- cross-posted to:
- politics
- cross-posted to:
- politics
“As the president of the United States, you have power to change the course of history, and the responsibility to save lives right now,” the staffers wrote.
You must log in or register to comment.
Taking from my comment on the other community where you posted this:
Biden asked for one and reported Netanyahu said no.
The headline sounds like he’s just dismissing his staffers
You mean the headline is intentionally misleading to the point of misinforming people?
It’s straight up journalistic malpractice the way they phrased it
Correlation does not imply causation. Just because you misinterpret the headline doesn’t make it wrong.
It doesn’t matter what the intent is here, the headline is misleading, which is poor journalist integrity. Both malice and ignorance can sink a ship.
Intent is irrelevant. Biden’s comment and the staffer’s letter correlate (A relationship or connection between two things based on co-occurrence or pattern of change). It is implied (To make evident indirectly) that Biden is disregarding the wishes of the staffers. If you can’t comprehend this, I can’t help you read gooderer.
It is implied
Someone did the implying, and that’s bad practice. You are correct that intent is irrelevant, yet you take issue with the headline being accused of intentional misinformation.
The thing about implications is that they exists regardless of your intent or your audience’s comprehension. It doesn’t matter if the headline is technically correct, if a significant portion of the audience leaves misinformed, that’s poor jounalism. The extent to which this happens here edges into malpractice, either from ignorance or malice.
Since you take issue with the accusation, you either disagree with the claim of malice or the claim of misinformation; as you reject the former you must disagree that a headline that gives a drastically different interpretation of reality is misinformation. Am I wrong?
It’s called grammar. I didn’t make the rules.
As as a conjunction
The conjunction “as” has several different meanings. We use “as” when one event happens while another is in progress (‘during the time that’). In this case the verb after is often in the continuous form:
“They arrived as we were leaving. (time conjunction meaning ‘while’ or ‘when’)
So I don’t see it as malice or misinformation. I had no no trouble with the headline.
An implication doesn’t need to be directly conveyed, especially in a situation so small as a headline. Implication is often used in headlines to convey more information that explicitly stating everything, and especially to save on word count.
For example: “TITANIC SINKS, 1500 DIE” Purely by literal meaning: A big boat sank, and somewhere at somepoint, many people died of something. Odd to include that people have died before, that’s just a fact of life, but the Titanic was carrying a lot of people, did they survive? Too bad the headline didn’t say, I guess they don’t know yet.
We could look even deeper and conclude that Biden rejected the possibility of a ceasefire specifically because the former staffers demands. I don’t think he’s that spiteful, so it would be an odd interpretation, but it would be fully grammatical correct. Sorry, I didn’t make the
.
As, because and since are conjunctions. As, because and since all introduce subordinate clauses. They connect the result of something with its reason.
As you were out, I left a message.
She may need some help as she’s new.
So I don’t see how a single definition rules out others, as several exist.
“Ok then stop sending bombs and using reaper drones to help them perform mass killings”
“No can do chief, Bibi told me I need to keep doing all that.”
Considering the power that the US has over Israel, he pretty much is just dismissing his staffers.
And that’s the headline. Thanks.
deleted by creator
It’s almost like the US isn’t technically a combatant here.
That makes me feel better, but I wish he would put some weight behind it.
Even if IDF stops shooting, what really makes people believe Hamas will stop? I want an end to the violence as much as anyone else but I really don’t see a cease fire doing anything but giving Hamas time to rearm and plan their next massacre.
And if IDF doesn’t stop shooting like they do now, will the continued escalation make less people flock to anti-israel organization like Hamas? Because all I can see happening is that, while Israel may take over some land, they are just strengthening the support of terrorists.
I assumed people could read past the headline.
I mean… Isn’t the point of the headline to concisely represent the article? That’s the entire reason clickbait is considered bad.
Yes, the information in the article is unimportant because the headline is cumbersome. /s
What the fuck are you talking about?
Be civil
Username TokenBoomer acts full of themselves. Who would have thought?
Username howsetheraven is a scavenger and eats carrion. Who would have thought?
Be logical
Maybe I would be logical if people would stop criticizing the headline and read the fucking article. Wait until they notice the glaring grammatical error in paragraph 3.
And that is a reason to make the headline misleading?
Don’t read the article and remain ignorant then. This is a distraction from the contents.
To be fair, i don’t think Israel is going to do a cease fire even if we yeet all the aid and support we promised them. Netty has been wanting this fight for… ages.
Not too sure on that, US has many ways to force cease fires as good as starting coups.
I think if we had a president and congress that wanted it done, it would be done.
if we had a president and congress that wanted it done, Israel wouldn’t have felt comfortable doing it in the first place, really. I’m just saying at this point, I don’t think there’s a lot we can do. and as for starting a coup… that has never worked out well for the US.
Au contraire, I saw bananas on sale the other day for just 59 cents.
Considering how well those coups worked out, I’d really like for that sad chapter of US history to stay history, as much as I despise Bibi’s reactionary government.
Someone remind me when the next election is for Israel.
Well, IMO the coups did what was required, same in latin america.
It stopped the political party that was going to rule and chaos would ensue.
Due to party plans of interfering with US corporations and allies.
They did meet short term goals but the long term blowback is indicative that it’s not worth it from a cold strategic perspective even when not factoring in the ideological hypocrisy
Oh, okay.
I think I understand a bit of what you are saying.
Thanks!
Well, if we yeet all the aid we send them, at least we won’t be facilitating a genocide in as many ways.
That’s a start and a step worth taking.
Keep in mind, part of the reason we’ve given all this aid to Israel, historically, is precisely for that leverage it gives us.
People are rolling in their graves that we’re not using it.
Let’s stop all aid to Israel and go from there.
In all honesty, if this wasn’t serving as a proxy war that might have been possible, but I think with China, Iran, and Russia squaring up to support Palestine there’s no way we’re going to cut off Israel. From a big picture perspective Israel is the only real ally the US or western powers have in the middle east and even if we dumped them for the crimes they commit it would ultimately hurt the US and western powers to abandon or sanction them.
I saw an article saying that Belgium is considering sanctions against Israel, but Belgium is also a NATO country and only has 24k active troops with an additional 6k in reserves. In 2022 Belgium had the third lowest % GDP military investment out of the NATO countries.
Whether we like it or not the big players in the game aren’t looking at the atrocities Israel commits in Gaza, they’re looking at whether they will have a foothold and ally in the middle east if we have a World War.
We as individuals can take a stance on the conflict without considering the geopolitical outcomes, but to be able to do so we should admit that we are in a place of privilege. I imagine that if news came out that Ukraine blew up a school Poland still would still support Ukraine, because they’re right next door.
At the same time, countries which don’t meaningfully contribute to their own defense should recognize their privilege when it comes to the world stage.
EDIT: Had accidentally called Ukraine Russia, fixed now.
Ok but I’d really like to see our government try to make demands or ultimatums
Agreed.
Just because a thing is hard doesn’t mean it shouldn’t be done. I’m just a realist. They won’t stop until the hardliners on both sides are gone.
deleted by creator
But BiBi promised I could have ice cream and stay up late, he cant say no now 😿
Stopping the aid might not stop him but heavy sanctions definitely would.
And even if he didn’t want the fight, a ceasefire now would destroy his coalition, being down the government , remove him from power, and probably end up with him personally in prison from the outstanding corruption allegations
This was reported for having a misleading headline, however the headline on the post is the exact same as the headline on the article.
I agree, the headline makes it sound like Biden was addressing the “500+ former staffers” when he was not, that’s an issue to take up with commondreams.org.
If OP had editorialized the headline in a misleading fashion, I’d remove it. In this case they are accurately passing along the headline from the article.
Consider the quality of sources allowed to be posted to the community. Some sites are bad, and it’s okay to filter them out in the interest of quality.
We have talked about that, and commondreams.org has a high credibility rating and is allowed to be posted here:
That’s helpful, thank you. I take issue with their headlines is all.
deleted by creator
The articles themselves are fine. I just take issue with the editorialized and biased headlines. It’s a bias I agree with though so I don’t exactly have a list of examples.
deleted by creator
I asked them to consider it and was told that they had already had this discussion and decided to allow it because they’re credible. Pretty simple
That doesn’t mean you can’t remove the post because the article headline is misleading, it’s just that the blame lies on the site rather than OP.
Our policy is that the headline must match that of the article, so any problem with the headline should be directed at the people writing it.
Leaving the post drives the discussion of how and why the headline is misleading, which is in and of itself a valuable conversation.
In just over a month, Israeli bombing has killed nearly 11,000 people in Gaza and displaced more than 70% of the territory’s population.
Jesus wept.
Removed by mod
Surprised it’s not higher. Gaza’s government has spent $0 on defensive technologies. Zero radar installations, zero anti-aircraft weapons, zero SAM, zero bomb bunkers.
I mean every time they and repair anything… but I’m not supposed to talk about that, that’s antisemitism. /s 🤮
What everytime they repair something they can’t help but execute a little slave raid?
deleted by creator
Probably not as bad as the establishment funded tpm.
Eta:
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/common-dreams/
Detailed Report
Bias Rating: LEFT
Factual Reporting: HIGH
Country: USA
Press Freedom Rank: Mostly Free
Media Type: Website
Traffic/Popularity: Medium Traffic
MBFC Credibility Rating: HIGH CREDIBILITYAbout the same:, so my mistake. https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/talking-points-memo/
Don’t like the facts, attack the source. Way to limit yourself.
deleted by creator
deleted by creator
Then post them, so I can complain about your source. /s
Really living up to your username there, sport.
Back in my day we didn’t call people “sport.”
I’m a millennial, my gen X dad calls my brother “sport”
These days, we block obvious trolls. Buh bye.
How do you block yourself? Is that a script?
Yeah. Israel needs land. A ceasefire would prevent that.
They want land. Land that is currently occupied by someone else.
It’s how their “settlements” have been established and expanded for decades.
Imperialists thinking they can puppeteer another imperialist. Maybe they’re right who knows.
Damn looks like there is ‘No Possibility’ that I will be voting for that cuck ever again.
Yeah, I’m sure Trump will do a much better job! /s
You weren’t going to in the first place. ‘Cuck’ gives you away
not sure what you think that gives away, lol.
That you’re a child?
damn looks like you and a lot of people are really triggered that I don’t want to vote for someone who is enabling genocide
His opponent will end the war in 24 hours! But you probably won’t like how he ends it…
God help me, I watched part of the GOP debate the other night, when asked what they would tell Netanyahu, they were all super eager to gove some variation of, “finish the job” neglecting to clarify if they meant Hamas or Palestine. I’m surprised none of them slipped and suggested a final solution. Sorry, but if you don’t like Biden, you really aren’t gonna like these folks take on it.
Of you can’t tell, they meant Palestine.
If he ends up as the dem candidate, you’d be an idiot not to
We would be idiots to run him again. He barely scraped by electorally last time (sadly the popular vote does not matter)
@BluJay320 yup. That’s how we got that orange idiot the first time. And this time he actually has a viable plan to destroy democracy.
He talked to Netanyahu, Netanyahu refused a cease-fire. What specifically do you think he should be doing?
Pull support from Israel.
Removing guns or nukes even doesn’t stop familicide, if you’re hell bent on war and displacement like Benny boy, then don’t expect God or his good things lol
About the genocide? The most you’re willing to demand from you government is that they ask their client state to stop doing genocide? Sanctions, pull all aid, condemnations, anything. They’re slaughtering civillians by the thousands.
deleted by creator
We give them billions of dollars per year in cash and weapons. This blood is on our hands because American taxpayers are funding every bomb. Also “unilaterally” just wouldn’t be true. The overwhelming majority of the international community would also like the genocide to stop.
I think you should deeply reflect on how evil your last sentence reads considering the circumstances.
Read the letter from the staffers to find out.
Well have to see if the Annoying Orange rises up as candidate again.
State polls show he is tied or winning in some cases over biden.
When certain two unnamed 3rd party people are included, numbers shift in an interesting way.
For biden to win, polling needs to be couple points higher, not just tied.
One year out, so… will be interesting to see how well polling works this time around.
Remember this blood is on the hands of anyone who voted for him and would vote for him again.
Genocide is Biden’s legacy, hope it was worth saving “democracy”.
Your downvotes are a witness against you and do not absolve you of your guilt.
Sorry to disappoint you, but if the president was Trump or any other Republican your government would have been even firmer behind Israel, so it is a choice between a bad and a worse president.
Hell we would probably have deployed troops to Gaza and also to stand by in case of actions from Iran, Egypt, Lebanon, or Syria.
Whataboutism.
Nope. Cold hard truth to your fucking pathetic attempt at putting Netty’s bloodthirst on Biden. You are beyond pathetic and frankly beyond stupid.
You’re in denial.
So you think Trump would have been a better choice in this situation?
Leninists, don’t think. It’s anathema to them. That’s how we get here. More anti west than anything else. Including socialist. Not that leninists were ever socialists.
Oh, is that what they are?
Why can’t they just stay in hexbear or lemmygrad with the rest of them? Much easier to filter
I certainly did not vote for Netanyahu.
But you voted for the guy who has been friends, worked with, and politically supported a Right-wing, ethnonationalist for over 40 years.
That you apparently have the privilege to not be affected by the consequences of a Republican government doesn’t invalidate the choices of those who would be, and voted accordingly.
We are all complicit in the same way we are all complicit for the war crimes committed by America in the Middle East: most of us did not have a choice in the matter whatsoever. All we can do is demand them to stop.
I’m not going to judge someone whose choices are “genocide” and “genocide even more, and even more local genocide” and picks the former.
On the contrary, you are displaying the tremendous privilege of living in the imperial core by being able to choose between “‘genocide’ and ‘genocide even more, and even more local genocide’” and justify literally voluntarily voting to choose genocide in order to make yourself feel more comfortable within the imperial core.
True fascism taking power in the US means that I and the people around me will be murdered. But I don’t feel the ethical apathy to be able to coldly prefer international genocide of others to keep myself safe at home all the while pretending like I saved the freedom for the entire world as children and whole families are being murdered. Biden is not the progressive savior all of you claimed he was, now at least you admit you chose “genocide”—which I do, and history will, judge harshly.
If you choose to vote for him again after this, you will consciously approve of genocide and be all the more guilty.
Removed by mod
ok
Biden did not cause the problems in Gaza, what are you on about? He’s not the one in charge of Israel’s actions. I am not a fan of him or a fan of sending aid to them, but this is just overdramatic.
On top of that, if people didn’t vote for Biden then we would have Trump doing the same plus a bunch of other worse shit on top of that. We have two choices everytime. All people can do is vote for the lesser of two evils and that’s what they did. If you wanna throw away your vote and help the objectively worse party win a presidential election again, that’s on you, but most sensible people understand the choice we are forced to make thanks to our shitty system.
Biden did not cause the problems in Gaza, what are you on about? He’s not the one in charge of Israel’s actions. I am not a fan of him or a fan of sending aid to them, but this is just overdramatic.
No, he’s just the one supporting funding and arming Israel no matter what they do for decades and voting for him continued to enable Israel which inevitably led to this moment we’re at now.
On top of that, if people didn’t vote for Biden then we would have Trump doing the same plus a bunch of other worse shit on top of that. We have two choices everytime. All people can do is vote for the lesser of two evils and that’s what they did. If you wanna throw away your vote and help the objectively worse party win a presidential election again, that’s on you, but most sensible people understand the choice we are forced to make thanks to our shitty system.
Whataboutism.
Whataboutism.
the technique or practice of responding to an accusation or difficult question by making a counteraccusation or raising a different issue.
The choice to vote for Biden is linked to the choice to vote against Trump. They can not be separated from one another. To do so is to be disingenuous. We live in a democracy with a two party system. The Republican party is disproportionally represented by our electoral system and win with low voter turn out.
Since we can not separate the choice of voting for Biden and rejecting Trump, it is justified to bring up what Trump and the Republicans would do. If we want any chance of the US demanding a ceasefire then we need to reject the Republican party who will blindly support Israeli no mater what.
You got what you voted for then. A whopping 4-hour daily ceasefire.
Thanks for voting!
I also avoided another disastrous four years under Trump. I can live with the choice to vote for Biden because everyone in the world will be worse off under Trump. So, you’re welcome.
Yeah, it could be worse for those maimed Palestinian kids. They could be dead, like those other Palestinian kids. Great trade.
Trump would have enabled and emboldened Israel’s government to kill more Palestinians. That would have been a worse outcome. There is no such thing as rock bottom. It can always get worse.
Not voting for him again directly enables a guy that would do so much worse. Your stance lacks any understanding of the limits to our voting system.
How could it be worse than genocide for Palestinians?
Removed by mod
Israel could genocide all 2.2 million people living in the Gaza Strip, all 3 million people living in the West Bank, the 1.6 million Palestinian people who live in Israel, the 5.5 million people living in Lebanon and get into a massive conflict in the Middle East where they end up using nuclear weapons.
Oh, and Trump could deport the 225 thousand Palestinian people living in the United States so Israel can genocide them too. Or just do it here in America. The Republicans will almost certainly streamline the death penalty and turn America’s mass incarceration system into death camps.
More whataboutism. Trump isn’t the President overseeing and providing cover for the genocide right now and Biden hasn’t helped in undoing neither the inhumane incarceration system nor the camps (‘migrant detention centers’) already underway in the US.
But I asked you what could be worse than genocide, and you responded by saying genocide. So, nothing can be worse than genocide? Great, then we are well on our way.
Even if it isn’t completed now, Biden has been more than helpful to the far Right colonizers in Israel by enabling this and setting precedent for whenever they wish to continue. Democrat or Republican, it doesn’t matter, Israel has validity now to continue genocide. And Democrat or Republican, it doesn’t matter, voters like you have spoken—support is unconditional, let genocide continue.
Where do you draw your line? How many murdered Palestinian families do you find acceptable?
More whataboutism. Trump isn’t the President overseeing and providing cover for the genocide right now and Biden hasn’t helped in undoing neither the inhumane incarceration system nor the camps (‘migrant detention centers’) already underway in the US.
I have already refuted this argument so I’m just going to copy and paste my earlier response.
Whataboutism.
the technique or practice of responding to an accusation or difficult question by making a counteraccusation or raising a different issue.
The choice to vote for Biden is linked to the choice to vote against Trump. They can not be separated from one another. To do so is to be disingenuous. We live in a democracy with a two party system. The Republican party is disproportionally represented by our electoral system and win with low voter turn out.
Since we can not separate the choice of voting for Biden and rejecting Trump, it is justified to bring up what Trump and the Republicans would do. If we want any chance of the US demanding a ceasefire then we need to reject the Republican party who will blindly support Israeli no mater what.
But I asked you what could be worse than genocide, and you responded by saying genocide. So, nothing can be worse than genocide? Great, then we are well on our way.
The collective punishment we are seeing now is the start of genocide. It is not the full genocide. The difference is millions of people. There is no credibility to an argument that refuses to acknowledge this difference.
Even if it isn’t completed now, Biden has been more than helpful to the far Right colonizers in Israel by enabling this and setting precedent for whenever they wish to continue. Democrat or Republican, it doesn’t matter, Israel has validity now to continue genocide. And Democrat or Republican, it doesn’t matter, voters like you have spoken—support is unconditional, let genocide continue.
No Trump would be worse. He was the one who moved our embassy to Israel. He is the one who is going to destabilize the situation further. Half of the Democratic party wants a ceasefire. Republicans want unconditional support for Israel. Have you ever watched or read fox news? The difference between the parties becomes quite clear, very quickly.
Where do you draw your line? How many murdered Palestinian families do you find acceptable?
You can’t guilt someone into enabling fascists. It doesn’t work. Think about all the people the Republicans are going to get killed. It’s not equivalent.
Whataboutism.
the technique or practice of responding to an accusation or difficult question by … raising a different issue.
Who raised the issue of Trump or the Republican Party when I discussed Biden?
We live in a democracy with a two party system.
Do you still feel it is a democracy worth defending by approving genocide when the choice is a fascist-enabler and a fascist?
No Trump would be worse. He was the one who moved our embassy to Israel. He is the one who is going to destabilize the situation further. Half of the Democratic party wants a ceasefire. Republicans want unconditional support for Israel. Have you ever watched or read fox news? The difference between the parties becomes quite clear, very quickly.
Whataboutism. It’s obnoxious when it isn’t being used against your opponents, right?
You can’t guilt someone into enabling fascists. It doesn’t work. Think about all the people the Republicans are going to get killed. It’s not equivalent.
I haven’t supported any fascists. The Democratic Party, on the other hand, was the one who guilted you into enabling fascists. Netanyahu has gone mask-off fascist and the Democratic Party guilted you and others into voting for Biden who has been enabling Netanyahu for decades, and continues to do so now. How many people have to be murdered for you to stop supporting Biden? Do you feel any guilt or shame for voting to empower Biden who shipped weapons and sent money to Israel to bomb children and their families?
Who raised the issue of Trump or the Republican Party when I discussed Biden?
Multiple people did. It’s not whataboutism if the issues are linked. Which they are.
Do you still feel it is a democracy worth defending by approving genocide when the choice is a fascist-enabler and a fascist?
This statement is not based in reality. Trump is a fascist and fascist enabler. Biden is not.
Whataboutism. It’s obnoxious when it isn’t being used against your opponents, right?
It’s not a whataboutism if the issues are linked. Which they are.
I haven’t supported any fascists. The Democratic Party, on the other hand, was the one who guilted you into enabling fascists. Netanyahu has gone mask-off fascist and the Democratic Party guilted you and others into voting for Biden who has been enabling Netanyahu for decades, and continues to do so now. How many people have to be murdered for you to stop supporting Biden? Do you feel any guilt or shame for voting to empower Biden who shipped weapons and sent money to Israel to bomb children and their families?
It’s a two party system. Republicans win with low voter turn out. By not voting for Biden you are helping Trump. It’s just math. You can’t guilt people into supporting a fascist like Trump.
Removed by mod
All right, but this doesn’t make you any different from Trump supporters that Democrats love to accuse of (mostly correctly) being fascists.
The problem with you feeling like this critique makes you defensive and want to just go for the easy option is that there is always another option that you could do but it seems like it’s impossible for it to dawn upon you people. It’s either genocide or worse genocide. No other choice. But it’s also totally a functioning democracy worth defending, unlike those other bloodthirsty authoritarian regimes.
If you can’t figure out another option or don’t support it or think it’s impossible because it’s difficult so might as well not do it, then continue doing as you are but, yes, be aware there is blood on your hands and you are acting as a fascist supporter at best.
Removed by mod
