We could kiss each other on the mouth.
Pwomise? 👉👈🥹
It’s actually really super simple. You would be subject to the laws of the country you reside in or are a citizen of.
Laws don’t magically stop working just because you’re out of jurisdiction.
There’s also, admiralty law, Maritime law and international law, all of which have courts in designated countries. These laws are usually governed by treaty amongst many countries.
Laws don’t magically stop working just because you’re out of jurisdiction.
Actually I would say that most do. Extraterritorial jurisdiction is the exception, not the rule. Many countries apply it for cases of Genocide and War Crimes for example.
You are right though that many countries apply their laws to vessels under their flags in international waters
What about cruise ships and their changes to gambling when in international waters? I’ve read quite a few times that the rules their machines work with change dramatically in that case. And they’re mostly still registered in countries with more strict rules otherwise.
Provided the above is true of course. Or could they be sued in this case?
How is it that a US citizen, for example, is allowed to purchase and consume alcohol in intentional waters at age 18 when the law is 21 in their country?
Makes sense, thanks!
Legally, you can get away with anything as long as you don’t get caught.
And sometimes even when you do get caught but you’re rich.
This applies to land also
And space!
But not the skies, those belong to the birds.
You can’t take the sky from me!
No power in the ‘verse. But a large billboard out your best window might do it.
That depends. If you declare you are not registered at all that makes you an illegal pirate with no protection at all. If someone else with a yacht decides to sink yours that is probably legal for them - if you fight back they can call their navy to defend them. Regardless of who their yacht is flagged under calling their navy for help probably means they asked the nearest navy (which is almost always the US navy - even if the US hates the country in question the US doesn’t want the seas to be a free for all and will come) to help.
If you become self sufficient out there probably nobody will care and you can be there for years no problem. Just don’t cause problems and nobody really cares. However if you cause problems expect issues. If one person on your yacht steals from another that is your business, nobody will get involved. If someone steals from someone with a country that country will get involved to protect their own. If kids are born on the yacht they might not have a country which could make life hard (particular as the yacht gets old and is no longer safe!). If you have kids born and then sexually abuse them several countries (in particular the US with their large navy) have declared that illegal anywhere and so they will come in to stop you.
The hard part is to become flagless in the first place. What every country you set out from will just assume the boat has their flag by default. They generally won’t let you choose to take it off - they will let you sell it to someone in a different country and then change the flag, but there is nobody with no country who can take ownership of it. Maybe a lawyer can find a work around, but it will not be easy.
Ok the molesting a kid I did not have in mind when asking the question. But your telling me in this day an age that I can still be a pirate? Like if we see another yacht take it over steal everything then sink it. As long as no one is out there on the horizon we are fine? What would happen if I was a US citizen at first flying an american flag out of port then got in the waters changed it to lets say French or something. Would the French take care of me or the US? Also lets say I take one of my lemmy mates and they disappear. Can I just sail back to port and just say fell overboared couldn’t help them? And be scott free?
Pirates are absolutely still a thing. But it’s not Blackbeard and Captain Hook. It’s usually Somali pirates, with a heavy emphasis on the violence.
South Park actually had an episode about exactly this.
In a world of anarchy, you can get away with anything, until someone stronger (i.e. military) shows up.
As for being a pirate. The us constitution allows letters of marque which is permission to be a pirate against specific against vessels of some country. the last one was 1815 so good luck getting one but theoretically you could.
The marine hymn ‘the shores of Tripoli’ refers to a marine battle to stop Libya from issuing letters of marque against us vessels. I believe nealy all old time pirates were registered with Libya operating under a letter of marque and not the storybook idea of stateless ships doing what they want. (anyone enough of a historian to verify)
registration is not about the flag. You are still registered in the us even I you have a french flag up. if you claim to be frence without properly registerng with france (i have no clue how you would do this properly) that is misrepresentation and france would (could) send an internanional warrant to the us and have you arrested since you are still us registered by default.
even if you don’t register with the us you are considered US - you just broke the law by not regestering (paying taxes) and so us law applies.
when a ship is registered in panama there is a company in panama that buys the ship and then because they are a panama company the country that the previous owners were in allows the sale and thus registration. Of course the owners of the panama company are a company in a different country.
I doubt you could find an unregistered vessel. Maybe sealand. If you pirate a registered vessel the navies of the world will hunt you down.
What if you build a ship as opposed to buying one?
Build where? if in us ports the us will cliam it- if you bring stuff out to sea they will claim it because of the stuff.
it comes down to taxes. They want you to pay. Thus they will doeenerything they can to decide it is theirs.
Make a radio station and broadcast whatever you want.
Chopper Dave!!
Your username cracks me tf up lmao
There was a literal pirate radio station in (or technically just beside) the Netherlands, they broadcasted off a ship and because it’s a small country, had nearly national coverage.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_Veronica
They have since become a legal broadcaster.
Rebroadcast Major League Baseball with implied oral consent.
Check out The Boat That Rocked. It’s based on true events from the 1960s.
Top cast:
- Phillip Seymour Hoffman
- Bill Nighy
say no more, you son of a bitch. I’m in.
I remember trying to listen to Radio Caroline under my duvet on an am portable radio as a kid. This film is loosely based on their story. Great cast. Absolute junk film - one of only four films (in any language) I’ve ever switched off before the end… but that’s just my opinion. I hope you enjoy it.
Would be cooler to steal a boat and do this.
A terrific film
Casual Navigation talks a bit about this: What Law Applies In International Waters? Essentially, the ship needs to be registered to a country and the laws of that country apply while on the ship. Most ships register themselves in a country with very lax laws, known as a “flag of convenience”. The laws of Libera, Panama, and Marshall Islands must be pretty convenient since those are countries most ships get registered.
What happens if you don’t register your ship? It’s the same as not having a passport. You’re going to have a hard time when you want to dock at a port.
Libera, Panama, and Marshall Islands must be pretty convenient since those are countries most ships get registered.
The people register ships care about minimum wage (none), taxes (low), and other such things. They want laws about murder in case the staff turns on the company.
Panama is mostly because of cheaper rates to go through the canal, if I’m not mistaken.
But i think there are some crimes that will be prosecuted by your home country anyway, regardless of where the ship is registered. Like if 2 US citizens got on a ship registered to a country where murder is legal, and one killed the other, that person would still be prosecuted for murder when they returned to US soil or any country that has an extradition treaty with the US
i think there are some crimes that will be prosecuted by your home country anyway
It seems pretty rare, but some countries do have laws that essentially apply to citizens, regardless of where they are.
The PROTECT Act is a US law that makes it illegal for any US citizen to have sex with minors, regardless of where in the world it occurs. It’s essentially an anti-sex tourism law. Japan and South Korea warned their citizens that smoking cannabis in Canada will still result in prosecution after Canada legalized it.
Interesting factoid - UK murder law applies to everyone everywhere. Theoretically if an American killed somebody in say Egypt and they later passed through the UK, assuming the UK authorities had the evidence somehow they could choose to arrest AND prosecute the crime (if Egypt didn’t want to for example).
a country where murder is legal
I don’t think there is such a country?
Sure there are. Like in some countries “honor killings” are legal, but that’s called murder in the US
I suppose it depends on where you want to draw the line, even in the US some states have mutual combatant laws where, if you get in a fight with someone and they die, they kinda might not consider it murder. Probably at the mercy of prosecutors/juries I guess but technically it’s a real thing in at least 2 states.
Well....
The US, if you’re a white police officer killing minorities
Lol
Oh, a state monopoly on violence with inadequate oversight is hardly unique to the US but when the government does it, they don’t count it as murder.
“I feared for my life!”
Its not a crime if a white-only jury acquits you!
/s
What if I don’t want to dock at a port? What if I just want to live on a boat in the middle of international waters?
Theoretically, the ship could be seized by the military of any country. Not following international laws means not being protected by international laws.
I hope you brought water purifiers.
Lots of ships have water-makers that turn seawater into fresh water.
Some even brew beer from it. (I tried it on an AIDA cruise ship, it doesn’t taste any different from any other beer.)
I assume you’re generally trading diesel for it though.
Yeah. Maybe solar? But it’s energy intensive. I sort of imagined these hypothetical folks were very wealthy and could afford tenders and the like to bring them food and fuel.
I think you can get away with just about anything, so long as it doesn’t piss off anyone with a bigger navy than you own.
Theoretically, the yacht follows the laws of the place it’s registered. On practice, the country you and your friends live will be the one that cares about it… so, it’s not any different from what you can do at home.
Asking for a Lemmy friend?
I’m not sure but I think you would have to comply with the laws of the yacht’s flag country. Not carrying the flag I think is a big crime basically everywhere
Not carrying the flag I think is a big crime basically everywhere
Hence why flying the pirate flag is a big deal. You’re indicating “no laws here”.
As long as you stay out of any land (+x miles distance), and no one of your people calls for help, you can get away with anything, because nobody is coming to check on you, ever.
God can see you. You better not be committing any sins out there.
I’ll try my best. It is probably somewhat helpful for me that I do not have an appropriate boat.
But regarding these people with their huge luxury boats out there: I am pretty sure that they are doing it for the sole purpose of committing all kinds of sins.
Upvoted to compensate for the two masturbators who downvoted you
We’re assuming they are making a sin live broadcast or recording, for there to be any sort of commenting? Is it like a strange new radical sports event?
Typing too fast again, LOL. I really need to slow down.
“Me got on a yacht?”
Not stealing a yacht!
