Come to think of it, the Jedi are kinda dicks, they prevented anakin becoming a master despite his obvious talented skills in saber combat and his power in the force.
Not to mention, lore wise they let mundi have relations with his family where as it would’ve been a kick out for anakin.
Lastly, the jedi were sorta arrogant for thinking that nothing was wrong or that they were perfect despite having literal counterarguments from rebellious masters, Qui Gonn being a good example of somebody smelling the bullshit that the jedi were involved in.
So my fellow sith lords and jedi knights, what say you?
The Jedi code teaching students that emotions are dangerous, is about as useful as teaching abstinence in sex ed.
Stop teaching people to ignore attachments and focus on dealing with them in a healthy way instead.
He clearly proved that he wasn’t ready to be a master - it’s not like a martial arts rank that you mostly just get because you’re skilled, they also want you to be able to embody the ideals they stand for (flawed as they may be).
They certainly could have trained him better, but that makes them idiots, not assholes. But first and foremost, their most important failure was not detecting that Palpatine was a sith.
Mundi had a special exemption because his species was going extinct, and it was always supposed to be about attachment anyway - it’s plausible that Mundi was able to produce offspring without personal attachment. Anakin could never have done it like that.
Martial arts ranks aren’t even all about skill. Typically getting to a black belt or equivalent is done by skill demonstration but raising ranks after that is more community involvement, school upkeep, teaching, etc.
i think the fact he was turned so easily proves he shouldnt have been trained to the extent he was. that single failure caused the eventual death of millions
Yeah, the jedi were wrong, but the facts really point to “they were wrong to be so lenient”. Sure, if they’d let him become a master he might have had a bit more loyalty. But anakin was already too enslaved to his emotions, and even if they made him a master and condoned his relationship with padme, something else would be the spark that sideous used to turn him.
He trained from what, 8 years old until 20? They could have taught him to deal with emotions healthily instead of just saying “emotions bad, Jedi good”. There’s plenty of real-life examples of troubled people becoming healthy with the love and support of their family
Yes, but if all Jedi are trained the way described, do any of the masters know how to deal with emotions?
So yes, they are all assholes.
He was turned by the guy who turned Count Dooku, who was already an old man when it happened. Anakin never stood a chance.
Yeah he should just have turned off, on his mother…
I’m with OP 😅.That’s a good plot, but also ridiculous, transposed on a IRL situation.
I’ve always considered, seperate to this larger discussion, that the Jedi are saying one thing and believing another uncritically. They want to bring balance to the force… By eliminating the sith.
Balance. A state of equilibrium. Notoriously not very well known for existing in a system where one of two elements has been removed.
“Only a sith deals in absolutes”. Complete unthinking hipocracy in the name of the light.
yea, the jedi were ideological conservatives.
and that meme where Qui-Gon jinn brings back both Anakin and his mom instead of just Anakin?
is a very legitimate point.
the Jedi council chose to keep a jedi’s mother in slavery instead of reuniting their family, freedom which would have come at a truly insignificant cost to the council.
If you want to get all philosophical (which is probably a bit too far, it’s George Lucas after all), you could make the argument that the downfall of the Republic is an example of a complacent, non-responsive governmental elite failing to react or even just recognize obvious problems.
The Jedi are just warrior monks and symptomatic for that. They didn’t bring her with them, because they don’t care about people that much. They are above the population and act more like demigods.
this is exactly my argument.
I completely agree with everything you’ve written and I even suspect George does, despite his disinclination to discuss it.
a complacent aristocracy hoisted by their own failing traditions and impotent bureaucracy.
100%
The Jedi weren’t “good” they were the absent of evil and that will never be enough for a just society because evil will exploit it eventually.
Yeah the point of the prequels was that they weren’t innocent. They had grown complacent, and solely focused on tradition instead of thinking about the actual Jedi values. Anakin was right, but didn’t know the way to fix it and instead followed the sith.
He didn’t follow the Sith so much reject the Jedi as not good so went down the only path to gain power to do the greatest good he could think of: save Padme
Like, there’s obviously real world parrells, but when the “good” option actively prevents people from doing good in the pursuit of perfect balance, some people will go to the side that doesn’t care how you use your own personal power. Because you can rationalize that it won’t corrupt you.
Being a master isn’t just about skill, it’s also about wisdom and experience, perhaps even more than skill. It’s perfectly reasonable that they wouldn’t want to elevate him to that rank yet, given his behavior.
+++ They fucked up many things during the clone wars/prequel period of time, and suffered from hubris and arrogance no doubt. But they were right about that one thing.
Jedis are a cult. They want to bring peace but basically hold power and a hierarchical order, and don’t plan on questioning it. Funny because that also was an issue of the Sovietic Party.
AJAB?
Everyone in that story is basically an asshole.
They’re all somewhat sympathetic. But yeah, the Sith suck, but so do the Jedi. This was also kind of emphasized in the Acolyte. But even before that, yeah, if you look at the prequels the Jedi were kind of dicks.
In a way, they did cause the fall of their own order just because they had bad vibes about Anakin instead of actually guiding him to not turn out the way they sensed. Seems a bit dickish to shun a dude just because the possibility that he turns out evil instead of, you know, teaching him not to be evil.
Luke ends up doing the same damn thing in the sequels. Scares the fuck outta his nephew which drives him to evil all because he had an intrusive thought and pulled out his lightsaber.
Somehow the entirety of the most messed up shit in the movies boils down to overreactions to perceived threats, while the very real threat sits back and consolidates power.
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Dude, you ok? If downvotes harsh your vibe, yeet them out the window and move to an instance that doesn’t do downvotes. The one I’m on, for example, and I assume others. From my perspective, I have zero downvotes on any comment or post ever.
Not really okay, family is visiting and has destroyed my routine. It super depressing to feel excluded even in the house where I live, and there is a whole bunch of other stuff behind that too. RN I really wish I hadn’t survived the crash that disabled me. I just stay closed off in my room or I go do things that hurt me, and hear all the stories about people’s lives playing out while my story is always the same. All I can do is here, talk to AI or game. I’ve got meds to pacify serious issues and the self awareness to know when to use them, but that will just make me a brain dead zombie for a few weeks or so which is also a depressing reality. I really just need positive engagement and to be able to say whatever casual thought crosses my mind.
I don’t see the down votes unless they cross below zero. But yeah, they have an impact. They do for everyone to some extent. Most people have other social outlets that alter the meaning of their habits and perspective. Some people do not have that luxury.
Blåhaj Lemmy has no downvotes and it’s been surprisingly amazing for my mental health.
