Hey Folks!

I’ve been living abroad for over half my life in a country where tipping is not the norm. At most you would round up. 19€ bill? Here’s a 20, keep this change.

Going to the US soon to visit family and the whole idea of tipping makes me nervous. It seems there’s a lot of discussion about getting rid of tipping, but I don’t know how much has changed in this regard.

The system seems ridiculously unfair, and that extra expense in a country where everything is already so expensive really makes a difference.

So will AITA if I don’t tip? Is it really my personal responsibility to make sure my server is paid enough?

  • @[email protected]
    link
    fedilink
    791 year ago

    Yes. You really have to tip. 20%. Sorry. And tax isn’t included in the prices of things. That’s the way things work here and you can choose to spend the whole time being annoyed by it or not. But please don’t make a personal protest that only hurts some of the lowest paid and hardest working people.

    • @[email protected]
      link
      fedilink
      441 year ago

      To be as clear as possible - the minimum wage for tipped staff is $2.13/hr. That’s why you have to tip.

      • Mike
        link
        fedilink
        311 year ago

        This is deceiving though. In The US tipping is literally everywhere now.

        If you are waited on, I. E. Sat at a table or served at a bar, tipping is expected. If you go to a counter and place an order and someone hands you something while you’re standing there, those workers aren’t making 2.13/hr.

        • @Protegee9850
          link
          91 year ago

          No way in hell am I tipping when I pick up food from a counter. Call me an asshole. I don’t care. Blame your boss.

          • @Squizzy
            link
            21 year ago

            This is how the rest of us feel with all tipping, blame your boss why should I pay you

        • R0cket_M00se
          link
          81 year ago

          I don’t tip if there’s no service being provided. Bringing my food to my table after I ordered it from a kiosk and filled up my own drink at the soda fountain doesn’t qualify.

        • @[email protected]
          link
          fedilink
          31 year ago

          And this isn’t universal either. For example, Culver’s will bring your food out to you but you don’t tip. So I would add that if you’re waited on and pay for the meal AFTER eating and being waited on, then you tip.

      • Jake Farm
        link
        fedilink
        181 year ago

        Not true, restuarants have to make up the difference in their wage if they dont make enough in tips.

          • @joe
            link
            101 year ago

            It’s definitely not enough to live on, but that’s beside the point, isn’t it? I don’t tip any other people because they earn minimum wage-- do you? The point is that the person isn’t actually making only $2/hr-- they’re making at least minimum wage, with the opportunity to make more via tips.

            Tipping needs to end, and the laws changed to reflect it.

            • @ch00f
              link
              01 year ago

              Being a waiter is a skilled job that deserves more than minimum wage.

              • @joe
                link
                81 year ago

                I don’t disagree, but that is irrelevant to the discussion, is it not?

                • @ch00f
                  link
                  11 year ago

                  That’s just my response to the argument that you can choose to not tip because waiters will make minimum wage regardless. Minimum wage is not an appropriate salary for that line of work.

                  However, yes, I agree that laws should be changed to remove tipping or at least to require restaurant owners to pay an appropriate wage for the work with optional tips on top for exceptional service.

          • @Today
            link
            11 year ago

            This! My son worked the day shift at waffle house for awhile making about $5/hr in wag+ tips. . I think they have been sued for not paying the difference to employees, but a lawsuit 3 years later doesn’t help when your rent was due last month.

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        English
        151 year ago

        This does depend on which state you’re in (some states don’t have a “tipped wage”), but the vast majority of service workers are not raking in the big bucks, so be generous if you can!

        • @[email protected]
          link
          fedilink
          English
          31 year ago

          Oregon has kind of a hybrid tipped wage. There’s a minimum tipped wage, but if tips don’t add up to at least the regular minimum wage then the establishment needs to make up the tips for the shift.

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        3
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        A higher federal minimum wage would solve this problem. Employers are required by law to make up the difference between the base wage and the federal minimum wage ($7.25/hr) if nobody tips.

        But obviously $7.25 isn’t a living wage either, so any tipped employee that actually makes the federal minimum is living almost entirely on tips.

        https://www.dol.gov/general/topic/wages/wagestips

          • @[email protected]
            link
            fedilink
            31 year ago

            Fair point. And this is why unions are beneficial to the working class, and also why shitty companies like Starbucks try to bust unions.

            • R0cket_M00se
              link
              11 year ago

              Good unions, yeah. Let’s not let the idea of unions in general distract from the fact that they can also suck. Some take too much in dues for what they actually accomplish for their employees, and others can just straight up protect bad people from consequences.

              In fact, police unions are exactly why cops get away with literal murder.

      • @kilinrax
        link
        31 year ago

        Once, in a Manhattan Asian restaurant, our food was 1h45 late and wrong - we were so hungry, we ate it anyway - and I vindictively tipped 5%, so they’d know they fucked up, and I wasn’t some dumb Brit who didn’t comprehend tipping culture.

        My friends legit gasped, like I’d proudly announced I fucked kids or something.

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        21 year ago

        Only if it’s really bad though, and on purpose.

        If it was something the employee couldn’t control or just a generally bad experience that was nobody’s fault, still 20%. Place is swamped and the waiter never gave me a drink refill because they’re the only one on the floor, still 20%.

    • @GrimChaos
      link
      11 year ago

      Serious question. When I was a young kid the baseline tip was 10% and a lot of my life it was 15% and now it’s 20%. Why has the baseline tips been increasing? If prices go up then the tip goes up too, so inflation isn’t the answer. Just curious.

      • @Smallletter
        link
        11 year ago

        Meh, my whole life it 10, when I was in service it was 10. Thus,I still do 10. And no inflation has nothing to do with it since it’s percentage. I don’t see why 20% should be the norm, that’s for like, truly exceptional service. Which I do, when called for.

  • Dandroid
    link
    fedilink
    67
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    Just FYI, we have recently had a huge influx of electronic systems asking for tips in places that tips didn’t exist before. I only tip when I sit down to eat at a restaurant and they serve me. If you walk up to the counter to order, you don’t tip. If you are ordering takeout (even at a sit-down restaurant), you don’t tip.

    It’s a really fucking stupid system that most of us hate, but if you don’t participate, you are the asshole according to our culture (even though we know it’s really the businesses not paying their employees enough that are really the assholes)

    Edit: oh, and then “suggested tip” went up around the same time that these electronic systems popped up. My whole life, a 10% tip was bad, a 15% tip was average. A 20% tip was good. Now it seems the “suggested tip” says you should tip 20% minimum. I think this is bullshit, and I ignore it. The people who are suggesting the tip are the ones that benefit from it going higher. They are always going to try to increase it as long as they can get away with it. I stick to the 10/15/20% rule.

    • kn0wmad1c
      link
      fedilink
      18
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      There’s been a small movement towards going tipless that hasn’t yet caught on because tip culture is primarily backed by greed. Restaurant owners want customers to pay their employees directly instead of providing them with a decent wage.

      I know I’m likely misrepresenting, but that’s the gist as I see it, and until greed goes away everything @[email protected] said holds true.

      • Saik0
        link
        fedilink
        English
        91 year ago

        Restaurant owners want customers to pay their employees directly instead of providing them with a decent wage.

        A lot of employees want this as well. Those who do well in well traveled restaurants or bars then to make WELL over the minimum wage. This is why the employees get mad at the patron/client rather than their employer when they don’t get a tip. It works… it’s what many of them want.

        The sad part is that prices for things have already been going up considerably… So what was a $5 tip @ 10% years ago is now closer to $20 tip @ 20% today for the same meals/amount of food. It isn’t a 2x increase at all… Since it’s % based on subtotal and those costs have been going up… it’s significantly more if you follow their “minimum” percent tips.

        I follow something similar to Dandroid and refuse to change. I only tip for sit-down restaurants where an actual servers brings me my food. If I get shit service, you’re not getting a tip. If it’s basic service, you’ll get 10%… 15% for “good”… 20% for outstanding. Although looking at the laws in my state, I’m debating on cutting it back considerably. Minimum wage in my state is not the $3.and change per hour for those positions. It’s just about $11 and the normal minimum wage is $13 and change. So if I’m the only table in their whole section, and I tip 2$ per hour, they’re making minimum wage. And people here still complain about the tipping… The only explanation is greed… and I can’t stand that at all.

        • kn0wmad1c
          link
          fedilink
          English
          1
          edit-2
          1 year ago

          As I recall, restaurants can get by with giving workers well below minimum wage because of tips.

          EDIT: I just re-read your post

          • Saik0
            link
            fedilink
            English
            21 year ago

            https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/state/minimum-wage/tipped

            This is a great resource when these discussions come up. Many states do NOT adhere to the $2.13 tipped wage.

            In my state (AZ) it’s $10.85. People here still complain about tips. The minimum wage here is $13.85. The $3 difference is nearly guaranteed as long as long as you have 1 table an hour. Forget that the normal where I live is probably closer to 3-4 every hour. [I recognize that other areas may not have such traffic. But I can only comment on what I observe]

            If the average table is leaving ~$5 in tips… you could easily make $30 an hour in wages.

            This is why I say what I say… It’s absurd when I hear local news or something complaining. $30/hr is stupid “livable”.

            • kn0wmad1c
              link
              fedilink
              English
              11 year ago

              My state is listed in the “required to pay full minimum wage” category. Good to know.

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        31 year ago

        “I could do profit sharing and have all my employees benefit from busting their ass, or I could pay them next to nothing and force the customers to supplement their income out of respect or pity.”

        It shouldn’t shock anyone that the practice of tipping has a racist history.

        Please continue to tip service workers.

  • Salamander
    link
    fedilink
    50
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    My view is: I don’t like this cultural element, and I am glad that I live in a country without it. But if I am a visitor from abroad I would not resist the local culture and try to impose my own values. If I am aware of this cultural element and I dislike it, my options would be to either avoid restaurants and other tipping situations as much as I can, or simply account for the tip when making my financial decisions, and pay it.

    If I live in the country then it is different, because then I am more entitled to be a driver of change. Personally, my approach would be to support businesses with explicit no-tipping policy, and to refuse receiving tips myself.

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        31 year ago

        Sort of — there are definitely restaurants which include gratuity, either for all parties or for parties greater than X people (e.g., 5 or more).

      • @Zombiepirate
        link
        21 year ago

        You’re right in that nobody can force you to tip, but it’s part of the unwritten rules for eating at a sit-down restaurant. By not tipping, you’ve said that you don’t care about the agreement you’ve made by sitting at the table.

        It would be like saying “nobody can force you to stop cheating at Monopoly.” While technically true, you’d still be an asshole if you did it, because you’re breaking the unspoken agreement that you made when sitting down to play.

    • @[email protected]OP
      link
      fedilink
      51 year ago

      One of the best answers so far, thanks! I’m not a foreigner, but I’ve been gone for over half my life, so it certainly feels like it. Coming back it always a culture shock.

  • @[email protected]
    link
    fedilink
    47
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    It seems there’s a lot of discussion about getting rid of tipping, but I don’t know how much has changed in this regard.

    Nothing has changed, and it never will, as it concerns poor and “therefore” “deserving” people. Americans’ talk is cheap.

    The system seems ridiculously unfair, and that extra expense in a country where everything is already so expensive really makes a difference.

    Agreed. So when you go to a restaurant and you have a maximum amount you can spend, divide the amount of money you have by (100% + local sales tax), then divide by (100% + the menu price), and subtract any surcharges added by the restaurant (assume $5.00 if you cannot look it up), often masquerading as a tip. I know it’s a lot of math, but you have a computer in your pocket. You’ll manage.

    In my view, the US is a fractal scam. At every level, everything is an attempt to extract money from ill-informed “suckers”, from the running of the government, to the prices of supermarket groceries, to the tipping culture at restaurants, to even finding a place to put your car [1]. Every single thing is someone’s grift. In order to function in America, you need to be willing to be suckered to some extent. There’s no way around it. Unfairness is baked into every transaction, and increasingly more social interactions.

    Everything in America is ridiculously unfair. We wear this on our sleeves, and for many Americans this fact defines their personality. Unfortunately, you will have to deal with it in the short term at least.

    Now if you would like to be the one to lead the charge against the tipping culture and the foisting of responsibility for servers’ compensation onto the customer, then be my guest. Refuse to tip and make a big scene about it. Make plans for how to take the inertia of your big struggle and turn it into a mass movement. I would thrilled to join you. However, I somehow doubt that you’re ready to go that far; none of the customers who stiffed me ever went on to start anti-tipping movements.

    So will AITA if I don’t tip?

    Yes. You are expected by all members of the public here to tip. That is our culture, something we’re proud of for some reason, and our expectation. For some servers, tips are the primary source of income at work.

    Is it really my personal responsibility to make sure my server is paid enough?

    No, it is the responsibility of the employer. However, when no employer takes their responsibility and you sit yourself down at a restaurant, the logical conclusion is that either you pay that part of the server’s wages, or they get stiffed. You know that this is the conclusion. (Or if not, now you do.)

    If you want to participate in our unique restaurant scam, you gotta accept that you’re going to get suckered into paying the server’s wages. Otherwise, don’t go to restaurants. When you go to a restaurant, you waste the employees’ finite time on this planet doing tedious, physically and mentally demanding bullshit that no sane person would choose to engage with, if not faced with the threats of homelessness and starvation. [2] At least make it worth their while.

    Sorry if I come off as having a chip on my shoulder, but that’s only because I totally do. So many customers used to concern-troll me as a pizza delivery person and give me shit like “sorry, couldn’t afford to tip, they should really pay you more.” Yeah, they should, but you absolutely could have tipped; all you had to do was order one less topping. I’d love to see some actual solidarity with food service employees, but that would require challenging deep-rooted assumptions about our culture and we’re too shit-for-brains to do that. Americans are so compassionate and empathetic until the moment they actually have to lift a finger.

    So when someone brings up “unfairness” or “it’s X’s responsibility to pay the workers” in response to tipping, I just kinda die a little inside from all the times those sentiments have been used against me and my colleagues.

    [1] And don’t even get me started on the process of buying a car, or how the public was scammed into accepting a car-centric infrastructure.

    [2] This is really a special case of the logic behind the antiwork movement: nobody actually wants to go to work. We only go to work under the threats of starvation and homelessness imposed by capitalism.

    • @[email protected]
      link
      fedilink
      71 year ago

      the US is a fractal scam. At every level, everything is an attempt to extract money from ill-informed “suckers”, from the running of the government, to the prices of supermarket groceries, to the tipping culture at restaurants, to even finding a place to put your car [1]. Every single thing is someone’s grift. In order to function in America, you need to be willing to be suckered to some extent. There’s no way around it. Unfairness is baked into every transaction, and increasingly more social interactions.

      What a quote. I will add that “we” also like to believe we have the most fair system. And in many ways, the “gotchas” are much more hidden and systemic than other countries. For example, you might be scammed haggling with someone in Southeast Asia, but we get scammed everyday by credit card companies making bank on every single transactions.

    • @[email protected]
      link
      fedilink
      11 year ago

      Such a fantastic statement. I agree wholeheartedly on all fronts and really admired reading the thought process summarized so clearly. You obviously had lots of time to drive and rumenate after getting stiffed but it’s appreciated here.

  • @[email protected]
    link
    fedilink
    341 year ago

    There are already a lot of good answers here, but I thought you might appreciate a fictionalized version of my personal experience.

    Back in the kitchen, the hostess comes in.

    “I’ve got a 2-top at table 23, who’s next in the rotation?”

    “Uh… I think it’s Bob, but he’s busy doing bumps in the walk in. I’ll take it. They nice?”

    “Uhh, I think they’re German.”

    Unfortunately for them, the knowledge that Europeans tend to tip poorly or not at all proceeds them. The server who took the two top will still serve them, but either consciously or subconsciously the service will suffer. Maybe your food was done five minutes ago sitting on the hot line, but your server decided to go chat up the elderly couple or the regular customer instead. Maybe the server is more rude or cold to you than other guests. Or maybe you’re lucky and your server isn’t yet jaded. Your mileage may vary depending on if you’re eating in a small town diner or a tourist hotspot, but even if the service seems fine, there’s almost certainly chatter going on behind your back from the moment you sit down.

    There’s a very small chance that your server will chase after you if you leave no tip, but that is virtually unheard of and will get the server fired if it’s a nicer establishment. The more likely chain of events is that you leave, the server checks the checkbook, then goes into the back-of-house to scream/cry/drink/smoke/fuck someone/something. It’s completely ruined several of my shifts.

    —BUT—

    The above is all wrong. It felt gross to type, and feels grosser to know that I once felt that. These feelings may have been ‘valid’ considering the tipped system that I was a part of, but I have a hard time thinking of them as ‘reasonable’. As an empathetic human, I wish to treat everyone well. Also, I love travel, and would love to spend 30 minutes talking about the Cologne cathedral or the Bielefeld conspiracy or whateverthefuck. But I can’t, because then I’d be actively losing money. The profit motive of tip system makes servers, managers, and even clients all jaded. The anger that I felt when I was stiffed was unjustly redirected from the tipping system to the individual, because the system is designed to perpetuate itself. I make less money now, but I’m very glad I left that industry.

    BONUS: If you want to see a hilarious yet barely over exaggerated vignette of what American servers do and how they think when you can’t see them, give Waiting… (2005) a watch.

  • @[email protected]
    link
    fedilink
    291 year ago

    Yes in the service industry where you will be served you very much likely would be expected to tip. So places may make this more obvious then others with a tip bracket on the receipt or signs somewhere.

    Its also important to note most places in the US expect a 15% tip of what you spent but in some higher dense areas where the CoL is out of control it’s 20%

    • @EyesEyesBaby
      link
      English
      101 year ago

      Do waiters actually get paid? Like an hourly wage? Or do they rely fully on the tips?

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        English
        211 year ago

        The federal minimum wage for tipped workers is $2.13/hr. Basically nothing. It wouldn’t cover your gas cost to go to work in most cases.

        • @EyesEyesBaby
          link
          141 year ago

          Wtf. US at it’s peak. At my first job, when I was 14 y/o, I made more than that (€2.72) doing restocking at a supermarket.

          • @sideone
            link
            18
            edit-2
            1 year ago

            As far as I understand it, US servers prefer the current system as they make more money from tips. Personally, if you prefer this system I think you don’t have any right to complain or get upset if someone doesn’t tip.

          • @[email protected]
            link
            fedilink
            3
            edit-2
            1 year ago

            Wtf. US at it’s peak. At my first job, when I was 14 y/o, I made more than that (€2.72) doing restocking at a supermarket.

            Supermarket stockers are not tipped so a higher minimum wage applies, which is $7.25 right now. However, laborers are also in high demand so most places pay more than the minimum.

        • @[email protected]
          link
          fedilink
          English
          61 year ago

          If their tips don’t pass the actual minimum wage, the employer is required to pay the difference up to the minimum.

      • DarkMatterStyx
        link
        fedilink
        English
        71 year ago

        Servers are paid a sub-minimum wage, as tips are supposed to round out their wages. When I wanted tables my paycheck barely covered the taxes on my cash and credit card tips.

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        English
        11 year ago

        In most HCOL areas there is a higher minimum wage even for tipped workers, so keep that in mind. In DC for example minimum wage for tipped workers is going up annually over the next 4 years to meet regular minimum wage, up to about $17/hr. I anticipate tipping percentages should go down as this phases in as there will no longer be a differentiation.

  • @[email protected]
    link
    fedilink
    271 year ago

    Yes, it does make you the asshole, especially because you know that’s what we do here and why we do it. Until living wage laws are passed, it’s not going to change.

    • @[email protected]OP
      link
      fedilink
      201 year ago

      In all honesty, I will probably just tip the minimum amount and try not to let it get to me. Its not like I’ll be out eating by myself anyway, there will be plenty of social pressure to help me along :)

      But imagine if all jobs worked this way. Oh, you wanted a good outcome for your surgery? Maybe you should have tipped your surgeon! Oh, you wanted your taxes done correctly? Should have tipped! Sorry boss, I would have gotten you that report on time, but you forgot to leave me a tip!

      I also think its silly that tips are based on the price of your meal, as if that has anything to do with the service whatsoever. So the person who ordered a steak pays more in a tip than the person who ordered a salad? Why? It would make way more sense to tip based on time spent in the establishment. I would understand a standard 5$ tip per half-hour or something way more.

      • Freeman
        link
        fedilink
        221 year ago

        Here’s the thing. There are now tips added to all sorts of checkouts. And it’s muddier than ever.

        As an American I don’t tip shit unless it’s a full service restaurant. Aka they are refilling my drinks for me.

        If I’m getting a sandwich at a sandwich line where you stand in line and call out what ingrediants you want and take it to go, I don’t tip. If I’m just getting a coffee black, I’m not tipping. Etc etc.

        The checkouts now though ask for tips on all sorts of stuff. I increasingly refuse to tip for things like self service places, takeout, etc.

        • @[email protected]
          link
          fedilink
          101 year ago

          This is it. There is a kind of understood, cultural part that some of the other commenters are missing.

          There are situations where (traditionally) tipping is expected, and that is at a sit down style restaurant or at a bar. If the restaurant requires you to fill your own drink, bus your own table (clear the dishes), or carry your own food typically Americans do not tip (this would apply to most fast food places, or places as you’ve described where you walk up to a counter). Do most of these places still put out a tip jar? Yes. Do most customers tip? Probably not (check the jar, it might have some token coins or a few dollar bills in it, but it will not be full).

          Are you an asshole for not tipping? That depends on what the situation is. Did you just sit down for a 2 hour meal with 10 people and leave $5? Yes you are an asshole. Did you drive through Starbucks or a burger place and not put a couple bucks in jar? You are probably not an asshole.

        • @[email protected]
          link
          fedilink
          51 year ago

          I hate tipping culture but I’m not going to take it out on workers. My personal rule of thumb is if someone is bringing me something or performing a service for me then I tip.

          For example, I will tip at a restaurant where they bring things out, for a haircut, for cutting my grass, or for delivery services (food or grocery). I will not tip for counter service (except for the taco truck down the street, but they’re dirt cheap, and I may round up my bill at other food trucks), bakeries, stores (a few small ones without their own POS are using systems that have tip lines enabled by default), or gift shops.

      • @solstice
        link
        111 year ago

        Yeah like the other guy said, I only tip if it’s a sit down restaurant with an actual server who attended to you. If you are checking out somewhere and the kiosk thing prompts for a tip, I almost never do.

        Always tip the cab driver a few bucks.

        If you are at a hotel you should tip the valet for parking. Honestly though at hotels, tipping pays for itself. Hotel staff are demigods that can bestow good fortune if they smile upon you, so you definitely want to appease them. It’s amazing what slipping a $20 to the person checking you in can do for you.

        When in doubt, you can just ask candidly what the etiquette is. Everyone knows its weird and different everywhere.

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        31 year ago

        Well, I get your general point though tipping at a restaurant doesn’t quite work like that. You don’t get crappy service as a result of not tipping; you tip at the end of the service.

        I tip 20% no matter how dismal the service, which is not the norm here. People have bad days and I don’t want to financially penalize them on top of it. It just feels shitty.

      • @JoshuaEN
        link
        21 year ago

        I think of tipping waitstaff as just being part of the actual cost of the meal (which is why it is based on the bill, everything on the menu is actually priced lower than it would be without tipping). Optimally, that and the tax would both be part of the listed price, but alas that’s not the case.

        Why is this done? I figure it’s because it lowers the perceived cost at the time of ordering, which makes people spend more.

    • @eric5949
      link
      41 year ago

      Until people stop tipping for bullshit we don’t need to tip for, like all the card readers the last couple years that have added tip buttons for just paying for literally anything, those laws will not get passed. Why would they when customers just will pay employees wages?

  • circuitfarmer
    link
    fedilink
    261 year ago

    I’d say yes. The situation is complex.

    It’s clear that tipping culture is out of control. There are many places asking for 20% tips even when ordering from a counter where the interaction takes about 10 seconds.

    Unfortunately there has also been a systematic underpayment of wages which has occurred largely on the back of tips. In some states it is even legal to pay less than minimum wage and supplement that with tips. For that reason, it’s not really an option to simply not tip without being the bad guy.

    Certainly the system needs to change, but as of this moment in the US, just assume everything actually costs 20% more and tip.

    • BrainisfineIthink
      link
      fedilink
      131 year ago

      it’s not really an option to simply not tip without being the bad guy

      My man you have got to shake this from your psyche, that’s exactly how the employers that aren’t paying their employees want you to feel. You’re offloading their greed and systematic exploitation of working class people onto yourself under the misplaced guise of personal guilt. There may not a way to immediately fix the problem, but I can guarantee it will never get fixed if we dont change anything.

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        51 year ago

        In some cases we’re talking about people making $2.13 an hour in a country where you’re easily paying $1,000 a month or even more for a studio apartment. I’d say if you don’t tip you’re the bad guy.

        This type of change isn’t going to come from people just deciding that waitstaff should starve and refusing to tip. If anything it will come from unionization of waitstaff or from legislation.

        • BrainisfineIthink
          link
          fedilink
          11 year ago

          I mean, in a lot of ways it already is. More and more people aren’t taking theses jobs that pay shit, and yours constantly seeing places fold or be understaffed. It’s also a little disingenuous to use the extreme as an example. The vast majority of tourist destinations (relevant because OP) are not paying below minimum+ tips. It would be helpful if OP Said where they were going but assuming it’s a popular destination, they don’t need to be heavy handed. It’s also misleading to paint it as black and white “assume tipping 20%” everywhere is bad advice. There is no expectation to tip for over the counter service, take out, etc. That is a fairly recent evolution and one that is already backfiring. If OP isn’t sitting down in a restaurant where they have a server waiting on them for 30-60 minutes, they are probably absolutely fine not tipping. 15% is also still acceptable, 20% is excessive unless the service was absolutely excellent.

        • TWeaK
          link
          fedilink
          01 year ago

          No, the bad guy is still the employer, and the culture that exploits both employees and customers and pits them against one another.

          Meals in the US are not cheaper than meals in other countries. The menu price is roughly the same. Meals plus tips in the US cost significantly more than meals in other countries.

          However staff generally benefit from this arrangement. Places that have trialed better wages and no tips have found that staff make less than what they did if they got tips. So only the customer actually wants a fair deal out of it, and everyone else isn’t willing to change.

          • @utopianfiat
            link
            11 year ago

            It’s actually not necessarily the employer’s fault- if they don’t own the restaurant (and most don’t) the commercial landlord can force them to hire at tipped wage because they likely have a revenue sharing agreement.

      • @utopianfiat
        link
        31 year ago

        The correct way to change this is by abolishing the tipped wage, not by starving waitstaff

        • Arcaneslime
          link
          fedilink
          21 year ago

          He’s suggesting “fuck the worker, it isn’t my problem if they can’t pay rent, they should learn to code.” And somehow that will make the business owner pay them a fair wage and not replace them with a machine or a 16yo kid.

    • @[email protected]
      link
      fedilink
      111 year ago

      just assume everything actually costs 20% more and tip.

      And by “everything”, you mean “not actually everything, but you’d need a 400 page manual to describe what gets tipped and what doesn’t”.

    • TWeaK
      link
      fedilink
      11 year ago

      In most states it’s legal to pay less than minimum wage (literally around $2 per hour) for workers who get tips.

      One issue is that workers generally make more money off tips than if they just got minimum wage. So it’s not just employers that are unwilling to change.

  • @[email protected]
    link
    fedilink
    251 year ago

    Definitely tip. If you think the whole system sucks that’s fine, but don’t take out that frustration on the likely vastly underpaid employees

    • The Quuuuuill
      link
      fedilink
      111 year ago

      You enter a social compact when you enter an establishment that does tipping. When you don’t tip, you’re not making it better, your making sure someone goes hungry

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        11 year ago

        if:
        a. a person “has” to rely on other people to tip them
        b. said person goes “hungry” if a single person/table doesn’t tip them

        you… uh… have other issues to think about

        • The Quuuuuill
          link
          fedilink
          51 year ago

          Like that our entire economic system is broken in such a way that this is a thing that happens? Yes. At the restaurant is not the time to get on your soapbox, and the exploited service provider you’re refusing the tip is not the person to be taking it out on

          • @[email protected]
            link
            fedilink
            01 year ago

            and are these exploited people doing anything to change this? the consumer is the last between the three (employer, worker, consumer) that should have anger directed towards them

            as it’s their issue its their soapbox not mine, this annoying custom made it to country where they are paid enough as well

  • @[email protected]
    link
    fedilink
    241 year ago

    Here, unfortunately, YTA if you don’t tip. I forgot once and had the server run after me to make sure something wasn’t wrong. Some service folks take it personally if you don’t tip, which makes sense given that their employers don’t pay them shit. So yeah, you the customer foot the bill for ensuring these people can make ends meet… as if giving the restaurant your custom wasn’t support enough.

    The problem is that, like most other industries here in the US, the system is rigged against the working class. While not all restaurant owners intend to fuck over their staff (especially smaller, local places), it’s how it works. Now, some places will automatically add gratuity to your bill under certain conditions, so check your breakdown to ensure it’s not already included. This is becoming more common, which irritates me since I scale my tip based on the quality of the service rendered.

    Also, we know it’s expensive here. Don’t bother coming here to complain about it, we do it enough ourselves. Tipping is here to stay for now and I don’t imagine it changing for quite some time.

    • Stovetop
      link
      fedilink
      321 year ago

      Just to add onto this good answer, you are really only expected to tip for sit-down restaurants with service and bars.

      For takeout, cafes, fast food, etc., you don’t need to tip. A lot of places these have payment machines that just ask if you want to tip by default. You can safely hit “No tip” on these if you don’t want to.

      Ostensibly it’s just to replace the tip jar for those who don’t use cash, but the prompt appearing every time you pay by card has convinced a lot of people that tipping is what you’re supposed to do in those situations, when in reality you have no obligation to.

  • @[email protected]
    link
    fedilink
    221 year ago

    Yes, you do have to tip. Maybe not if it’s Chipotle or a place like that. But if someone is waiting your table you have to tip. Yes tipping culture is stupid. No, nothing has changed in the US. They do not have a living without tips, so refusing to tip cuts into their living expenses after they have courteously served you your food. It’s rude

    • bappity
      link
      fedilink
      01 year ago

      trouble is that by tipping you are enforcing tipping culture, giving the employers an excuse to underpay. You can’t win…

      • mintyfrog
        link
        fedilink
        51 year ago

        Tipping culture comes from minimum wage laws. Laws need to change before culture could change.

        • @inverimus
          link
          1
          edit-2
          1 year ago

          Technically, if an employee’s tips plus hourly wage do not meet the minimum hourly wage the employer is required to make up the difference. The problem is the minimum wage is so low in most places that protesting the culture by not tipping would still make it impossible for the worker to live.

      • @[email protected]
        link
        fedilink
        21 year ago

        Yeah, but you can change that by going to the rare places that have a no tipping policy. Don’t just refuse to tip servers knowing that that’s the only way they get paid.

      • @utopianfiat
        link
        21 year ago

        Refusing to tip wouldn’t change this because the dark secret is that employers wouldn’t pay living wages even if they wanted to. Unilaterally raising your costs without an associated raise in profit is a big no-no unless you own the restaurant’s property. Commercial landlords have a lot of say in how your business is run because they often have revenue sharing agreements.

  • Rootiest
    link
    fedilink
    English
    191 year ago

    Yes you need to tip if you are at a sit-down restaurant with a server taking your order at the table.

    Whether or not you or anyone else agrees with that, it is the cultural norm and you would absolutely be rude not to.

    If you are uncomfortable with this, choose to eat somewhere where you won’t be expected to tip. Don’t knowingly go to a restaurant where tipping is expected and then refuse to do so out of principle.

    • TWeaK
      link
      fedilink
      English
      81 year ago

      Also tipping at bars is generally expected.

  • Derrek
    link
    fedilink
    181 year ago

    To sum up, if you work in a business that relies on tips, you will defend the crap out of tipping and will be biased towards tipping uncontrollably.

    If you are a business that wants to squeeze every penny, you will encourage and propaganda tipping as much as you can.

    If you are anyone else you will wish for something different.

    I recommend that you tip when the app says to tip, just simplify your life and if a screen says add a tip choose the minimum for now and don’t worry about it yet.

    • @[email protected]
      link
      fedilink
      11 year ago

      Tipping used to be a way to implement a truly granular free market (or however you want to justify it, that’s besides the point). Point being is, it’s how service workers largely get paid. So regardless of how we got here, to not tip them is to not pay them fairly for their work. The problem now is that commerces turn tipping on by default at point of sale devices indiscriminately. So tipping when you see the screen is poor advise as it just gives into greed and manipulation. Follow the original rule: you tip when there is personalised service rendered, for example restaurant waiter, or driver, or barber or hair dresser. If it is neither personalised, nor a service rendered by an individual, you never tip.

  • @[email protected]
    link
    fedilink
    181 year ago

    Yep, 100% the asshole if you’re eating out at restaurants here and you don’t tip. Other things can be a little more debatable, but the 15-20% standard for eating at a restaurant is set in stone. If you don’t tip or give a low tip, the server will assume you hated their service or that you’re just an ass. It’s a dumb rule, but it is what it is here right now.

  • @[email protected]
    link
    fedilink
    181 year ago

    American here. Here’s the three common contexts for tipping. Everything else is something someone’s trying to make a thing rather than actually a thing:

    1. Restaurants: If someone is bringing food from the Kitchen to your table

    2. Delivery: If someone’s delivering food. Or they’re personally delivering groceries.

    3. Transportation: If someone’s driving you personally. Like a Taxi.

    Some say you should tip bathroom attendants. I’ve never even seen a bathroom attendant, but that seems like such a bizarre job to tip for, even by American standards.

    • @[email protected]
      link
      fedilink
      91 year ago

      Bartenders are a case that you’ve missed. A standard cash rate is $1 per drink. Bartenders have a lot of leeway when it comes to how quickly you’re served, and how strong your drinks will be, so tipping well may be in your interest.

    • @Albatr0ss
      link
      11 year ago

      What about the driver of a free hotel shuttle to and from the airport, shared with others?

      I had this situation last time I was in the states and I wasn’t sure, so I just did what others did, which was to not tip. But I felt a bit bad after, like maybe I should have? And if I should have, how much would be appropriate?