Social media seems to be laughing its ass off about this tragedy, is it because the folks at burning man are perceived as frivolous hippies or something? Everyone I’ve ever met who was a regular burning man attendee has been a solid human being with strong morals, personally and financially responsible, a career. Upstanding members of society for sure. I guess all some people know is the sensationalized drugs and sex. A person died. This is a tragedy for an event that brings positivity into the world. Kind of annoyed.
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It’s also because Burning Man, at least in the last decade or more, just turned into another affluent, rich white people and influencer event. Whatever it was to start, it’s effectively glamping now.
Sure, there are definitely some genuinely good people there, lower middle class, saved up and took their only vacation time they get all year to spend a few days there, and it sucks this happened to them. If those people end up in the hospital and the shitty insurance they get from work does fuck all to help mitigate the expenses, I’ll even get angry on their behalf.
But the majority of them? They spent a lot of money, money most people don’t have the luxury of getting to spend, on a pointless self-indulgent festival in the fucking desert, and this time it’s come back to bite them. My sympathy is extremely limited.
They’ll be miserable for a few days, get out, dry off, and go back to their easy lives. Their affairs are taken care of back home, they can miss days of work, their hospital stays will be covered, etc.
It’s kind of like the Fyre Festival. Those people got fucked over hard, but those people were also not the kind I particularly pitty. Spending a lot of money on an experience only to be miserable for a few days is not a tragedy. What happened to the poor people that lived there is the tragedy.
Edit: Also just want to point out OP is trying to call this a “tragedy” when there’s only been one suspected death, the cause of which is unknown as it hasn’t even been confirmed yet, but the overall mood is positive, and by all accounts everything is being managed. They’re trapped, not dying.
It’s also because Burning Man, at least in the last decade or more, just turned into another affluent, rich white people and influencer event.
I’m pretty sure it’s been that way for at least 20 years…
The only people I’ve personally known to go to Burning Man was a rich kid in high school who went with his dad who was a marketing high-up at a very big tech company. Always came back talking about trying drugs and seeing some crazy shit, but then on Tuesday it’s right back to full days of pointless meetings I guess. I’ve never been and I frankly don’t ever care to, but that alone gave me the feeling that Burning Man is where tech suits go to play hippie for the weekend, and that always felt lame as fuck.
I went a couple of times years ago when it was just starting to turn into what you describe. Had a great time, but it quickly priced me out. Now, it sounds like an influencer-laden hellscape. The addition of premium plug and play sites was the nail in the coffin. That said, a lot of the old time Burners are fucking amazing, creative, resourceful, and helpful people.
It’s kind of like the Fyre Festival. Those people got fucked over hard, but those people were also not the kind I particularly pitty. Spending a lot of money on an experience only to be miserable for a few days is not a tragedy.
Blame sensationalist media on this one, but it’s a misconception. Very few victims spent a lot of money on Fyre Festival. Most got tickets which were purported to be “all inclusive” for <$1500 USD (a pretty good deal, had it not been fraudulent). A handful of tickets sold for the $12K price which ended up in the headlines, but the standard price was a fraction of that. There’s a good summary of this discrepancy here: https://youtu.be/UBPg5ftCMv8
One of the things I’ve learned over time is people can have vastly different perceptions of what being “poor” is, and I suspect that’s what’s happening here.
I think there are those who could not afford to put down the 1.5k you’re quoting.
Well yes of course, but there are lots of “poor” people who have maybe been saving up for a vacation and could make $1500 appear for an opportunity if the value seemed good enough. My family wasn’t rich growing up, but we would still go on one frugal vacation a year, which probably ended up costing a similar amount. It’s definitely not a demographic that I would feel “deserved” getting defrauded and left in a FEMA tent with no food and water for a weekend.
That’s not poor at all. I was one of eight kids growing up, and we never, ever, went on a vacation of any kind. It just wasn’t possible at all.
completely agree with this take, also OP screams american excepcionalism.
Wouldn’t every event or festival be an exercise in waste and excess? May be e we should just stay at home forever and work
I’ve heard smaller, local burns are better experiences now and are less wasteful. Just like most things, the original spirit and intent of an event gets lost when it becomes bigger and commercialized.
Well it being in the middle of a desert makes it more wasteful.
But yes giant festivals that encourage a lot of travel and needlessly burning things are in general wasteful and potentially excessive. There are other leisure activities, so discouraging festivals is not equivalent to working nonstop.
Isn’t unnecessarily lighting stuff on fire kind of the point?
Fireworks?
They build and set ablaze a giant man! It’s eponymous!
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small local burns are more true to form in that endeavor. people clean up after themselves and are generally respectful.
some bad actors, but it’s a nice disconnect from technology.
I like to go and host a alternate dimension themed arcade with silly obscure games.
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Ive heard of this lol
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Alchemy in Wakanda
haha come on. what are you talking about?
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ohhh. I thought you were roleplaying at first!
Ooh, what games? Where?
local burns, whatever seems whimsical and trippy
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Burning Man ‘promotes’ anti-consumerism and communal effort, however attending requires significant financial resources and costs that can and do exclude (most) people, it’s living hyprocracy, and an excellent example of capitalism corrupting grass roots ideals. honestly is an absolute joke of a festival.
There is a similar thing not far from where I live. Through an unlucky friend, then the neighbour of their festival grounds, I got to discover the organizers’ ‘ideals’ and ‘ethical and ecological approach’ first hand. In short: it was about money. And more money. And they managed to turn a large reservoir into a dying punch bowl of acid, piss and shit within only a decade. I suspect Burning Man to be the same, considering the ticket prices. The fact that some poor fools with their heart and soul intact save their little money to visit this monstrosity just makes it more sad.
I don’t actively engage in Schadenfreude much, but I do carry a little of it in my heart. If people think flying or driving very far away for Entertainment, and bringing thousands of people into an otherwise quiet place is okay for the wildlife there, and can be in any way an ecological thing, they have understood very little about ecology. And now also ignored by most: the destruction that happens by the thousands of ‘poor humans who just wanted to have fun’ trampling through the last remnants of life in a drought stricken place.
We are not alone on this planet. Invading a place with our idea of fun is very damaging. We can party perfectly well at home. If home happens to be bleak and sad maybe we should work on that first before invading quiet places.
Just as a counterpoint, the area burning man is held in is one of the most ecologically inert places you could go. There’s no vegetation and the only life to speak of is brine shrimp eggs, which are about as threatened as mosquito larvae.
There’s still a lot of trash that gets left behind which can travel with wind, but as far as impact on the land goes, it’s likely significantly less invasive than your local county fair. There’s just nothing out there for them to damage.
No it doesn’t. Poor as dirt and go almost every year. So many idiots in this thread have no idea what they’re talking about. Just parroting the media.
And yet you spend like Bilbo Baggins?
What if I told you you could be less poor than dirt if you didn’t buy overpriced festival tickets?
Clearly, people who classify themselves as “poor as dirt” should not be allowed to spend money on anything they consider fun.
Clearly, if you can afford $400 for a ticket you aren’t “poor as dirt”. But you go on ahead and decide what my message was :]
the people I knew who went in the past would usually pool money together in order to get all the camping supplies and gas money.
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Because I can go camp somewhere for less than $100?
Lmao I’ve camped for free just by pitching a tent off the side of a secluded road.
I was calculating in gear costs too tbh.
You wouldn’t be at burning man then. It’s obviously a very different experience.
check again it was up to $575 this year
Ive never been to burning man. I went to Coachella a LLOOONNGG time ago when it was hippies rolling around in the dust. Coachella ain’t that anymore, it’s instagram rich kids and tech bros. I assume the same thing has happened to burning man.
Some of the worst people I’ve worked with are “burners”.
There’s apparently a private jet at burning man this year that was taking off and landing constantly so that people could fuck on the jet - it’s fall of Rome style excess in a broken world where most people’s basic needs are not met on an enormous scale.
Your statement is fairly tone deaf to the basic objective reality of the “party”, OP. The frustrated people at the bottom are feeling a bit of catharsis in the money burning factory closing for a day while they starve and watch.
So like “let’s fly on private jets to a nice swiss resort to discuss climate change”
So you think it’s okay to laugh at people dying?
Burners by and large are dipshits, but no one reasonable is laughing at anyone dying.
Hot take: fundamentally, yes. The simple fact that people are dying does not render something unfunny.
That said, no one has died yet (well, one person, but that was ruled unrelated to the flooding).
The fact only one person has died speaks pretty well of their community, actually.
How the fuck do you die because it rained and there’s mud? Hows that make their community look good?
Did you miss all the memes about the billionaire dying in the submarine a couple months back? People like laughing at dark humor.
Generally no, but this episode of tough hippie mudder has been great.
Way to confirm you’re actually as bad or worse than any of them morally. 👍
Judge not least. Splinter and timber. Yeah you do you.
If someone falls asleep inside the giant puppet and they burn him alive with everyone gathered around, I’m sorry but that’s just very funny. Dark, but funny.
Why wouldn’t it be?
aside from the obvious “rich people exploiting the environment with their hippy party that costs $200 for their cheapest tickets,” I saw a video online that brought up a good point that I never considered. The cost of lumber has increased exponentially in the past 3 years alone, jumping to nearly $1700 per 1000 feet at its peak in 2021, but staying between $400 and $600 per 1000 feet in recent months (still high compared to say 10 years ago.) And these people are buying tens of thousands of feet of lumber solely to burn it away in the middle of nowhere where there’s little vegetation to absorb the excess CO2 waste. That, along with the climate change protesters being police brutalized just before the event, really puts a sour taste in people’s mouths. Especially in a time where “once in a lifetime” weather events seem to be back-to-back.
economic data from: https://tradingeconomics.com/commodity/lumber
Tickets cost about 10x that. I was interested back when it was a cool art exchange, freedom event. But SO many people flock to it as a giant party that it’s become restrictive unless your volunteering or bringing an exhibit.
From old burners I have talked to, the entire experience has completely changed. Alcohol used to be frowned upon, now it’s common place.
Sincerely with rocket launches now being a daily thing i’m not very worried by that burning lumber.
Rockets mostly use hydrogen as fuel, burning wood is way more polluting than burning hydrogren.
Also John Wilson tried to go shoot at the event and after compiling hours of footage was told that he couldn’t use any of it because there was some exclusive licensed coverage provider for the event.
And these people are buying tens of thousands of feet of lumber solely to burn it away in the middle of nowhere where there’s little vegetation to absorb the excess CO2 waste.
That’s not really how plants work.
Photosynthesis turns co2 + water into sugar + oxygen. Cellular respiration turns sugar + oxygen into co2 + water.
The total co2 absorbed by a plant is exactly equal to the amount of co2 used to make all the sugar, cellulose, etc. the plant currently has. Digestion, decomposition, fires etc. undo that.
A mature forest or lawn is carbon neutral: new growth is balanced out by decomposition of old growth.
Distance to plants doesn’t matter. What matters is if and how the trees they’re burning are being replanted or replaced. .
Thanks for the correction. That helps me better understand how counteracting pollution works
Yesterday in the US it was labour day, 100 of millions of Americans has a BBQ many using coal and wood the impact of burning man is insignificant in comparison
Burning wood just releases the co2 absorbed when growing it.
What are fossil fuels other than captured carbon from plants and animals from long ago?
Rereleasing carbon is the problem now. Wood being sustainable needs a non-surplus in carbon emissions to begin with.
Everything is “carbon neutral” on a long enough timescale. One of many reasons why that expression is 100% unadulterated bollocks. If you’re an airline, you can’t just offset the damage you do by paying a Bangladeshi farmer two dollars to throw some tree seeds on the ground.
Burning man should become Burried man. Everybody should dig a hole and burry the wood. That is carbon capture.
I am not an expert. So this could just be a naive take. I wouldn’t be surprised burying wood actually amplifies the carbon emissions due to some reactions with soil, or something.
I mean, decomposition releases methane over time, slower than burning does, but buried wood in the desert is more likely to petrify than rot. There’s a lot to be said for burying wood in certain situations. Hugelkultur (making agricultural/garden mounds out of wood and soil) if done right can do amazing things (everything from creating microclimates that increase biodiversity to supercharging the soil with beneficial fungi/bacteria, to increasing water retention).
I would think the biggest pollutant there would be all the fuel.
Getting there and back (and the location could be charitably described as the arse end of nowhere), all the rented RVs with the air con running… Burning a wooden effigy wouldn’t even come close.
Burning Man may be the epitome of the many optimistic and maybe naive qualities of the 90s that were co-opted and exploited in the early 2000s, and turned into the very things they were built to protest against - another being the free and open internet
Yes. I watched it happen. The large number of people that go now pay thousands $$ for a plug-n-play camp and don’t contribute their own art (if they even have art). They are not what the festival once stood for.
Hot take
You know what isnt a hot take? Think how much pollution the event generated, how much greenhouse gases.
Seems worth it for a party lol.
Ha. When I said hot take I meant that you were dead-on with that take. But I’m downvoted all over this thread for suggestion nuance and compassion…so fuck hipsters they deserve it.
Because it’s a festival in the middle of the fucking desert. It’s an utterly ridiculous place to have it and totally extravagant.
They’ll go there claiming there to be going I to some kind of getting away from civilisation, hippie commune thing but the amount of effort and infrastructure to make that environment survivable is ridiculous they actually doing more damage to the environment by being there than if they just stayed in the city.
No one’s glad someone died but their death has nothing to do with the ultimate problem of them all being there, and without being too macabre, people die music festivals all of the time, usually because of drugs. Most music festivals are held in a field, where it’s at least reasonably possible to have basic infrastructure without huge expenses of money and effort.
I’ve been to burning man. I sit a little bit on both sides of the fence having not felt like I totally fit in there when I went, but also understanding the original mindset behind it.
At this point, I feel the backlash against Burning Man generally is a bit overblown. These folks are at a festival (yeah burners, I called it a festival because that’s the word we use for such things in the English language) and they’re having a good time. Who cares. Most folks who go have good intentions and just want to connect and share something. Many artists work for years and months, for free, to have their pieces featured. Some of that art is incredible! My favorite parts though were literally just an astronomy camp where I looked through a pretty big telescope, held some billion year old meteor fragments in my hand, and listened to hours of lectures from science nerds about the cosmos. I also watched a magic show and got fed bacon by some drunk guy at his camp at 7 am who just wanted company. I personally havent drank at burning man, but it is a party. There are all manner of things at burning man, anything you might want and some things you might not… from talks on how to build a sustainable green energy house to orgy tents to camps offering free ice cream and French toast.
On the other hand, burners can take this shit a bit too seriously and get wrapped up in the experience to the point of being annoying. One guy in my camp scolded me for asking too much about his normal life. He was a tech worker and apparently wanted to pretend that he wasn’t when he was at burning man. How ridiculous to think standing in the desert should mean you can’t talk about your actual life. Another time I pulled out my camera (aka phone) to take a photo of some art and some random chick yelled at me to put my phone away. As if we all bought DSLRs and Polaroids for this event because it’s more authentic that way, and as if the folks that did totally aren’t going to go home and put it on Instagram anyway. There were plenty of women just posing on the playa for their photographer “friends.” I doubt they all just put them in a family photo album for the memories.
That said, Burning Man is a unique event and most folks are just trying to share and view some of the most unique art in the world and connect with others. At my age, I generally find most festivals annoying and burning man has plenty of people to be annoyed at, but it is what it is and frankly I don’t know that it deserves more hate than something like Bonaroo or Coachella. At least Burning Man is full of folks trying to be more than mere passive consumers of entertainment. The mandate is for you to be a participant. God forbid you attend an event where you’re asked to do more than consume, but rather give, anything you want or feel others could benefit from.
If there were 10 other events like burning man, I’d say we should look for the best one, but it is the only event like this. That said, as time goes on, it needs to change. Burning the art has to stop, for instance. Also, some of the more snobbish cultural aspects of the event could die off and I wouldn’t cry.
Not sure I’ll ever go back, but its mostly because I’m too old for this shit and seriously get off my lawn. But, I got the idea and, I won’t hate on others who feel drawn to it, unless they’re insufferable.
Well put. I’ve been twice, 25 years ago and 8 years ago. Some aspects are really cool. Burners can also be insufferable, especially when they make it their entire identity IMO. I will never go back either. Also too old for that shit.
Yeah my SOs mom took us and still goes. We aren’t wealthy and usually get discounts. His mom saves up every year for it. The only thing about it I don’t like is how dirty it is and how hot otherwise it’s really fun and I don’t do drugs or alcohol. Fire shooting giant metal flowerbeds and moving castles.
Thanks for your comment, I appreciate it
Aren’t there smaller burning man festivals?
There are many copycats and smaller local versions of the same idea. The idea that it’s the most unique event in the world is marketing BS form the organizers.
there’s definitely a few different ones in Oregon.
Most people don’t even think about burning man at all.
And well, the people of the internet tend to be less fond of more wealthy people, like those that can afford to spend thousands to party in the desert. I may not want them to die just because they went to burning man, but I will laugh at the world essentially raining on their parade.
I don’t get it but ok.
I dislike stupid shit that wealthy people do. People generally also do not sympathize with a nameless faceless entity. “70k people” is not something I can personally relate to. (As opposed to headlines like “kid with cancer” that normally gets sympathy.)
Additionally, there was all the warning signs this festival was going to be a disaster and people spent thousands of dollars on tickets anyway. Much like the submarine these people have to have someone come help them, which yet again, takes for the form of state resources. Once again, the American taxpayer is footing the bill helping save rich people of all ages from their own hubris.
you dont get why people would not be fans of people that exploit other people and the capitalist system to hoard resources that they then waste in rich people gatherings while normal people arent paying rent?
really?you dont get it?
Most people at burning man aren’t wealthy business owners. They’re middle class professionals who can afford to take a vacation.
LOL
A lot of the time, people hear about Burning Man in the context of which privileged asshole grifter attended it. Elizabeth Holmes, Mark Zuckerberg, Elon Musk, etc other billionaires or influencers… And it is described as “tech bros’ favorite party” in the media.
So, given that impression of it, I can see how the default reaction to it failing is unsympathetic.
All these people making piles of assumptions that if Elon Musk went once, everyone there must be a rich piece of shit, just makes me want to go even more just to spite them.
I know there’s a lot I don’t know about it, but what I do know is that for most who go it’s about art and being free to express themselves. Really strange how much hate people have for something they likely haven’t the first goddamned clue about
So strange to me. I have never been but the people I have met who have gone multiple times and loved it have made me think it’s a force for good.
My first exposure was a wedding I DJ’d, most of the people there were friends of the bride and groom from burning man and they are burned (ha) in my memory as the type of people who go. Even the “pastor” who performed the ceremony. Bride is a travel writer, husband is a doctor. All of the bridal party. Extremely intelligent, kind, funny humble humans all. I played EDM music. Best wedding I ever did.
I think a lot of people who dislike burning man are envious of the glamour and money being flaunted there. Lots of beautiful people, nudity, drugs, money, and partying.
Which I can definitely understand. A lot of people would love to be able to just drop what they’re doing and go walk around a desert playing at steampunk dress-up.
Jealousy isn’t the only reason to feel that way. I don’t trust most rich people, not because I grew up poor, but because I didn’t. And the last thing I want is to watch them cosplay as radical artists, because I know actual radical artists.
Ha… I guess that is what people see. I’ve never seen any firsthand evidence that that’s what it’s like. And there are a lot of dumb frivolous events based around motorcycles, airplanes, firearms, super heroes. I think they are dumb but would never laugh if their event got ruined.
Well far be it from me to judge anyone at a music festival but I think for many burning man has some bourgeoisie, fake hippie sorta connotations?
Yep, exactly my confusion…this makes it ok to take joy at what happened? I think the perception is wrong but even if not…it’s fucked up.
When leftists say eat the rich they don’t mean it in a nice way.
Are burning man people rich? Not being a smartass, I’m just trying to understand the perception.
Higher up you were talking about a travel writer marrying a doctor. Those motherfuckers are rich.
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I don’t take joy in suffering of anyone. My only experience of the Burning man festival is on the hilarious episode of “Malcom in the Middle.” Also, rain in the desert is often a mixed blessing
I always think of the Reno 911 episode, that was hilarious as well.
Generally, they’re not. I’d say it’s an inclusive crowd that likes to backbite each other. I don’t particularly love burners, but this level of distain is ridiculous. A lot of art collective types and their patrons.
who me? i’m just a poor lower class fine art patron.
Not really what I’m saying. If you don’t know the type, you don’t know the type. Bunch of fire spinners and Etsy sellers working middle class jobs.
Appreciate the reminder
You should have your mom check your house for lead paint.
Oh look, I see you gettin a little sass there now 😚 Don’t make me come over there and spank you
Nuance is a dead concept to an online leftist.
Catch em at a bar and they’re generally better versions of themselves.
I think - correctly or incorrectly - a lot of people perceive the typical Burning Man attendee nowadays as being a rich and/or famous person who is somewhere between indifferent to + amused by the suffering of other people less fortunate than they. And - again, not saying this is correct - they perceive this as being more of an annoying/inconvenient/uncomfortable thing (lots of wallowing in filth, but only 1 death AFAIK) than a bona fide natural disaster; totally different order of magnitude from what just happened in Florida, for example, or Hawaii.
So it’s less serious than a hurricane or flood or whatever in a populated area, and affects much more deserving people; if, heaven forbid, a bomb went off and hundreds of Burning Man attendees died it would be a very different story, and certainly in that case I don’t think any decent person would laugh about it, but a bunch of rich assholes stuck in the mud playing “Survivor” for a week is much more farce than tragedy.
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I actually think a lot is the opposite. If you think an event like this, attended by the likes of Bezos and Musk, is countercultural, or even “brings positivity into the world”, I have a beautiful bridge in Brooklyn to sell you. Of course most Burners have jobs, it’s a techbro’s dream. Plus, tickets are more expensive than they were in the old days, so real hippies can’t go. If people want to laugh at the suffering of rich people who cosplay as revolutionary, I’m generally ok with that. One big caveat: I’m very sorry someone died, and I don’t think mocking that’s cool, especially if we don’t know anything about them.
The richest people on earth attending doesn’t actually mean a single goddamned thing about it. Other than they want to be seen as “cool”…
Well, I guess we strongly disagree.
I’m sure billionaires have once enjoyed every activity you love, which if you were to be consistent, somehow taints all the things you enjoy. Very weird to think that way
An event isn’t an activity. And yes, if an event I loved turned into a meeting place for those people, I’d find a new event.
If Elon Musk and I both enjoyed cycling, for instance, fine. That doesn’t put me in the same space as him. Which is fundamentally different than going to a weeklong party he’s attending. Have your fun, just don’t pretend it’s revolutionary or creating a better world.
It’s just a playground for the riche to do a music and drug festival pretend poor style. Or maybe it has something to do with a bunch of those hippies that nearly killed climate protestors blocking the road on their way in.
Every Burner I’ve ever met has been one of the most entitled, out of touch, morons I’ve ever had the displeasure of talking to. Let’s see where their “radical self reliance” gets them now.
I guess I grew up some next level poor, the only person I’ve known that went to burning man was the son of the owner at a place I worked. He wasn’t that entitled and moronic.
The CEO of one of my companies clients goes there and he’s an awful awful person.
Completely unprompted he once said that he was a liberal, but he had to vote conservative because the poorer people in society need the conservatives. So he wasn’t even prepared to actually own being an asshole.
And then he goes to a place like that and claims he’s going back to nature or some shit, all so he can morally self-justified having a stick up his arse the rest of the time.
I was unemployed both times I went lol. Do people not know about low income discounts?
Low income discounts for festivals, definitely not. I’ve never been aware of anything like that.
The principles are a solid foundation but can be taken for granted depending on income or association. The community is spurred from the principles but still has entitled participants :/ Interesting exercise
Fuck these rich twats
Apparently middle class Americans are now “rich twats”?
It’s mostly rich twats with a few upper middle class twats.
middle class Americans.
Not a thing
Say it louder for the libs in the back
Something ‘middle class’ Americans may want to notice:
When people are living in abject poverty, you are comparatively ‘rich’.
Anger at the ‘rich’ is at an all time high.
The ‘true rich’ are out of reach of the poor.
As income inequality grows, this will get worse.
i dont care what happens to rich people
Most of them aren’t rich. They’re middle class. The only reason you think most of them are rich is because of how a lot of the middle class has fallen into poverty. Don’t tear down the people that are still truly middle class.
The truly wealthy are a problem, but they’re a minority at burning man.
It’s all relative. If the poor have gotten poorer, then the “almost rich”, just by virtue of hanging on to their wealth, have edged up into “rich” territory
Sure, if you want the extremely rich people who actually made you poor to write your narrative for them. Save your anger for the people who actually suppress wages and equity. Not people who just managed to carve out a middle class life by doing some job. Middle class people and poor people are much much closer in wealth to each other than middle class and the truly wealthy who rule this country.
I have plenty of anger to go around, there’s no danger of it running out.
Might want to seek professional help for that bud.
It’s a rational response to an unjust world, but more importantly I couldn’t afford professional help in any case. Which is, again, the point.
Rational… yup. No you are just a sad little child that can’t grow up
Why not be angry at other poor people too then? They deserve it as much as the middle class.
No, they don’t.
They do though. Neither one of them deserves your anger. Be angry at the people who actually set up the system that makes you poor. Not the middle class who has as much to blame as the poor.
If you’re spending upwards of $1000 on a few days you’re probably rich.
Or it’s very important to you and you saved all year. What a weird assumption
What the hell. That classifies almost anyone who goes on vacation as rich.
Like a 3rd of the world live in near starvation, objectively if you can afford a vacation you are in the richest 25% in the world.
Have you considered that the majority of people can’t afford to go on vacations? Heck, in the US most people aren’t even entitled to vacations by law. If they want to rest they have to stop working altogether and pray they are accepted back at their workplace when they return and to not have any emergency and their meager savings last for the entire short break from the grind.
Really, some people have no notion of privilege.
It means you’re not poor if you can afford to go on a vacation that costs a few thousand dollars. That’s middle class. People have normalized lowering the standard of living associates with middle class, but being able to spend a few thousand dollars on a vacation is where the middle class should be and used to be.
I’m sure some middle class people can afford to go to burning man. But you’re being wilfully ignorant if you think burning man isn’t catered to the rich. It’s almost purely a status symbol event. It’s definitely where people go to show off their lavish wealth and take pictures for Instagram. I’m pretty sure if they took a survey 80%+ would be wealthy people.
I’m middle class, and I’m spending a couple hundred dollars on my holiday this week, I almost can’t fathom spending thousands living in a tent in a desert.
But you’re right, the middle class has been eroded. What was considered middle class in 1970 would be rich today. That’s just because most people are worse off financially.
Spoken like someone who has no fucking idea what they’re talking about.
Okay, how about this. My anarchist punk middle aged friend who used to go to Burning Man every year stopped going because it was becoming a wealthy shit-show. Not even the orgy dome was enough of a draw to make it worth going.EDIT: I’m not hating on burners, just noting that he observed a change.
Ever heard of budgeting? Saving? Yeah, that’s what people do when they want to take a vacation. Anybody with half a brain can do it. Just takes discipline. Something you clearly don’t have.
If you can afford to set aside such a sum you are part of a group that, going by worldwide averages, is among the richest in the world.
or you could be dumb like me and go into debt to take a trip
Well, how do you define middle class? Is there a certain income bracket that needs to be met? Or is it the middle slice of 3 equally sliced segments of the US population?
The way I always thought about it is if you have to do work for a living you are not rich.
What about those of us who are one step below that?
I’m not salary yet but they’re talking about promotion where I would be required as salary which means -less work but I get paid the same and if there is suddenly more work, no over time.
But it pays more over all. And would even put me in a different tax bracket. I’m not there yet. So am I like, teetering on the edge of rich?
What about the cost of living? My rent keeps going up. I can’t be rich if my rent is taking most of my paycheck can I?
Your blatant classism and lack of normal empathy aside, can you provide evidence that most people at burning man are “rich”?
Because it’s a festival in the middle of the desert that’s celebrating being in the middle of the fucking desert.
In high school I remember some of us were actually very taken with the concept, including myself. But as time progressed, it became obvious that it wasn’t about connecting with nature and self reliance.
Yeah if you can afford $400 tickets, camping supplies, and transportation you’re absolutely a part of the 1% /s
All that you’re doing here is contributing to infighting within your own class, which is what actual rich people want – for you to focus your attention anywhere but on them. Hate the 1% if you want but more importantly demand they be treated like the rest of us.
Hate the 1% if you want but more importantly demand they be treated like the rest of us.
Like let them live with constant financial stress?
No like paying taxes. Like going to jail when they break the law. Like levying income-based fines.
Like being gunned down if you’re a person of color
what are you trying to do here? get to the point or go away
