’re the best candidate available. See how long you keep getting paid.
Accountability, motherfucker. Do you speak it?
That’s why it’s a shit analogy. It doesn’t work like that at all.
'tis not doesn’t work. You need to actually make a case for your position.
People vote for you, or they don’t. Their reasons are their own - but if you’ve pissed them off and blatantly done things they didn’t want you to, chances are this will not go well for you.
That’s how it works.
So you’re okay with a Trump Presidency?
I agree with your point and it’s valid. Problem is we will keep platforming these people until election day because it’s to the GOPs advantage and they have no moral quandary. At certain point we need to say, “Hey. Your point is valid but please can I redirect you toward a solution.” Without a solution we are fucked.
Solution can’t be, “ignore this genocide, please.”
It’s satire. Calm down.
Same goes for everything artist you listen to, every author you read, every actor you watch, etc.
true! this is why i never read anything cos what if i become a nazi
I’ll blow this place sky high (by not voting) if every one of my demands aren’t met! I’ll do it!
Demand #1: getaway car #2: public apology from George Lucas #3: Letter “M” stricken from the English language #4: 100% for true no-backsies peace in the middle east
Also Middle Earth!
This applies to Trump right?
no sadly it doesn’t apply to republicans its a left wing exclusive thing :(
Also, not voting means that everything bad that someone you didn’t vote for does is your fault. By the way, supporting genocide is more important than improving poll numbers.
No it’s voting that is a blood pact. Abstention keeps your soul pure like fresh-fallen snow. 🥰
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